PokerStars

[Nazareth]

Anyone play there? Any comments Good Bad or otherwise?

 

[largeeyes]

Might want to try the poker forum. Down the hall, first door on the right.

 

[webber286]

In general people seem to like PokerStars. A more competitive level of play compared with a PartyPoker, more on the level of Ultimate Bet.

 

[Nazareth]

Played it for a Couple of hours last night- Very nice. The Hands seemed very random & none of that 8 straight straights in a row like pokerroom gives. I really like pokerroom's software- better that pokerstar's, but pokerstars isn'r as 'patterned' as pokerroom. Everyone at the table was winning hands unlike pokerroom's where certain seats would win consistantly- I wish pokerstars would adopt software similiar to pokerroom's though.

 

[KasinoKing]

PokerStars was the first room I ever used - but something turned me off it.
The software was not the best - dunno if it's changed in the last 2-years..?

For absolutely the most fun you can have with your clothes on: True Poker!
(Best software by blinking MILES! )

For loads of non-stop action, with 20,000 + opponents: Empire Poker

These are my current favorites.

 

[deezamn]

Played it for a Couple of hours last night- Very nice. The Hands seemed very random & none of that 8 straight straights in a row like pokerroom gives. I really like pokerroom's software- better that pokerstar's, but pokerstars isn'r as 'patterned' as pokerroom. Everyone at the table was winning hands unlike pokerroom's where certain seats would win consistantly- I wish pokerstars would adopt software similiar to pokerroom's though.

No offense to you personally, but people like "you" should not be playing poker online if you have feelings like that (ie, there are "lucky" seats, "patterned hands".)

Why would online poker rooms want to kill the golden cash cow they currently have going for them? Online poker is not rigged, fixed, and does not favor certain players over others. The sooner you begin to recognize this, the more you'll enjoy playing online.

 

[Nazareth]

Don't think so? Go sign up for pokerroom and then sign up for pokerstars- play both for about a week- I'm telling you that I have been testing this at pokerroom- this isn't simply coincidence. I'm not saying it's 100% sure- but my gosh- do like I say then report back here- I think you'll find quite a difference between the two poker places. Big difference in the number of 'straight chasers' between the two places & big difference in the number of times the straights come up on the boards between the two places- those straights I listed a few posts ago were the actual straights that kept comming up- Sign up for pokerroom and see for yourself. If I'm wrong, then I'm wrong- but it looks aweful suspicious to me at pokerroom. I value your opinion, but if you haven't played there then you don't know what I'm talking about. The original poster hasp layed there and agrees- Yes, we could be wrong- But I'm telling you that when I keep careful track of the seats that are winning, and then switch rooms & take that same seat, I start winning- consistantly- it has happened too many times to be coincidence or 'lucky streaks' on my part. The cards just keep falling in my favour when I take careful note & I'm the one that starts beating the flush with J over the 10 of the other persons hand-

Just go observe for awhile & I think you might come to the conclusion that 'maybe' somethign aint right like I have- I'm not saying there are 'lucky seats' I don't beleive in that- I am saying there may be patterns going on there

And I Am enjoying my online experience at pokerstars- Very much

 

[deezamn]

Don't think so? Go sign up for pokerroom and then sign up for pokerstars- play both for about a week-

Heh...I've played 10s of thousands of hands of hold 'em at pokerroom. And 100's of thousands of hands at other sites. The way I got into gambling at online casinos, was originally from playing poker online.

I like pokerroom and have always done rather well there. The streaks you're seeing are just a result of the # of hands you're seeing/playing an hour. You'll probably get around 30 hands dealt per hour at a casino in a live game of poker. Whereas you'll probably get 80 dealt in exactly the same game online. Since you're seeing more than twice as many hands, "streaks" like that are more than twice as likely to occur.

Glad you're enjoying it, but I found once I got over the sneaking suspicions of "something ain't right...", it's alot easier to enjoy the game, even when your cards are running cold and it seems like you'll never win another hand.

 

[bpb]

If I'm wrong, then I'm wrong-

You are wrong.

 

[Mugwump]

Don't think so? Go sign up for pokerroom and then sign up for pokerstars- play both for about a week- I'm telling you that I have been testing this at pokerroom- this isn't simply coincidence.

Naz,

I understand your concern, but you need to understand two things.

1.) The players at pokerstars are tighter than pokerroom, a LOT tighter. When you have a lot of loose players who go too far with their hands, you are going to see many more big hands. When you hit your hand though, you will win a bigger pot.

2.) You see a LOT more hands playing online than you do live. At least twice as many per hour. Because of this, you are going to see more strange events. In addition, the brain naturally tries to make sense out of these events, and detect patterns in them, which is not appropriate for random events.

I like pokerstars and pokerroom. I generally play at pokerstars and UB when I'm tired of getting clobbered by junk hands. I move back to pokerroom and party poker when I'm tired of breaking even or losing due to the rake.

Keep records at pokerstars, and move back to pokerroom for a while after you've played some good players. Check your records afterwards, I'm sure you'll see a big difference. (www.pokercharts.com is good for keeping records, and www.cardplayer.com also has a stats tracking feature, if you want to spend the money www.pokertracker.com has an excellent program to use as well)

 

[Nazareth]

alright- but just got done at pokerrookm- turned $4000 into $8500 in the 25/50 rooms moving from room to room when I ran into losing streaks- Too tired to think right now- but I'll postm ore tomorrow- that observing the winning players & then moving from room to room to find thoise open seats- I'm telling you- I'm nailing some good winnings & another quick thing here- pokerstars- you don't see people going on 'winning streaks' for as long they do in pokerroom- I'll expound moreo n that tomorrow- but it could have something to do with the looser style play.

For you pokerroom players- give it a try- it may take you a couple of moves to find the right seats because sometimes peeps will hit 2-3 hands then not hit again for a long time- but try to find the ones that are hitting about 5 out of ten then find another room with that empty seat-.

I sit in the rooms when I'm on losing streak & don't bet & just watch the players- they'll go on winning binges & it moves from person to person- they'll win 4-5 in a row- then another will win like 3, then another will win 4-5 in a row sometimes more- I dunno-

I'm not gonna dwell on it too much- but I'm tellin ya- I turned a losing play into a winning one doing exactly what I said. My gosh- in ten hours (not consecutavely but over two days) I went from about 24000 to 33 thousand a short while ago-

 

[Freudian]

Anyone play there? Any comments Good Bad or otherwise?

