UltimateBet - Absolute Poker Scam

[jetset]

Mainstream media seem to be picking the story up - long article in the National Post today.

[lots0]

Just like to point out one inconstancy in Tokwiro's statement.

May 2008: The investigation confirms that the fraudulent activity took place from March 7, 2006 to December 3, 2007.

February 2008: UltimateBet discovers the unauthorised code that allowed the perpetrators to obtain hole card information during live play. The code was part of a legacy auditing system that was manipulated by the (unidentified) perpetrators of the fraud. UltimateBet immediately removes the unauthorised code and works with the KGC and with third-party auditors to verify that the security hole has been eliminated.

Am I the only person that wonders why Tokwiro says the cheating stopped on December 3rd, 2007, but according to Tokwiro they did not even discover and remove the "unauthorised code" until February 2008.

The phrase "lying scumbag thieves" comes to my mind when thinking about Tokwiro/Absolute Poker/UltimateBet.

I would also like to see a full accounting of all the money stolen by these nameless thieves and Tokwrio's attempts to repay the players the money that was stolen from them.

And then we have the fact that Tokwrio appears to be protecting the thieves! Why not release the names of the thieves? Why not turn the thieves over to Law Enforcement? Maybe because it would be hard to explain to outsiders why the only change in ownership at AP/UB is in fantasy land...

As far as the pokeraffiliateprogram postings, it is more than obvious to anyone that takes the time to look, that a large group of poker affiliates are nothing but whores that will do anything for money.

[fatshaft]

Originally Posted by Casinomeister

There are scores of poker rooms, and unless AP and UB offer something 100% exclusive that is found nowhere on this planet, then it is beyond me why anyone is still playing there or promoting them for that matter. Baffling

This is the biggest mystery, or perhaps not? Stars only runs CPA at $75 a head, so there's no lifetime earn for a player, and if you're a US afiliate you then have Tilt, before you get to the next biggest two US supporting rooms - these two rogues.

Then you get Cake, some MG rooms and Bodog, all the rest are minute.

So if the majority of your traffic is US based, then there is likely to be a fair hit to your earnings as an affiliate. I say likely, but surely take those two sites down and your players will move to Cake or Bodog or the like, after all if they havn;t heard of UB or AP by now, they sure as hell won't have heard of Cake!

Too many affiliates are purely in it for the bottom line, even those who dress up their site as some sort of player advisory or community flag bearer.

More sites need to follow 2+2, BW and the Meister IMO in outing and blacklisting places like these.

[Mousey]

Linky to National Post article referenced earlier.

[jetset]

Some heavy damage control going on at present here:

http://www.pokernews.com/news/2008/0...et-scandal.htm

Annie Duke says she was ready to distance herself from Ultimate Bet until "new management" took over and fully disclosed. Blames previous management.

She now has "a lot of say in the business" and claims that all the "bad apples" have been removed and consequently is confident that everything is hunky dory.

But there's some confusion there regarding "change of management" and "sale of the company" - both of which are referred to but without clarity or sufficient detail to be convincing afaic.

The failure to identify the culprit publicly is explained as mainly due to legal difficulties surrounding identification of the perpetrator and under which jurisdiction to proceed, but UB is apparently investigating.

Seven figures were repaid to disadvantaged players, but again no specifics.

UB revenues were "not affected" by the scandal, AD claims.

Points to big name pros agreeing to be associated with UB (looks like one of the UB strategies) as an endorsement.

Annie Duke is a very respected name on the poker side of the business, but personally, I was not left with a comfortable feeling after viewing this video interview.

There's a clearly apparent apprehension that the upcoming "60 Minutes" program is going to make the industry look bad (UltimateBet more so, i.m.v.) The producer has recently been in contact with Annie D at WSOP, but it isn't clear what the result of that was.

Personal assessment: damage control move, and this scandal is hurting more than they wish to admit. A closing comment was to the effect that continued bashing of UB is not good for the industry. Personally, I think there has to be a lot more of the much-used word "transparency" here, especially regarding this "new ownership" question....or is that "new management?"

[D!G!TAL]

Originally Posted by jetset

The failure to identify the culprit publicly is explained as mainly due to legal difficulties surrounding identification of the perpetrator and under which jurisdiction to proceed, but UB is apparently investigating.

This makes me really angry. The funds from this criminal activity had to be taken out of the system at some point.

With so much money involved it was most likely bank transfers which would make identifying the end recipient fairly easy. Even tracing back via a web wallet shouldnt prove too difficult.

If the funds are out there in limbo somewhere, waiting to be laundered, the card rooms should do the honourable thing and start repaying ALL players that were stolen from. IMO they should be doing this anyway, in full, in order to beging the difficult task of rebuilding their image.

Regards, e.

[lots0]

Originally Posted by D!G!TAL

This makes me really angry. The funds from this criminal activity had to be taken out of the system at some point.

With so much money involved it was most likely bank transfers which would make identifying the end recipient fairly easy. Even tracing back via a web wallet shouldnt prove too difficult.

If the funds are out there in limbo somewhere, waiting to be laundered, the card rooms should do the honourable thing and start repaying ALL players that were stolen from. IMO they should be doing this anyway, in full, in order to beging the difficult task of rebuilding their image.

Regards, e.

Dude... The management at AP/UB know who did it... They just don't want the public to know... Because if the public did know who was stealing all that money... they would be outraged.

[D!G!TAL]

Originally Posted by lots0

Dude... The management at AP/UB know who did it... They just don't want the public to know... Because if the public did know who was stealing all that money... they would be outraged.

Definitely, they must be paying some serious 'hush hush' money to keep this quiet... but the truth has a way of eventually making itself known...

What gets me angry aswell, aside from the honest players losing out, is the damage it does to the industry as a whole. With the Frank amendment not getting through and these kind of issues going on it only adds weight to arguments by those against online gambling in general.

[GaryWatson]

I shows the industry cannot self regulate.

The UIGEA has done nothing more than send US players to rogue sites/rogue ewallets.

If it wasnt for 2+2 and their huge efforts, most of us would be none the wiser

[lots0]

Originally Posted by D!G!TAL

Definitely, they must be paying some serious 'hush hush' money to keep this quiet... but the truth has a way of eventually making itself known...

It's all those $168,000 apiece TV commercials and Million dollar+ $ponsorships by one or two big names... If AP/UB have a bunch of nice TV commercials, a hot spokesmodel and a weird guy that won a lot of WSOP bracelets who wears their name plastered all over his body... well they can't be all bad now can they?
It just goes to show ya that money can buy respectability, no matter how much you've stolen...

Originally Posted by D!G!TAL

What gets me angry aswell, aside from the honest players losing out, is the damage it does to the industry as a whole. With the Frank amendment not getting through and these kind of issues going on it only adds weight to arguments by those against online gambling in general.

I couldn't agree more. These A-Holes seem to be doing everything they can to screw it up for the rest of us.