Glitch in Summertime?

[turkey_creek]

WOW!!

Great report, Trips.

I only had time to do a very short check, and the 2 plums showed in the first 2 columns 25x/50 spins. 50%.

casino Villento.

Fun game, some good hits, but, be sure to change games when you are ahead.

[LRDell]

I have been paying attention to my play at other casinos on Summertime and have been noticing the same pattern. So if it is a glitch it is on the Microgaming side, and not the specific casino. It sure does knock out the possibility of other characters (potentially higher paying), which already come up less frequently, to hit.

50% is absolutely rediculous. That may be isolated, but it seems that most of us are running in the 33% range. If only the same thing was happening with cherries, since they pay off on two reels!

[vinylweatherman]

I have been paying attention to my play at other casinos on Summertime and have been noticing the same pattern. So if it is a glitch it is on the Microgaming side, and not the specific casino. It sure does knock out the possibility of other characters (potentially higher paying), which already come up less frequently, to hit.

50% is absolutely rediculous. That may be isolated, but it seems that most of us are running in the 33% range. If only the same thing was happening with cherries, since they pay off on two reels!

Time for a plum count then, if MG are not "cheating", then there should be significantly more plums than other symbols on the two reels, such that the probability of two plums turning up matches the experience.

[tim5ny]

Sometimes the reels are "weighted" so to speak... so that the lesser symbols are more likely to appear more often, and the higher paying symbols are more obscure. I don't believe this is cheating, but rather a way of setting the payback odds on a reel machine.

[vinylweatherman]

Sometimes the reels are "weighted" so to speak... so that the lesser symbols are more likely to appear more often, and the higher paying symbols are more obscure. I don't believe this is cheating, but rather a way of setting the payback odds on a reel machine.

Weighting is applied to the 3 reel slots, however it should not be happening on a video slot as these operate by having very large reel bands. Indeed, when Zoozie came up with an analysis program for Thunderstruck, it turned out that reels 4 and 5 were longer than the first three reels, hence any weighting is done by clever symbol allignment, and padding reels with low paying symbols. Zoozie simulated the Thunderstruck reels for a large numner of unweighted spins, and came out with a return of 95%, which is in line with expectations.
It would be "cheating" if MG fundamentally changed the way the slots worked such that the return could be "tweaked" by weighting, something MG go to considerable lengths to deny, and something that is accepted as possible for RTG slots that can have their returns altered by the operators (while they don't like to admit it, this is stated as fact on the Wizard of Odds site, and he did act as a consultant to RTG in the past, and should know)

[lojo]

Do MicroGaming have equal dispersal of symbols on reels 1 thru 5? I haven't charted but my gut, and reel memory, tell me different. Elementals, for example, seems to be in the 2/1 range [no, i don't pay more attention when the sounds happen
Of course it makes sense that if there are more symbols or virtual stops on a 3rd 4th or 5th reel the symbol will appear less often.
I do believe MG when they assert that reel 1 does not influence reel 3/4/5
The number of 'virtual stops' on a reel, in my understanding, is the ONLY relationship between the program and the RNG in a fair slot game.
I could have this all wrong, but I've been able to sleep nights since I came to this conclusion. I don't mind the sugar plums dancing in my head all night it's better than counting sheep. please clarify if I am all wet here. thx

[Zoozie]

Sometimes the reels are "weighted" so to speak... so

Weighting is applied to the 3 reel slots, however it should not be happening on a video slot as these operate by having very large reel bands.

As Vinylweatherman says there is no weighting for MG 5-reel slots.
And it is not hard to prove statistically. The reels normally have from 30 to 40 symbols each. And you can simply just write down each spin and see if each position shows the expected number of times.

For instance if there is 1 scatter on a reel with 30 symbols, then the scatter
on that reel will visible on that reel excactly 1/10 of the times(3 symbols visible). And I have checked this statistically and it is indeed true. And I believe there is no doubt about amoung regular MG players that scatters indeed show up according to this. The reason I took the scatter symbol as
an example is because most reel only have 1 scatter symbol. You can do the same with any symbol, but have to take into account how many times it is on that reel.

But interestingly (for me at least) I am not sure this is true for RTG slots, since then I can not explain how they can change payout% (unless they also change the reels). But for most other software providers this is the way
5-reel slots work and they were created precisely to address this. Working this way by design you could say.

Zoozie

[KasinoKing]

Do MicroGaming have equal dispersal of symbols on reels 1 thru 5? I haven't charted but my gut, and reel memory, tell me different. Elementals, for example, seems to be in the 2/1 range [no, i don't pay more attention when the sounds happen
Of course it makes sense that if there are more symbols or virtual stops on a 3rd 4th or 5th reel the symbol will appear less often.
I do believe MG when they assert that reel 1 does not influence reel 3/4/5
The number of 'virtual stops' on a reel, in my understanding, is the ONLY relationship between the program and the RNG in a fair slot game.
I could have this all wrong, but I've been able to sleep nights since I came to this conclusion. I don't mind the sugar plums dancing in my head all night it's better than counting sheep. please clarify if I am all wet here. thx

You might find this post (and the rest of the thread) interesting...

http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...ties#post87305