They are a great poker room. Excellent support and software. Many tournaments. Only drawback is that ring tables have pretty tight players.

 

[Freudian]

alright- but just got done at pokerrookm- turned $4000 into $8500 in the 25/50 rooms moving from room to room when I ran into losing streaks- Too tired to think right now- but I'll postm ore tomorrow- that observing the winning players & then moving from room to room to find thoise open seats- I'm telling you- I'm nailing some good winnings & another quick thing here- pokerstars- you don't see people going on 'winning streaks' for as long they do in pokerroom- I'll expound moreo n that tomorrow- but it could have something to do with the looser style play.

For you pokerroom players- give it a try- it may take you a couple of moves to find the right seats because sometimes peeps will hit 2-3 hands then not hit again for a long time- but try to find the ones that are hitting about 5 out of ten then find another room with that empty seat-.

I sit in the rooms when I'm on losing streak & don't bet & just watch the players- they'll go on winning binges & it moves from person to person- they'll win 4-5 in a row- then another will win like 3, then another will win 4-5 in a row sometimes more- I dunno-

I'm not gonna dwell on it too much- but I'm tellin ya- I turned a losing play into a winning one doing exactly what I said. My gosh- in ten hours (not consecutavely but over two days) I went from about 24000 to 33 thousand a short while ago-

My advice is that you don't play at those kind of stakes if you still belive in hot seats and such nonsense. You will bust out sooner rather than later. Poker is not like a casino. It is a game of skill.

 

[bpb]

For you pokerroom players- give it a try- it may take you a couple of moves to find the right seats because sometimes peeps will hit 2-3 hands then not hit again for a long time- but try to find the ones that are hitting about 5 out of ten then find another room with that empty seat-.

On the remote chance that you're actually serious ... you are the guy that the high stakes pros LOVE. I hope the money you are playing with is disposable income, because you cannot possibly be a long term winner with that mindset.

 

[Nazareth]

Bpb & freudian, I only play for fakem oney so I can't speak for thje games for real money- I been playing there for about 3 weeks now and I've been doing really well especially when I started doing what I described to do. (And yes, I even play the NL games & do well & have recently started doing even better now that I know how not to get sucked into raising wars which was my downfall when I first started)

Look- I know you have your doubts- all I'm saying is if you play there- give it a try- it will take some work on your part & you might take awhile to find the right seats. Here's what will happen- You'll see a seat or two hitting, but they are what I call short term hitters- they'll win like 3-5 hands, and then shut off for a long time- perhaps picking up 2-3 more hands in an hour or so-. I've sat there and watched (And, been victim of) players hit a couple of hands, and then get teaser hand after teaser hand after teaser hand for over an hour- all the while certain seats will be winning coinsistantly- Beleive me- I'm playing there for like 6 hours straight- sometimes more every day.

Look for the seats that hit like 4-5 hands, then miss a couple, then hit a couple more hands-= then switch rooms and get in that same seat- IF you have been on a losing streak, I think you're going to find that if you find the right seat, you're going to staret winning- I've had nights when I started winning and almost could not lose- but only after doing what I described. All of sudden I was the one gewtting the cards that were beating the straights by one card, beating the flushes by the higher card etc..

Go to any other poker site & watch- you won't find certain seats hitting 4-5 in a row as consistantly as you do in pokerroom and yo7u certainly won't see as many consecutive strights and teaser flops. What you will see is more people folding on the flop instead of getting dragged into betting right up to the river.

In poker room- watch the guy in white shirt on left, girl in red dress, and girl in blue dress- they seem to be the ones that hit most consistantly- other seats will have their runs, but in the long run, these three seem to be most consistant. You'll have to watch the old lady though- she can really go on tears. The guy in tux does well too & if you can get his seat at the right time- you'll do well. Thing is, you'll have to be vigilent & watch & you';ll have to be quick when switching rooms- the seats will hit for 4-5 hands then stop for a bit, then hit some more- don't stay in the seat if you haven't hit for several hands though- if you do- you're apt to be waiting (and spending) alot of money waiting for the seat to get hot

I wish- truly wish this wasn't the case- I really like the pokerroom software alot & just want a truly random game & beleive me, I'm not happy about finding htis out- I really wanted to like this site- I mean I stil do, but I have my suspicions at this point & it's based on what I've been seeing and trying myself.

Freudian wrote "My advice is that you don't play at those kind of stakes if you still belive in hot seats and such nonsense. You will bust out sooner rather than later. Poker is not like a casino. It is a game of skill."

Normally freudian, that is excellent advice- however- not for pokerroom- I've been doing thius for long enough that I'm noticing a pattern there and have been taking advantage of it- proffitably I might add. You think it's nonsense? Then all I can say is either give it a try, or don't beleive me. I mean my gosh- you mention skill- and you're right- But who in their right mind would hold an 8c-2s after a raise and still end up winning enough times tro suggest that something definately isn't right? You find the right seats in pokerroom and I'm telling you that you can do this on a consistant enough basis that it will convince you something is askew.. Just for giggles- one night I'm going to write down all the crappy hands I play and win on and keep track of seats. I'm also going to keep track of the other's seats and write down how many times in a row they hit over the course of a night.

Beleive me- I do NOT play this way in other casinos- but at poker room- I've namaged to- in the course of 8 days, turn $1000 into $33,000- Yes, you heard me right- 8 days- in just ten hours- I made nearly 10,000- I'm nbot trying to brag here- I'm really not a very skilled player- I'm simply trying to point out something is amiss at pokerrroom & I think I've discovered what. I really wish it wasn't true, but I have my doubts.

 

[Mugwump]

The play money tables at most sites are little more than a lottery, as most players see little reason to fold.

If you are really interested in poker, Nazereth, you might want to consider making a small ($25) deposit at pokerstars, and play at their micro limit tables. I think they have tables going down to .05/.10 stakes. Still loose, but you might learn more about the game.

 

[Freudian]

You can't compare play money with real money play. Even at micro-limits the play is much better than on play money tables.

