A CHALLENGE to Cipher and Bethug (merged with Seanjohn's "apology" thread)

[seanjohn]

It is apparent that the above posters, namely 'grus' and 'eek', have not taken into consideration the five logical dilemas I pointed out on my other thread 'A challenge to Cipher and Bethug'. If that is the case, allow me to draw your attention to the first question: 'Why does Cipher need a client if he has a winning system?'

This question has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with whether or not the casino's RNG is rigged or not. Even if its true that the casino's RNG is messed up and I somehow found out a way to exploit it, meaning I make tonnes of money out of it, I would never EVER, need to recruit any clients.

Grus and Eek, if you have a system to win the lottery, would you set up a company and help others make money? I think not...not to mention you will NEVER disclose such system at all. Another member brought up the idea or 'insurance', that Cipher take a job as insurance. But this argument is also false, as one don't partake into something as an insurance measure against the same thing he wanted to insure against. If Cipher wanted to insure against the failure of his system, he won't be selling his system as a job as both could fail the same time. He would instead get a real job.

Does it look clearer to you guys now?

[eek]

If you want to label someone as a snakeoil salesman thats up to you.

Those of us who been around the boards for a few years have seen plenty of them. (Steve Adkins springs to mind. )

At the end of the day us adults choose to take it or leave it.

If he really winds you up, dont read his threads.

[chucho]

Vesuvio, please explain , my runs for over a week at con and micro and casino365, u can see the screen shots. Using my sytstem. Please explain it.

Screen shots prove nothing, never have never will. Kinda like you don't a system that would beat the casino 70% of the time...never have, never will. That goes for everyone, not just you, but you are still special

Hello, Bethug. This is universexf6. It is my pleasure to talk to you here for the first time. Since I am interested in any betting systm available, please teach me where I can get in touch with your system on the internet. I am most delighted to see your site/programme/( or whatever it is ). Also excuse me in advance my English is not as good as Americans since I am a Japanse.

Your English is better then Thugs, maybe Thug speaks fluent Japanese? You can waste you time and money with his "system", but you are better off burning your hard earned money than sending it to thug as then you only waste the money and save the time.

**And this has gone from a dirt-slinging, insulting challenge to a full blown ego-trip combined with a bit of arrogance .... and all this while the fire-starter is not even here to see the success!! Well done. **

The "fire starter" sees his success, and he should be proud of it. I have not followed Cipers postings other than that he as some interesting tracking software. If he found a way to exploite the software because it is not random, then great. That actually may be possilble. But if he said that, and I don't think he ever did, he could beat a land based casino 70% of the time, then we would be as high on crack as Thug. I would like to vote Seanjohn back on the island as his choice of a couple unnecessary words were fueled by the stupidity of people who claim to beat land based casinos 70% of the time and prey on others who want to beleive in it. Then he takes their money in trade for his "system" and these poor suckers lose their money using his "system"

I love all the real players out there

I love all the bonus whore's, bonus hookers and pimps. Especially the bonus pimps who play for friends and family.....spread the love, it is better to give than receive say the bonus pimps.

[seanjohn]

...to me that indicates that you are willing to invest something in this other than running your mouth.

Now if that's the case, then by all means put up or shut up...

By 'invest' do you mean I have to buy your software first?
If what you meant was whether I am ready to put my money where my mouth is, then YES. I have $500 that says you will lose in The Wiz's Challenge.
"Are you putting up or are you shutting up?"

Everything that I've done over the past six plus years is very well documented by the casinos themselves.

Interesting. In my 2 years of gambling I have been banned by at least 30 casinos because I won too much. And the figure does NOT include where I play with bonuses. You won 48 sessions out of 50 in Casino Fortune?? And they still open the doors to you? Very good!

The way you put it, do you mean the casinos having so in detail documented your play, still knowingly and voluntarily SPONSOR you and your software?

I think I have definitely said enough about you. You and others who's reading should by now know who you are and what you are made of. I think it's a shame you are not responding because I out-reasoned you.

Have a good one!

[trick]

From the other thread:

First of all, I would like to thank the Casinomeister for extending the courtesy of letting me make one post before my suspension.

