Bonuses not all they are cracked up to be!

[WAYLANDER]

Ok im pretty new to the online casino thing..so any thoughts would be good.
I have signed up at a couple of casinos and claimed the welcome bonuses.
In my search for a good bonus i have come accross some truly awfull ones!
Alot of them look good when you see them, but when you get down to the T&Cs some are just plain rediculous!
The way i see it is that each game has a H/A % , so if the smallest H/A game the terms allow you to play is 2.5% ( 3 card/ war i believe are roughly this ) any bonus where you have to wager more than 40 times the bonus ( 40x2.5=100 ) is a expected loss!
So what i have found is that what alot of these bonuses do is ( if you accept them ) to make you play a game that you might not usually play and once you have wagered a rediculous amount ( 180x i have seen ) you are still expected to lose!
Unless you were going to play that game anyway..WHY BOTHER!!
I understand the need to restrict the low risk ( black/red roulette etc ) games, and to insist on certain W/Rs, but some are well out of order!
And on top of this if you get lucky there are some places that would label you a bonus abuser.. what a joke!
In my opinion to attract new customers they should offer a reasonable bonus which you dont need a degree to understand the conditions , where you can play most games that you enjoy and where you are expected to make some profit out of the bonus!
Otherwise dont offer one.
And to just accept that they will get some bonus chasers!
Alot of the bigger names offer an acceptable bonus, and im sure this is why they are big names!
Im not saying that they should just give money away, but the way some sites advertise their " AMAZING " bonus you would think they are..but when it comes down to the nitty gritty the T&Cs are just one big trap for the uneducated punter, and even then the W/Rs mean you are expected to lose the bonus plus deposit anyway!
Well i have gone on enough for my 1st post....was wondering if others felt the same.

[Slotster!]

Firstly - welcome aboard!

Secondly - They should do away with 'welcome' bonuses altogether, and consistently reward loyal regular players on an ongoing basis. If the whole industry suddenly agreed to drop them one day, the whole industry would become a much better place... Someone should make it happen at one of the big events.

Of course the games/wr etc put it back in the casino's favour... it's a casino after all.. they're in the business of making money. I see all bonuses as a bit more 'fun' time, where I might hit the big one - never an opportunity to make a bit of money grinding out the wagering requirements!..

[vinylweatherman]

Any newcomer expecting to make money out of welcome bonuses needs to think again. Even in 2004 when I began to play, bonuses were not what they were in the early days. Professional bonus chasers tend to hit any slackness hard, and it is hard for anyone to make money out of bonuses.
I tend to look for long term value, and pay little attention to whether the welcome bonus is a mere £50 or an enormous £200+. I have seen much heated debate about the various traps, and how they are sprung, and often it is the new player who tries to harvest their first bonus (having been told how "easy" it is), that gets hit. The real professionals will turn down a bonus they see as unbeatable, and will take those they believe they have a chance on. Often, this involves dedicating hours of study and play to harvest under $50.
My favourites now sre those that offer decent events long term, give decent bonuses to long term players, don't treat you badly if you get a bit lucky, and are tolerant of the occasional mistake.

If you are looking for bonuses with clear and easy terms I would suggest looking at the MG casinos that offer the new "EZbonus system". This allows play on all games, has a bubble that shows how much bonus money is still to be earned through wagering, and allows a cash-in at any point with any remaining bonus money voided. Cryptologic also have a wagering system that is easy to cope with. While there are excluded games, they will only take the bonus away from players who abuse the system that allows your own money to be taken out at any time. The Cryptologic cashier allows you to find out exactly how much needs to be wagered to clear the bonus.

Some casino groups have a reputation of using "bonus abuse" as an excuse to confiscate winnings even where players have not broken any of the terms. There are also a number of casinos that will confiscate any winnings where terms have been breached on a bonus, while there are others that will simply refuse the withdrawal till enough has been wagered, or will just confiscate the bonus amount.

Many allow players to refuse the welcome bonus if they just want to play without any restrictions, and normally long term bonuses are less restrictive.

Good Luck, but don't believe all those tales about it being easy to make money by hitting bonuses.