And I don't for a second think Poker Room isn't dealing a fair game. Unlike casinos there is absolutely no incentive to do so. The poker rooms makes money by being fair. What you probably have experienced is short term luck and variance. It happens to everyone who plays poker.

But if you are convinced you have a full proof way to win money on Poker Room, you probably should desposit some money and make a million.

Btw, I made $1000 in play money into $90000 on pokerstars in one afternoon while goofing off with my friends. No hot seats or anything was needed. Just the abysmal play on playmoney tables.

 

[bpb]

I'm really not a very skilled player- I'm simply trying to point out something is amiss at pokerrroom & I think I've discovered what. I really wish it wasn't true, but I have my doubts.

I would recommend depositing as much money as possible and hit the 10/20 tables with your system. Be sure to come back and let us know how it goes.

 

[Nazareth]

Bp you can make fun all you like- but I just came back from poker room- played for 2 1/2 hour and started with $7500- I now have $12700-- Eiuther don't beleive me or not- Try it or just sit there wityhout knowing what I'm talking about because of lack of experience, and doubt and make fun- I don't care

As for you others- yes- I realize the money tables are different & the play is different- that doesn't however account for the seats getting hot- that isn't skill- that's pattern- I've stated I can't speak for the money rooms- just the fake money rooms. I'd start an account just to check it out- but I live in state where it's illegal so I gotta stick to play money-

Let me show you what my last room was like- I wrote down the winning seats as they hit each round- I sat in the seat of the guy with suspenders- I'll label the people like this

S=Suspender man
T=Tux man
W=white shirt man
R=Red dress girl
BD=Blue dress girl
O=Old lady
AA=Afro american man
C=Cigar guy]
H=Guy with the hat
J=Woman in jogging suit.

Now- Her is the run down of the wins per round

H, H, S, S, W, S, S, BD, S, C, W, W, W, S, S, J, W, BD, S, H, AA, S, R, C, W, J, O, C, J,-

It stopped hitting for Suspender guy, so I left

Here's another room when I first went in today- I was the woman in Red Dress cuz there were no open seats

W, R, C, R, R, S, AA, S, C, R, S, R, R, C, W, R, C, W,

then she quit hitting so I moved to another room to the white shirt guy which I hit a couple more thne tried another room but didn't do well- I missed the seat- here's how that room played out

AA, C, H, H, H, J, R, W, S, W,, J, H, H, H, S, S, W, S, AA, H, S, H.

I was getting clobbered by the guy in hat- He was beating my straights and flushes consistantly

This goes on all night- & these guys aren't winning with low hands either- they're getting the cards- Even when they get do get crap, they still win?

Freudian- this isn't short term- I'm seeing this night after night after night- As I said- I've been playing for awhile now & was consistanly losing until I started to suspect something wasn't right- I mean gosh- I went on an 8 hour losing streak one night- Had to go bacvk to refill my account twice- I just could not get the cards to drop right- Since discovering this thoguuhg- I haven't had to refill again because I'm simply not losing like I was before.

This isn't some 'lucky system' I'm talking about here- there really does seem to be some kind of patterns going on. How many rooms have you guys played in where people are winning as consistantly as what I posted above? Usually it's pretty random & spread out over the table- someone might get lucky and have a few good hands- but my gosh not as consdistantly as that

 

[ToucanSam]

This forum is great !
I played play money to warm up before i joined a few places but since you can deposit as little as 10.00-15.00 US in some , play on 10-20c or 25-50c tables and have a lot of fun win or lose.

I think any software can be tweaked or have a special plugin written so theres always the potential for it and its good to be vigilant but i agree with Mugwump and Deexamn that generally those variables they mentioned are whats at play.


man im slow that post wasnt the when i started mine

 

[Nazareth]

Well, I wish you guys would try it out- I know i aint crtazy here- just for fun- but if you normally just play for real money, don't play the fake money rooms for too long- it'll affect your real money play style- I find myself getting a bit careless at times- the games are real loose. People will play (And even raise a 2-9 offsuit it's so bad)

I'm gonna go on again tonight later & keep track of the seats that win again-

Also- if one of you don't mind- perhaps keep track of the seats that win where you play (If you play in fake money rooms at all?) Just curious how the two would stack up- When I play at pokerstars- you never see the amounts of runs there that you do at pokerroom. One guy mentioned pokerstars is more 'tight' but I think they can be just as loose in the fake money rooms- that's where I play & tyhat seems to b4e my experience- games are just as fast- infact, they're a bit faster there - so I'm playing about the same number of hands- I'll try it out tonight or tomorrow night just to be sure though.

 

[winbig]

Well, I wish you guys would try it out- I know i aint crtazy here- just for fun- but if you normally just play for real money, don't play the fake money rooms for too long- it'll affect your real money play style- I find myself getting a bit careless at times- the games are real loose. People will play (And even raise a 2-9 offsuit it's so bad)

I'm gonna go on again tonight later & keep track of the seats that win again-

Also- if one of you don't mind- perhaps keep track of the seats that win where you play (If you play in fake money rooms at all?) Just curious how the two would stack up- When I play at pokerstars- you never see the amounts of runs there that you do at pokerroom. One guy mentioned pokerstars is more 'tight' but I think they can be just as loose in the fake money rooms- that's where I play & tyhat seems to b4e my experience- games are just as fast- infact, they're a bit faster there - so I'm playing about the same number of hands- I'll try it out tonight or tomorrow night just to be sure though.

One word will describe this in full: Superstition.

Fake money tables *anywhere* are a joke. You have people (99% kids probably) that go all in every hand no matter what. If anyone actually thinks they can hone their skills on the play money tables, they're in for a surprise lol...you'd be better off buying a poker game for yourself and playing it on your computer.

What it all comes down to, you're trying to find a pattern in a RNG that just isn't there.

[edit]

And like it was mentioned before, if you're so sure of this theory, why not make a real money deposit and try it out? I'd say start off with $4500, and if you're right, you'll turn that into $8500 (like you did at the play $ table)

 

[bpb]

Bp you can make fun all you like- but I just came back from poker room- played for 2 1/2 hour and started with $7500- I now have $12700-- Eiuther don't beleive me or not- Try it or just sit there wityhout knowing what I'm talking about because of lack of experience, and doubt and make fun- I don't care

I know exactly what you're talking about. You're trying to describe and interpret patterns that SIMPLY AREN'T THERE. Any efforts put into detecting such patterns will be at best, wasted time, and at worst, wasted money.

