please help? ENTROPAY steals over �10k from me

**GrandMaster** · 5th October 2009, 08:49 AM

Originally Posted by Webzcas

As IXARIS who are behind Entropay are a UK limited company and registered by the FSA

You have fallen for it as well. As I wrote above, Ixaris is not on the FSA register, it merely has a small e-money issuer's certificate confirming its exemption from FSA regulation.

**WagerWitch** · 5th October 2009, 08:54 AM

This most assuredly does not bode well.

As Entropay is a gambling pay correct?

Why are they closing your account?

**willpkr** · 6th October 2009, 09:54 AM

thanks for all replies
having heard that entropay isn't properly regulated is very worrying. I feel i've seen the last of my money, unless perhaps I get a lawyer involved but I don't know if that could work at all.

very angry and disappointed, at myself also.. for not properly questioning whether this was a stand up company before trusting it with so much

**jetset** · 6th October 2009, 10:29 AM

I would definitely not give up so easily on this.

There have been a number of useful avenues suggested here, and you have an address for the parent company - that should be sufficient to apply the right sort of pressure to secure a fair resolution.

Quite apart from the fact that there is a fair amount of money involved, it's the principle of the thing, and your treatment as a bona fide client that would outrage me.

**Webzcas** · 6th October 2009, 10:55 AM

Agree with what JetSet has posted. If it were me, not only would I contact the parent company direct, I would be in the process of finding a suitable lawyer to follow up said contact.

It would definately be worth your while seeking legal advice, if only to ascertain how much such action would cost.

Alternatively you could file a claim yourself:

https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/csmco2/index.jsp

However I believe the amount owed to you is above that dealt with the small claims courts.

Finally, you really do need to sign up to CAG and post your experience and problems with Entropay. The Consumer Action Group is a very powerful organisation which has many many knowledgable people posting there.

The founder BankFodder is responsible for the current movement regarding claiming back unfair UK Bank Charges. This has cost the banking industry in the UK millions as a result.

Whilst they might not have had dealings with Entropay, they would have helped and advised individuals in similar situations with regards getting back money owed.

They will also be able to provide proper advice regarding the legal channels you will need to go down.

If it was me owed �10k I would pull out all the stops to get it back.

Good Luck!

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/

**bakonlin** · 6th October 2009, 12:19 PM

Originally Posted by prostudio

God i cant belive!
It can happen to us also...to everyone!
I dont understand why this companies try to make us belive they are serious and then without any notice suspend an account!
They dont make money with 2 % of transactions...is this not enough!
Man you must directly contact with FSA and report everything!
I hope you save the transactions and you can give them much details its posible!
I really hope FSA will sort out this for you!
Regards!

Very scarry.I had used Entropay for more than 1 year,but always purchased the whole balance after uploading,I must be very carefull from now on.

**vinylweatherman** · 7th October 2009, 02:10 AM

It looks like a case of them NOT UNDERSTANDING GAMBLING. UNLIKE a regular pre-loadable account, or card, where money moves only in ONE direction, from customer, to account, to merchant - GAMBLING is different, money can move BOTH ways, and there can indeed be LARGE amounts involved, and from unlikely directions, such as $200 into xxx casino, followed by $10K coming out in REVERSE.

I even had this BULLSHIT from Neteller, who ONLY process for GAMBLING sites and "peer to peer" transactions. They demanded to know the "nature of the transactions".

I felt like saying "they are YOUR F*****G MERCHANTS, don't you KNOW what BUSINESS they are in!!!".

My transactions were indeed VERY simple. INTO casinos, OUT of casinos, IN from MY OWN cards, and OUT to my VERIFIED bank account from my FOUR YEAR OLD PLUS VIP NETELLER ACCOUNT.

Maybe STUPIDITY is the root cause of cases like this, these "small money issuers" know they are OUTSIDE regulation, and they are SUPPOSED to limit balances to a mere �150 (or, I believe, something like �1000 for a VERIFIED client). However, this would NEVER work for GAMBLERS, especially high rollers and poker players. They can more or less get away with theft, they can simply "play dead" and take an indefinite time to resolve an issue, and it is NOT simply a case of them having to fear the FSA, because only the first �150 is covered, and they are EVEN exempt from the Investor's compensation scheme, so that IF they went bust, there is NO "investor protection" for the first �50,000 (UK) - you lose almost EVERYTHING, just as if it were a CASINO licenced in some backwater going bust.

There is ALWAYS this risk when using the convenience of an eWallet, and what is REALLY worrying is that they can he completely happy with you for ages, and SUDDENLY turn nasty and more or less "steal" your money, even such large amounts.

They know full well that it is a case of the customer taking them to court, where they WOULD have to justify their actions in front of the judge, and would even have to pay costs and compensation ON TOP if found to be wrong.

As has been shown in the UK Bank charge case, when a "faceless corporation" thinks the aggrieved customer is DEADLY SERIOUS to the extent that a court date is set following a solicitor's letter, they will nearly always investigate PROPERLY, and at a HIGHER LEVEL of competence in the organisation.

It would be very BAD for a company like Entropay to be exposed in court has having WITHOUT PROPER CAUSE confiscating a large sum, and then compounding the issue with LIBEL (wrongly telling a merchant a customer is a fraud).

The first case though, might not be so bad.

They said

Any such refunds will be to the credit/debit cards from where the funds were originally transferred.

Not ideal, but as soon as the money hits those cards, it falls WITHIN the FULL regulatory framework of the FSA and banking ombudsman.

A debit card refund is more or less the same as a direct bank transfer, despite the mechanism being different, the refund will appear as a credit (merchant refund) on the underlying bank account against which the debit card is issued.

A VISA credit card can accept a refund, and what may be on their minds is not just RECENT deposits, but going way back in time and refunding EVERY deposit that ever came from the card(s), with any surplus going back via the debit card.

Play along, but firmly, and when the money has been returned, slap them with a DEFAMATION lawsuit (or convincing threat of one on the way), they have legally "defamed" your character by taking the action they have, in effect, treating you as though you are guilty of a criminal offence - they will have to demonstrate this in court, and "mere suspicion" based on "indicators" is not good enough if YOU can convince the judge that you cooperated fully, used your genuine details, and did nothing illegal (such as buying firearms or drugs with the money through their service, or using "dirty" money to fund the account).