[Macgyver]

Any newcomer expecting to make money out of welcome bonuses needs to think again. Even in 2004 when I began to play, bonuses were not what they were in the early days. Professional bonus chasers tend to hit any slackness hard, and it is hard for anyone to make money out of bonuses.

Good Luck, but don't believe all those tales about it being easy to make money by hitting bonuses.

All I'm going to say is that if you're very disciplined, you can make steady money playing with bonuses. This is from first-hand experience for almost 3 years now. I'm not the only one who does this, I know KasinoKing does it too.

I'm not surprised so few people talk about playing with bonuses here, much less winning, as it seems the vocal majority are so against them.

[vinylweatherman]

I did mean hard for the newbie. Experienced players have an advantage as they know what is all hype and what represents a good deal. Many good bonus players do not play like ones either, and can keep out of the audit process. Much of the problem for newbies are the various sites and eBooks that give out the "standard methods", the ones that casinos notice because hundreds see them, sign up, and the casino spots something is up and audits the accounts. The problem is not in getting the method right, but in having the fruits confiscated and deposit returned.
KasinoKing has a good method, although the absolute amounts gained are not large, they are consistent. The value of individual bonuses, even when played well, are not all that good.
Personally, I believe the best method is to play long term at a good casino that provides regular players with bonuses of equal or greater value than the sign-up. Winnings from these bonuses are less likely to be subject to accusations of abuse because you are a long term player. The worst that seems to happen is that the offers dry up if you have a prolonged good spell.

[bpb]

All I'm going to say is that if you're very disciplined, you can make steady money playing with bonuses. This is from first-hand experience for almost 3 years now. I'm not the only one who does this, I know KasinoKing does it too.

I'm not surprised so few people talk about playing with bonuses here, much less winning, as it seems the vocal majority are so against them.

With all the restrictions on games now, you probably only have an expectation of about $10,000 across all of the reputable sign on bonuses. Various reloads and monthlys might net you another few thousand a month.

Doesn't really seem worth it for all the hassle.

[soflat]

In my opinion to attract new customers they should offer a reasonable bonus which you dont need a degree to understand the conditions , where you can play most games that you enjoy and where you are expected to make some profit out of the bonus!
Otherwise dont offer one.

What are you saying? That they should just give away money?

...Im not saying that they should just give money away, but the way some sites advertise their " AMAZING " bonus you would think they are..but when it comes down to the nitty gritty the T&Cs are just one big trap for the uneducated punter, and even then the W/Rs mean you are expected to lose the bonus plus deposit anyway!

In the casinos' view, the bonuses are intended to stretch your gambling dollar and extend your playing time.

I don't think that a -EV bonus is a trap necessarily, because if they played without a bonus they would lose too. So what is the difference?

And I wouldn't assume they are uneducated. Maybe they just like to play slots and other games. In fact they could be highly educated and have money to spend.

[KasinoKing]

All I'm going to say is that if you're very disciplined, you can make steady money playing with bonuses. This is from first-hand experience for almost 3 years now. I'm not the only one who does this, I know KasinoKing does it too.

You know it makes sense!

[Vesuvio]

KK, I want to weep when I look at your site and see all the money you've thrown away by not playing the best games

In the casinos' view, the bonuses are intended to stretch your gambling dollar and extend your playing time.

That's the li(n)e in the terms and conditions. The real appeal is that the lure of "free money" attracts players while the terms tied to the bonus mean the average player hasn't got a hope in hell of ever withdrawing even if they get a decent win while playing. It's almost a perfect deal for the casinos, though bonus hunters cream off some of the profits, bless their little socks

[nielsenj]

Bunus Hunting is surely not as profitable as it used to be. It is no longer "easy money". In 2000-2001 when I started playing at online casino there were easy money to be made. The welcome bonuses had the same size in percentage as now but the wagering requirements were much lower (8, 4 and even 2x was not uncommon) and the amount of excluded games were also lower.

Online casinos have adapted their bonus offers to the behaviour of players and the result is that welcome bonuses have become less attractive. In the future I think more online casinos will focus more on offering attractive bonuses on player's subsequent deposits instead of offering generous welcome bonuses. I think we will see more casinos that adapt the to a bonus policy like the one at Bodog where you are offered a 10% bonus on all deposits.