If such patterns existed, you will be able to describe them in precise mathematical terms, showing that the frequency of A is happening > x standard deviations above the expected result. Listing 20 hands to prove a hypothesis is ludicrous.

If you want to win at hold'em ... put time into studying some of the worthwhile texts out there (keeping in mind that the vast majority of books out there aren't worth the paper they're printed on), and gain experience through playing low-limit, real money hands. Limits of $.02/$.04 abound and are far more useful than those play money tables.

 

[Nazareth]

Lol- not there huh? I'm standing at exactly $19,454 - that's up from the $7400 I started off with this morning.- I just went on for the last 3 hours and went from $12,700 up to $19,454. Yep- you're right- there's no patterns going on there- Don't play there- don't check it out for yourself.

"If you want to win at hold'em ... put time into studying some of the worthwhile texts out there (keeping in mind that the vast majority of books out there aren't worth the paper they're printed on), and gain experience through playing low-limit, real money hands. Limits of $.02/$.04 abound and are far more useful than those play money tables."

This isn't even about learning the game- this is about what I see happening & not getting good random games. I am winning- and I'm playing as best i can- but again- I'm noting some thigns I don't especially care for. If you wish to check out what I'm saying, fine- I go by the name of Stonned (That's the name they gave me and I can't change it)- We can set up a time and I'll be there. Or you can just check it out for yourself- You can keep saying there isn't no patterns going on there- but I tell you different- Tonight for instance- You would not wanted to have been the old lady, or the woman in the jogger suit, or the woman in the blue dress- they won nothing- for three hours- practically zilch- This happens every night- every time I go on- certain seats will win a few scattered hands here and there- but in the end- they end up losing big time because they just are not dealt the cards- I know- I've been the victim- Since discovering this however- I have not had that misfortune

"Listing 20 hands to prove a hypothesis is ludicrous."

That 20 hands was typical of everytime I go on- If it was only happening a couple of times- I wouldn't even have noticed anything was going on- this is constant is what I'm trying to tell you.

When you play poker- do you find that three of the 10 players are shut out for an entire three hours while the same four people at the table win hand after hand after hand after hand? Do you find this happening everytime you go on? Are you constantly being dealt sucker cards? like being dealt them for 4 straight rounds after you win a couple of hands in a row? Does the board continually show straights? Because that's what is happening where I play. Sorry- but it's too consistant.

WinBig- No offensem an- but it doesn't matter what the other players are doing- it's the cards that are dealt that determine who wins- In fact- it's even better in these fake money rooms becasue you will see everyon'es hands at the end of the round because they never fold hardly.

That three hours I just spent- I wrote down every seat that hit and I'll tell you honestly, in the three hours I was playing, I never saw seats 2 and 5 and six hit more than a very few times. This happens every time I go on- the next time might be seats 1 and 3 and 9 or something and- there were some awefully 'unlucky' people there tonight.

As I've said- I have not tried the money rooms- I live in a state wherte it's illegal to gamble online- I'm on dissability, and would risk losing that as well- not worth the gamble. I will say this- as a previous poster pointed out- it probably is different in the money rooms because of several factors- one- pokerroom certainly would not risk getting caught- 2 money players play different- pokerroom does not profit so they would gain nothing- Now- why is it different in fake money rooms? I donj't know

 

[Mugwump]

I give up.

 

[Nazareth]

Don't give up- just give it a try at poker room so that you understand what I'm talking about instead of conjecturing about somethign you aren't experiencing.

 

[chalupa]

Nazareth, if you have the time and are so inclined, try a much larger sample size, play every hand identically, and keep careful win loss records.

For example, play a seat for 50 hands, check/call everything to the river, and record your wins/losses. Then move to the next seat and repeat.

After you've done all 10 seats, repeat the whole cycle... say 20 times so you have 1000 samples for each hand.

That's still a relatively small sample and still not a perfect sampling method (because you opponents don't remain the same).

But I'll bet you $1000 fake money that you don't see a statistically significant difference.

 

[chalupa]

PS -- I just can't see how "hot seats" as you describe could be due to an accidentally faulty random number generator, it would have to be deliberately rigged.

And if the site was nefariously rigging their cards... surely they would be smart enough to not invoke it on the play money site where someone could deduce that fact for free.

I do disagree with a previous poster that a site would have NO reason to rig the cards (because it would be to their advantage to let bad players win more often, keeping them alive while good players continued to deposit and go after the bad players and the rake generation continues). But I can't see any reason why they would rig it to make "hot seats".

There IS something of a hot-seat phenomenon in a fair game, but it is due to psychological effects. Often when a player wins a couple of hands in a row he feels confident and lucky, which can lead him to play more hands than he should and stay in longer than he should. And of course the longer he stays in a hand, the more likely he is to win another pot.

You could rule out the psychological factor in your experiment by recording only your own wins/losses, and by playing each hand identically (i.e. to the river, baby!)

 

[Freudian]

I do disagree with a previous poster that a site would have NO reason to rig the cards (because it would be to their advantage to let bad players win more often, keeping them alive while good players continued to deposit and go after the bad players and the rake generation continues). But I can't see any reason why they would rig it to make "hot seats".

And since the good players are more mathematically gifted they would start wondering why results are so odd at that specific pokerroom and start going through hand histories. They would find out it was rigged and the story would break. After the story breaks the poker room goes down.

Like I said, there is no reason a poker room would want to rig their games. They make more money in the long run by dealing a fair game.

 

[chalupa]

And since the good players are more mathematically gifted they would start wondering why results are so odd at that specific pokerroom and start going through hand histories. They would find out it was rigged and the story would break.

Because of the nature of poker, played vs multiple changing players who can take multiple actions... I think a cleverly rigged site would be VERY difficult to prove from the outside.

Contrast this to a casino blackjack game, for example, where results can be compared to a mathematically exact model.

Like I said, there is no reason a poker room would want to rig their games. They make more money in the long run by dealing a fair game.