One post?

[cipher]

"I would like to vote Sean John back on the island as his choice of a couple unnecessary words were fueled by the stupidity" [/QUOTE]

Enough said, and the beat goes on and on and on and on and on ad infinitum. Even after Sean John's "BS" heart felt thanks to Bryan for Bryan's allowing Sean John to post one last post. Logically speaking Chucho, wouldn't one (Sean John) hav't to leave the "Island" before one could be voted back on to the Island? Does anyone see a pattern here? Have a good one.

[chucho]

Logically speaking Chucho, wouldn't one (Sean John) hav't to leave the "Island" before one could be voted back on to the Island? Does anyone see a pattern here?

I thought he was voted off the island. I don't know why I thought that?

Banned again. This time for 90 days. Next time it's for good.

I only read this post and seanjohn's only post on this thread was the 1st and the one right after mine. I think I should be banned and kicked off the island for not doing enough research. I also think that anyone that says they can beat the casino 70% of the time, consistently, shoud be banned for smoking crack or for stealing purses and only getting caught 30% of the time.

[seanjohn]

Cipher, is that all you can unashamedly come up with?
Run out of attacks so ask them to ban me?
Where is your chivalry?

At first I thought I was only allowed to make one post and then I the system would block me. Sort of like how WOL banned Caruso before he made his last post. (Sorry have to bring it up, Caruso) And indeed 1 post was all I asked from Casinomeister and he could confirm it. He told me in email,
"If you apologize to the members for your remarks and promise to watch
yourself from now on, I'll grant you access."
Now that I have re-read it it seems CM has an intention of sparing me the suspension and I only became award of his kindness after finding out I was allowed to make more than 1 post today. So why not?
I am glad that CM has taken this incident impartially. I would not object him to ban me, I did do something wrong afterall.

Cipher
So you decide NOT to put up but SHUT UP instead?
I still have $500 here waiting.
Seriously, I would have a lot more respect for you had you come out here straight and told everybody you had something to sell and CLEARLY STATED THE PRICE.
What a shame.

Have a good one!

[Stanford]

The only people who benefit from the claim that betting systems can beat negative value games are casinos, because, like it or not, there are readers out there who will believe what they read and try it for themselves - I nearly did, once. Those people will lose money in the endeavour. That bothers me...
Betting systems cannot overcome the house advantage. If anyone tells you otherwise, they are either foolish or malicious.

I agree. Any system based on previous wins/losses is immediatly suspect.

Consider two players at the same table each playing a progression. One decreases their bet and the other raises because they each have had different win/loss patterns. How could that be?

I remember losing hand after hand while the guy next to me wins hand after hand - and vice versa. I remember players itching to get the "hot seat".

Caruso, you say people will lose money in the endeaver. They will only do so if they are lucky. If they are unlucky they will initially win and in so doing they may lock themselves into a long supersticious spiral - forever tweaking in search of a Rumpelstiltskin answer.

Progressions and betting systems are fun. They are not profitable in the long run. That is a law.

Stanford.

[cipher]

Cipher, is that all you can unashamedly come up with?
Run out of attacks so ask them to ban me?
Where is your chivalry?

At first I thought I was only allowed to make one post and then I the system would block me. Sort of like how WOL banned Caruso before he made his last post. (Sorry have to bring it up, Caruso) And indeed 1 post was all I asked from Casinomeister and he could confirm it. He told me in email,
"If you apologize to the members for your remarks and promise to watch
yourself from now on, I'll grant you access."
Now that I have re-read it it seems CM has an intention of sparing me the suspension and I only became award of his kindness after finding out I was allowed to make more than 1 post today. So why not?
I am glad that CM has taken this incident impartially. I would not object him to ban me, I did do something wrong afterall.

Cipher
So you decide NOT to put up but SHUT UP instead?
I still have $500 here waiting.
Seriously, I would have a lot more respect for you had you come out here straight and told everybody you had something to sell and CLEARLY STATED THE PRICE.
What a shame.

Have a good one!

And then there's this little entree as per attached.