Golden Reef - Cash in request refunded, struggling to get an explanation.

**silcnlayc** · 12th July 2006, 05:20 PM

Can anyone see my point??

Nope...

I am going to play devils advocate here for I feel this is just a plain silly question especially with all the ENDLESS horror bonus postings.

No offense meant to anyone, it just drives me crazy these postings when all in all, anyone with COMMON sense knows that a casino will not allow you to withdraw ANY FUNDS until you have met the WR if you took a bonus, regardless of whether or not the wording is not as you like after the INITIAL warning of bonus T&C's...and especially when it is posted UP FRONT such as this:

"Player�s who accept and wager using the Welcome Bonus are required to meet the full play-through requirements before a withdrawal will be approved.

Why would ANY casino allow you to withdraw ANYTHING if you haven't met the T&C's and WR, when you have had the enjoyment of playing with THIER money?

Alarm bells should have gone off BEFORE you deposited, with just this one condition, but yet, you go and deposit and play anyway, hoping the vagueness of the remainder of T&C's will be your out.

Using a little common sense when taking bonuses should always be foremost in your actions...if it states there are wagering requirements, then that is just what it is...period.....WR are standard for ALL deposit match bonuses..regardless of any T&C's hidden in the language that is not clear...everyone that uses bonuses knows this...

**kiolka** · 12th July 2006, 06:46 PM

the whole point of the ez bonus was that a player was supposed to be able to play any game they wanted (weighted accordingly), and be able to cash out any deposit + winnings at anytime (and forfeit the bonus).
That is what is written in the t+c's.

**Dirk Diggler** · 12th July 2006, 10:57 PM

Originally Posted by kiolka

the whole point of the ez bonus was that a player was supposed to be able to play any game they wanted (weighted accordingly), and be able to cash out any deposit + winnings at anytime (and forfeit the bonus).
That is what is written in the t+c's.

Totally agree with that.

Silcynlayc - that maybe was the case, but now every MG (apart from possibly this group) allow withdrawals of your cash balance whenever. You just lose any bonus money.

**Droid8** · 13th July 2006, 12:36 AM

Hi Silcnlayc,

I take on board your point now you have made it to me. However you are obviously an experienced on line gambler, I am not. I thoroughly read the terms and conditons on this casino and many other casinos before I deposited at any of them. This included those relating to bonuses and promotions.

I thought the terms on this one were the most favourable for me and that I had understood them, so I deposited. With out prior knowledge of these types of terms and conditions, what else have I to go on other than that which is in front of me? I'll also add to this that I read corporate law at university, so I have a reasonable understanding of legally binding documents.

"A Player's cash balance may be cashed in at any time". That seems very clear to me!!!! In fact I don't think it could be put clearer! What you have stated relies on prior knowledge of this issue. This I admittedly lack.

"Player’s who accept and wager using the Welcome Bonus are required to meet the full play-through requirements before a withdrawal will be approved"

Fair point, which I took on board - BUT only the BONUS money has any wager requirement on it. If I am mistaken, just show me where in the terms and conditions it says otherwise and I'll totally understand your point.

As for the horror stories you speak of I haven't read these, but will endevour to so now this has happened to me. It can't however, be assumed that the end user will have any prior knowledge, of anything at all on the subject, except what is written in the T&Cs.

I will have to write to the affiliate manager who I've since discovered is a member of this forum and will also lodge a complaint at ecogra.

Dirk Diggler and Kiolka, I feel more confident I am right now with what you have added here. Silcnlayc, please do not take anything I have written personally, it was not intended that way. Thank you all for your time on the matter.

Regards,
Droid8

**wobble33** · 13th July 2006, 01:42 AM

guys

there is another problem here with micro gaming (viper) ez or clear play bonus accounts where i dont think ANYONE has latched onto yet! now then, say you get £100 bonus for £100 deposit, the wagering requirements are x30 bonus only so £3000 to wager. you go on spring break (this is a 100% game allowed for wagering and just an example). you have done lets say £2500.00 wagering, and have just £500 left to wager. you get the bonus round and hit a £250.00 win. you say right here, if i double this, i have finished this wagering, and now i can cash out. only to find out when you go into cashier the £250.00 double up gamble hasnt counted!)

. BUT IF YOU LOOK IN PLAYCHECK, YOU WILL SEE ITS STILL SAYING YOU HAVE WAGERED £500 ON THAT SPIN

. now then, if you look in the terms and conditions, there is no mention of doubling up on ANY game doesnt count to clear bonus (except at casino action), they have a line in the terms saying something about doubling up. i found this out to my cost at 1 casino the other day, but i still managed to complete the wagering

. so really this is a very sly trick off microgaming and the new bonus accounts. i think they want to rewrite there terms very carefully! and also if these microgaming casinos dont get their terms and conditions put right, bryan (cm) is going to be a very busy man.

**chuchu59** · 13th July 2006, 09:44 AM

At first glance, I thought that the player must be wrong since he hadnt met the full WRs. However, when I read the Ts and Cs at Golden reef, I began to think differently. There are supposed to be 2 separate accounts, one a cash balance account and the other a bonus account. You can only use your bonus balance when you have emptied your cash account. In addition, the bonus cannot be withdrawn but funds can be transferred to the cash balance as a result of meeting playthrough requirements. Does this not mean that any bonus remaining in the bonus account is uncashable while the bonus transferred has in itself met the playthrough and together with the remaining cash balance, can be withdrawn at any time. Why should there be playthrough requirements for bonuses transferred to the cash account and another set of WRs for the total bonus itself? Seems conflicting to me.

I believe that the EZ Bonus system was designed to ensure that bonuses are not that easily abused. The player would have to deplete his whole cash balance to be able to use the bonus for wagering and even then the funds transferred from the bonus itself would have to meet playthrough and sent to the cash balnce account in increments. Once a withdrawal is initiated, the bonus balance will be reset to zero. I cannot honestly see how this can be viewed as 'bonus abuse' if that is what Golden Reef is thinking of.

**Mousey** · 13th July 2006, 12:59 PM

Droid8 ....

Have you tried to contact the casino rep here on the forum? At the top of this page where you are now, you will see a link for Casino Contacts. ... http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/showgroups.php
When you get there, scroll down just a wee bit and look for "Casino Action". PM the rep with pertinent details, and perhaps they can at least find out what's up with your account.

P.S. ... Do I have the right casino group in mind, everyone? If not, please correct me. There have been so many changes it makes my brain ache to try and keep up with which casino went where....

**Droid8** · 13th July 2006, 01:40 PM

Hi,

Yes I have contacted the casino action rep on this forum. He responded straight away and told me he had forwarded the details on to the Golden Reef manager and that I would get a response. I'll wait for that response until after the weekend and then put in a complaint to ecogra if I don't hear anything.

Thanks again to everyone adding to this thread.

D8

**KasinoKing** · 13th July 2006, 02:21 PM

I think the casino is wrong & the player is right.
You should be able to withdraw your cash, as clearly stated in the T&C's.

If the rep does not sort the problem then Pitch a Bitch with Bryan.

Whatever you do, DO NOT play any more at this casino until this is resolved.
(Sorry to state the obvious!

)

**Droid8** · 13th July 2006, 02:35 PM

Oh dear, too late for that.

I wanted a gamble yesterday and played a few slots.

Is this likely to cause me a lot of trouble???

Like I've said I am completely new to all this.

Cheers for the heads up on that though.

D8