And casinos would make more money in the long run bt not screwing players out of withdrawals over technicalities, but that still happens too. Greed is powerful.

I would not be surprised that we eventually see a declining online poker room busted for some shenanigans, either something like I described or even more direct theft by shill players who work for the poker room.

I would also not be surprised that we see a poker room with simply a flawed random number generator (hell, the rest of some site's software certainly has plenty of flaws! )

 

[Nazareth]

Chalupa, I did that last night- I stayed right in the same seat and kept track of 130 hands- I didn't play the hands that I knew I would lose & I also folded the first time I was dealt sucker cards and sure enough, the next couple of hands were all sucker cards - so I didn't play those either & just recoreded who won- As I told the other fella- you wouldn't have wanted to be the old lady, the woman in jogging suit, or the woman in the blue dress- I was the guy in the tux & here is how the hands played out:

S=Suspender man
T=Tux man
W=white shirt man
R=Red dress girl
BD=Blue dress girl
O=Old lady
B=Afro american man
C=Cigar guy]
H=Guy with the hat
J=Woman in jogging suit.

T, H, T, H, C, W, B, W, BD, B, S, B, B, B, H, W, H, T, W, H, T, W, S, S, T, T, H, W, W, B, C, C, J, J, B, J, C, T,W, S, C, C, BD, S, B/W, H, H, BD, T, H, C, C, R, J, T, B, O, H, H, O, W, W,, B, H, T, T, R, T, T, O, T/C, W, O, B, S, H, W/T, W, O, B, B, C, C, C, C, J, H, C, T, T/W, T, H, T, T, R, O, T, B, S, T, S, J, T, S, H, R, B, O, T, R, T, C, C, R, H, - - - (I broke for a cigarrette here), J, T, T, T, J, T, B, W, H, C, B, W, BD, H, H, H, C, W, T, S, W, BD, R, B .....

Tux guy was hot last night & fortunately I chose his seat to do this experiment from & started the experiment with $12,400 and ended up with $19,454 for the evening- I played every flop & most turns & maybe 1/2 of the rivers- NOT good poker by any means and yet still managed to do well? I didn't count the number of straights that were thrown at us & I should have because any straight possibility is like an aphrodesiac to players- the betting goes wild- even if they have no chance- Everyone bets right to the river- So, in order to even stay in the game- You're having to bet $40-$80 every turn and river hand that shows a straight.

In the chart above- you can clearly see certain seats going hot for a little bit, then cooling off or even going stone cold, then getting hot again. During the T's off time- I woulda joined another room and probably gone with The Cigar Guy until I saw the Tux guy hitting again- However- I stuck around i nthe same room just for this experiment.

You watch in your poker rooms and tell me if you see people going consistantly going on streaks like I listed above- I also played poker stars last night and no way did I see the same thing- The winners were all over the board and spread out- none of this hit 4 times in a row, miss two- and then hit again 3-4 times- then cool off for a little bit- then repeat. Everyone on the table at pokerstars was winning hands- and the rouhnds were just as loose and fast- if a raise went up, by the time it got around to you, you were habing to call $80 just to play- which I did when I had strong hand- I played for 2 hours and only made $300 - I played for three hours on pokerroom yesterday, and made $7000?.

My gosh- I'm getting to the point on pokerstars that I can almost sense when a 'run' is going to happen

You pick up a 8h,3s on the draw? Don't fold em on pokerroom because there's a good chance you could win- Try that in any other poker site & see how far it gets you- I won a couple of times with 1 pair in poker room- a low pair at that.

 

[Macgyver]

My gosh- I'm getting to the point on pokerstars that I can almost sense when a 'run' is going to happen

If that's the case, deposit some real money and have a ball raking in your profits (pun intended).

 

[winbig]

In the chart above- you can clearly see certain seats going hot for a little bit, then cooling off or even going stone cold, then getting hot again. During the T's off time- I woulda joined another room and probably gone with The Cigar Guy until I saw the Tux guy hitting again- However- I stuck around i nthe same room just for this experiment.

There is no pattern in the findings you posted. 130 hands is hardly a good amount for a sample either.

You also mentioned that betting always went to the river...well in real $ games this never happens. You won't see 100% of the players in the hand go to the river.

In poker it also doesn't matter what your cards are as long as you know how to play them. You could be playing 72os, but with the right bets at the right time depending on what's on the board and how many players are still in and where the button is, you'd still have a decent chance of winning that hand.

 

[Mugwump]

Last try....

Pokerroom.com publishes statistics on all hands dealt. You can view them at:

Link Removed ( Old/Invalid)
(these are updated daily)

Link Removed ( Old/Invalid)
(a historical sample of 500,000 hands)

Naz, I really wish you'd start playing for money. Let me know where and what your user name is.

 

[winbig]

Pokerroom.com publishes statistics on all hands dealt. You can view them at:

Link Removed ( Old/Invalid)
(these are updated daily)

Link Removed ( Old/Invalid)
(a historical sample of 500,000 hands)

Naz, I really wish you'd start playing for money. Let me know where and what your user name is.

Nice URL. That just proves my point about how many hands never went to the river (33.4% in this case.)

 

[Nazareth]

Win big- no pattern huh? How many times have you gone on 'streaks' where you play? What I posted IS typical of EVERY time I play there- what I posted is representative of every time I play- Can you- in three hours- turn $12 into $19 or $12,000 into $19,000? Please explain to me why I'm not seeing 'streaks' like that on pokerstars?

Yes, 130 hands doesn't mean much in and of itself- But I'm telling you fact- If I posted the hands for 5 days straight- You WILL see pretty much the same thing over and over and over again- I know- because I've been playing there every day- you haven't. I'm telling you what I'm observing, & You're telling me I'm not seeing this? Check it out youreself- don't beleive me, go and see for yourself.- observe which seat isn't hitting, and then move to another room and take that seat & good luck trying to hit anything that night. You'll need it. Bet you woulda wanted to be the Tux guy in that list I provided- Well guess what? I'm getting the seats every day that hit- it takes a little work, but when I do find them, I do very weel so far. This has gone on too long to be simply a 'streak'

You also mentioned that betting always went to the river...well in real $ games this never happens. You won't see 100% of the players in the hand go to the river.

You're not understanding something here- We're NOT talking about money games- We're talking about patterns in free money games- I'm NOT commenting on the games played for real money- simply on what I've been observing in the free money games- Simply on the fact that certain players go through 'streaks' often enough that it isn't simply a lucky run which every card room will experience- however- NOT to this extent

Macgyver- I'd love to lol- but I'm sure the real money games aren't the same- I'd love to find out though for sure

Mugwump- 67% DID go to the river- Betting heavy- That's a sigfnificant number. Don't forget- of that 67% you'll often see 8 out of ten betting to the river in a hand. Aghain though- this isn't about the differences between real and fake money games- this conversation is about what I've seen as patterns or 'streaks' & about being dealt winning cards consistantly IF you're in the right seat

My user name is Stonned- I'm on us\ually every night- I start playing at about 9:00 p.m eastern - I play the 25/50 rooms mostly- I think there is a way to get personal hand hgistories from poker room- I'll see if I can find out how & post it here tonight- I'm telling you- I'm not that good a poker player (as attested by the fact that I don't do as well on pokerstars) & yet I'm whooping up on pokerroom? Yes, I'm playing bad players- BUT I'm also playing bad players at pokerstars- it's very easy to sucker them into raising when you flop the flush- same as in pokerroom- yet I don't do as well in pokerstars becasue noone is consistantly being deal winning cards- there is no patterns in pokerstars from what I've seen yet. Noone is going on 4-6 winning hand streaks- then hitting several more soon after.

 

[Mugwump]

Another relevant url

Outdated URL (Invalid)

and some relevant commentary:

Link Removed (invalid URL)

and a third, along the same lines...

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

All I can say is...

Nazereth, you should NEVER play for real money, at poker or any other casino game. Your absolute refusal to accept the advice of others based upon their collective experience and knowledge implies to me that you could get into real trouble really fast.

You said earlier that you were on disability and judging from what you've written so far, I can take an educated guess as to what its for, and its another reason why you should avoid casinos and gambling.

 

[Nazareth]

Let's see if htis works- I'll post thel ink to my hand history- I went in- observed for awhile & thought the old lady was going to be the winner- The only seat open was the White Shirt guy- so I sat down and played tight for a couple of rounds- however, the old lady soon fizzled & the white shirt started winning & kept winning- The Jogger suit woman didn't win- nor did blue dress or Afro American guy or Cigar guy. I bet all hands practically, even when given poopy cards-- Went from $19,454 to $25,400 in an hour and a half.

The wins went like so (And again- yes this is a small representative- but it IS very typical) I was the W guy

O,O,O,R,B,J,W,W,B,C,O,W,W,R,W,C,B,C,C,W,W,R,BD,W,T,R,W,BD,B,H,W,S,W,O,----(sat out),J,J,W,H,W-H,B,T,J,W,T,H,R

People were getting pissed at me and leaving

Here is the link to check it out- up top you,'ll see "Next' Click that & it will take you through the hands- (Have a good laugh at my aweful betting lol)

Link Removed ( Old/Invalid)

Mugwump- If you think this is simply superstition- then I challenge you to sign up and give it a try yourself- If you'll not do that- then you can't comment on what I'm talking about except for to give uninformed opinion.

Again, please answer me this- Do you play and have people consistantly winning like the examples I've given? No- You don't- You would however IF you cared to play in pokerroom. Aint no superstion about it man- it's pattern plain and simple.

Whoops- Edit- you'll need to click "Previous" I listed that last hand played by mistake

 

[winbig]

10 hands out of 46...consistant? not. 22% (rounded from 21.7xxxx) is hardly consistant.

Again, why is this even an issue if you're not going to try it out on the real $ tables? Play money is just that...play.

 

[Mugwump]

Mugwump- If you think this is simply superstition- then I challenge you to sign up and give it a try yourself- If you'll not do that- then you can't comment on what I'm talking about except for to give uninformed opinion.

Trust me, Naz, I've been on amazing rushes, and I've seen some amazing rushes. However, you cannot predict a rush, you can only identify it after its happened.

I do play at pokerroom, though not in the past couple of months. I play their tournaments, 1/2 and 2/4, and occasionally their .50/1 NL tables. (all real money). It has been the most profitable poker room that I've visted. I don't play there often anymore because I had a nasty tendency to lose my winnings there on their blackjack and video poker machines. I avoid mixing my poker and casino deposits any more. If I get a cell phone in the near future, though, I'll start using them again. What could be better than being able to play poker no matter where you are?

PS: The link to hand history that you provided will only work for you and the others in the hand. Pokerroom does not allow people who were not in the hand to view hand history.

PPS to Winbig: MEATWAD ROCKS!!!! ATHF RULEZ

 

[Nazareth]

10 hands out of 46...consistant? not. 22% (rounded from 21.7xxxx) is hardly consistant.

Again, why is this even an issue if you're not going to try it out on the real $ tables? Play money is just that...play.

You wouldn't like 1/4 wins? I know I sure would- anytime- This is consistant man- I'f you'll note that in that list there were seats that got nothing- whilke the majority of wins were by certain seats- this happens everytime I go on- Far too often to be 'luck' or 'rushes'- it's been happening for nearly a month now- You pick the right seat and you will, As I have done- do very well. Try hitting 1/4 weins at any other site.

Ah, didn't know about the link- I spose I could post em here- but it'd take up three pages. I could post just the win/loss info in succession if you're interested- basically just wanted to back up what I've been saying here.

I'll go on again tonight and do the same- same thing will happen- Can you sit in a room and say with pretty much certainty that such and such a seat weill win 4-5-6 in a row? I know I can with regularity & be right often because that is how the hands are playing out in pokerroom. It's getting so bad, that if I am the one winning, and I need a 5 card, I can almost say with certainty that it will come on the river- I can't tell you how manyu times I've sat here & said to myself "5 card comming up" & had it come up.

 

[Nazareth]

First and last rounds I played in that room: Neither of which I won- but you can see the totals I started with and ended with- playing for just an hour and half- but I will post the winning rounds if you like as well:

Seat 1: stonned [5H,3C] ($19,214 in chips)
Seat 3: vais ($15,130 in chips)
Seat 4: bwglass ($32,470 in chips)
Seat 5: minotaur v ($4,121 in chips)
Seat 6: xx big bucks ($16,115 in chips)
Seat 7: Dublinia ($704 in chips)
Seat 8: Chenwa ($3,972 in chips)
Seat 9: Jenlove ($1,957 in chips)
Seat 10: keremhan1970 ($3,882 in chips)



ANTES/BLINDS
xx big bucks posts blind ($13), Dublinia posts blind ($25), stonned posts blind ($25).

PRE-FLOP
Chenwa calls $25, Jenlove calls $25, keremhan1970 calls $25, stonned checks, vais calls $25, bwglass calls $25, minotaur v bets $50, xx big bucks calls $37, Dublinia calls $25, Chenwa calls $25, Jenlove calls $25, keremhan1970 calls $25, stonned calls $25, vais calls $25, bwglass calls $25.

FLOP [board cards QH,10H,QD ]
xx big bucks checks, Dublinia checks, Chenwa checks, Jenlove checks, keremhan1970 checks, stonned checks, vais checks, bwglass bets $25, minotaur v bets $50, xx big bucks folds, Dublinia folds, Chenwa folds, Jenlove folds, keremhan1970 calls $50, stonned folds, vais calls $50, bwglass calls $25.

TURN [board cards QH,10H,QD,KC ]
keremhan1970 checks, vais bets $50, bwglass calls $50, minotaur v bets $100, keremhan1970 bets $150, vais calls $100, bwglass folds, minotaur v calls $50.

RIVER [board cards QH,10H,QD,KC,6H ]
keremhan1970 bets $50, vais bets $100, minotaur v bets $150, keremhan1970 bets $150, vais calls $100, minotaur v calls $50.

SHOWDOWN
keremhan1970 shows [ JC,AS ]
vais shows [ AH,KH ]
minotaur v mucks cards [ JD,JH ]
vais wins $1,747.

---------------------------



Seat 1: stonned [JD,JH] ($24,420 in chips)
Seat 2: Marx5150 ($2,893 in chips)
Seat 3: scouse2201 ($150 in chips)
Seat 4: barryace ($5,748 in chips)
Seat 5: Big-Balooka ($5,147 in chips)
Seat 6: Longcreek ($516 in chips)
Seat 7: xxduckman ($3,096 in chips)
Seat 8: DJ2421 ($1,272 in chips)
Seat 9: Jenlove ($974 in chips)
Seat 10: keremhan1970 ($2,957 in chips)



ANTES/BLINDS
Big-Balooka posts blind ($13), Longcreek posts blind ($25).

PRE-FLOP
xxduckman folds, DJ2421 calls $25, Jenlove calls $25, keremhan1970 calls $25, stonned calls $25, Marx5150 folds, scouse2201 bets $50, barryace calls $50, Big-Balooka calls $37, Longcreek calls $25, DJ2421 calls $25, Jenlove calls $25, keremhan1970 calls $25, stonned calls $25.

FLOP [board cards QS,QC,10D ]
Big-Balooka checks, Longcreek checks, DJ2421 checks, Jenlove checks, keremhan1970 checks, stonned checks, scouse2201 checks, barryace checks.

TURN [board cards QS,QC,10D,AS ]
Big-Balooka checks, Longcreek checks, DJ2421 checks, Jenlove checks, keremhan1970 checks, stonned checks, scouse2201 bets $50, barryace calls $50, Big-Balooka folds, Longcreek calls $50, DJ2421 calls $50, Jenlove folds, keremhan1970 calls $50, stonned calls $50.

RIVER [board cards QS,QC,10D,AS,QD ]
Longcreek checks, DJ2421 checks, keremhan1970 bets $50, stonned calls $50, scouse2201 calls $50 and is all-in, barryace folds, Longcreek folds, DJ2421 calls $50.

SHOWDOWN
keremhan1970 shows [ JC,3S ]
stonned shows [ JD,JH ]
scouse2201 shows [ AC,7H ]
DJ2421 mucks cards [ 10H,5C ]
scouse2201 wins $897.


This just keeps happening over and over- If you look at the whole hand history- you'll see that I aint kidding about these 'streaks' that go on very consistantly- I can post any day of the week, and the results will be pretty much the same- the same seats keep winning, while other seats hit nothing all night long- over and over and over it goes.

 

[Mugwump]

I fail to see anything odd about either of these hands, except that scouse's preflop raise was stupid, and your decision not to raise preflop with JJ (even with 10 players calling) was questionable. Your decision to call it down with a pair of Q's and an A on the board was also a little suspect.

 

[Macgyver]

Geez, I'm tempted to send you $25 into a NETeller account so you WILL play real money. Then come back to us and tell us whether this is still working for you.

Maybe at their .50/1 NL tables? I know only the rudimentary basics about poker, hope that's the right way to talk about the tables.

Of course, if I do this, I want 15% of your winnings.

 

[winbig]

oh well, yet another person that can see the percentages plain as day and still think they have found a way around them. I don't even know why this thread is still going on; as it's for the play money tables.

There's no admission to watch the real money tables, so how about you do that for now and you will see that it's quite different from the play money tables; and in both cases there are no "hot seats".




But, if you're so sure there are hot seats, stick your money in and go for it. Let us know your results. Case closed.

 

[Nazareth]

The reason the thread is stil going is because you're sitting there arguing nothing wierd is going on when the fact is that in no other poker place can I do what I do at pokerroom- you're arguing this without having tried it for yourself & therefore don't know what you're tlaking about- I don't mean this to sound rude- but I've asked you 5to try it out yourself instead of standing there and insisting that it just can't be so- but you'd rather not & instead would rather stick to the fact that there's nothing unusual about certain players dominating a table consistantly & insisting that 'because other players win a few rounds' that 'there can't be anything going on.

I don't even know why this thread is still going on; as it's for the play money tables.

The conversation was about something funny going on- It has nothing to do with money or non money tables- I've been searchign for a good online Random place to play & so far, I've found that there indeed does seem to be anythign but randomness at pokerrroom which I'm dissappointed about- the origianl poster pointed out some facts & I agree with him as I've experienced the same thigns & have shared my experiences. If you know of any other poker rooms that give you 25% wins every day you play there, please let me know. I beleive you'll be hard pressed to find them and hard pressed to find any sites that let you win 4-5 in a row, then several more shortly after- tyhen shut off for awhile- If you'll go back through my listings- you will see that either pokerroom is full of the most lucky people on earth, or there is some kind of pattern going on

oh well, yet another person that can see the percentages plain as day and still think they have found a way around them.

Let's see- A not so great poker player turning $1000 into $25000 in a couple of days & there is nothing to what I'm saying? O.K- there's nothing to it- whatever. I've let you know my results i nthe fake money rooms & you deny it- I've even postecd & will continue to post & show that I'm getting 25% and better- something unheard of in other rooms- I dunno what it will take to prove anythign to you- so whatever.


Yes winbig- there is no admission - however- you need to deposit real money & that constitutes 'illergal activity' in the state I'm from- somethign I'm not oing to do tro prove a point to someone who could at any time test out what I am saying but won't.

Macgyver- I'll give you 23% - no 24%- lol you don't know how badly I want to try the real money tables- stop tempting me lol.

Mugwump:

I fail to see anything odd about either of these hands, except that scouse's preflop raise was stupid, and your decision not to raise preflop with JJ (even with 10 players calling) was questionable. Your decision to call it down with a pair of Q's and an A on the board was also a little suspect.

I stated early on that I'm both not a great player, AND that I do not play at pokerroom the same way I play at other places because of the simple fact that IF I am on the winning seat, then You will play right to the end with crappy cards- If you'd like, I'll list the whole amount of hands & you will see that I often won with crappy cards that had to be called to the end. I'm am NOT (Not stressed for emphasis) kidding when I say that when you are the one winning- you can play crappy cards and win. I have also stated that when you are on the winning seat- you can call to the end- you have no idea how often I've sat there and watched someone win with 2-2, 3-3, 4-4 etc. by hitting that last river card & making the full house- & you have no idea how many times I've sat there needing one card & by gosh by golly it comes on the flop to make thee straight when I'm on a 'streak' (Translated- predetermined pattern) That's why i called right to the end- however I should not have because I hadn't hit anything in a few hands as attested to by the hand history before that which I'll post if you like.

As I've asked before- please try this instead of telling me there is nothing going on. You say you've got an accouint, then just play the fake money rooms a few nights & observe the number of 'streaks' that go on there. it's unatural. There's nothing to lose by trying it & If what I'm saying is true, then give the money rooms a shot after practicing for a bit in the fake money rooms.

 

[Macgyver]

Yes winbig- there is no admission - however- you need to deposit real money & that constitutes 'illergal activity' in the state I'm from- somethign I'm not oing to do tro prove a point to someone who could at any time test out what I am saying but won't.

Macgyver- I'll give you 23% - no 24%- lol you don't know how badly I want to try the real money tables- stop tempting me lol.

I'm assuming your comment to me was sarcastic as I would be quite happy to put a piddly $25 for you to test this theory of yours out in REAL play.

I think that's what the majority of readers here have the problem with; some people (including myself) believe that it is much more likely that playing for fun in an online casino favors the player as a means to entice that player to deposit real money.

However, if you can't legally play where you reside, I understand.

 

[chalupa]

Chalupa, I did that last night- I stayed right in the same seat and kept track of 130 hands- I didn't play the hands that I knew I would lose & I also folded the first time I was dealt sucker cards

Actually that is not the experiment I suggested... I suggested you record only your own results, and play exactly the same way each hand (check/call to the river). Then see if you notice any difference between different seats over time.

Instead, you were using some intelligence in your play, and presumably (some) of your opponents were as well.

For example, perhaps player BD (with the lowest number of wins) decided to do a little experiment of his own, and play only AK or pocket pairs, and fold on the flop if he didn't improve or have an overpair. That would easily explain his few wins.

I also qualitatively do not see anything unusual in the "hot streaks" in your history. Obviously the only way to have NO streaks would be for a different player to win every new hand... and actually THAT would be far weirder.


Nevertheless... working with the data you provided... I analyzed it in a spreadsheet (the 0.5 winning hands are from what I assume were split pots in your data) and the results are shown below.

I also compared it to random numbers 1..10. I admit I cheated and re-calculated the numbers several times to get a graph that was a little spikier than usual, but nothing out of line for a small sample size like this.

Your player winning percentages franged from 3.6% to 20.5%. The random hands are a big more evenly distributed, but still range from 5.8% to 18.0%.

When you consider that the poker history has decidely NON-random factors (i.e. differing player styles) I don't think the results you saw are anything particularly unusual.

 

[bpb]

There's nothing to lose by trying it & If what I'm saying is true, then give the money rooms a shot after practicing for a bit in the fake money rooms.

Please keep your crackpot schemes to yourself, and have the decency to refrain from encouraging others to throw their money away on them.

 

[winbig]

Let's see- A not so great poker player turning $1000 into $25000 in a couple of days & there is nothing to what I'm saying? O.K- there's nothing to it- whatever. I've let you know my results i nthe fake money rooms & you deny it- I've even postecd & will continue to post & show that I'm getting 25% and better- something unheard of in other rooms- I dunno what it will take to prove anythign to you- so whatever.

You haven't been listening. ANYONE can turn $1000 into $25000 with play money at ANY site, IN any seat, not just this one. Play money tables are exactly the same as a pissing contest. Nobody cares. I think what everyone else is saying here is to quit wasting your time (and maybe soon to be money) trying this out.

Yes winbig- there is no admission - however- you need to deposit real money & that constitutes 'illergal activity' in the state I'm from- somethign I'm not oing to do tro prove a point to someone who could at any time test out what I am saying but won't.

And we would sit in play money tables for hours on end for what reason?

As I said, go WATCH the real money tables. Sure it may be illegal to actually PLAY them where you're at, but observing a table isn't. I believe most hold'em tables, you'll be good to see 50% average players per flop; not 90-100% average that you do on the play money tables.

[edit]

If the last statement doesn't make sense for you, let's break it down, and it's been said before too:

The more hands people play, of course the more hands you're going to win that you wouldn't normally (playing any 2 cards). By it being play money, of course there's no risk, but if you're doing it consistantly at real $ tables, you'll be bust in no time.....thus making your "findings" irrelevant.