Reef casino rigged?

[Freudian]

Everything seemed normal. I was a bit up with 1/3 of the wagering requirements for the bonus to go. Then the most insane stuff started happening.

In the next 96 hands I lost 55 betting units (out of 113 units betted). I lost 70 hands, pushed four and won 24. If I calculate everything correctly, I was -4.85 SD down for these 96 hands. The odds of having a 96 hand-session with as poor result as this is something like 1 in 200000 or more (im sure someone can calculate this exactly).

Obviously now im up sh*t creek, still having to wager 1500$ at a casino I am convinced doesn't deal a fair game. Suggestions?

[cipher]

Originally Posted by Freudian

Everything seemed normal. I was a bit up with 1/3 of the wagering requirements for the bonus to go. Then the most insane stuff started happening.

In the next 96 hands I lost 55 betting units (out of 113 units betted). I lost 70 hands, pushed four and won 24. If I calculate everything correctly, I was -4.85 SD down for these 96 hands. The odds of having a 96 hand-session with as poor result as this is something like 1 in 200000 or more (im sure someone can calculate this exactly).

Obviously now im up sh*t creek, still having to wager 1500$ at a casino I am convinced doesn't deal a fair game. Suggestions?

Hi Freudian, suggestion, take your lumps now and do not return to any casino that you suspect of running a rigged game. You'll be much better off in the long term. Have a good one.

[Freudian]

Originally Posted by cipher

Hi Freudian, suggestion, take your lumps now and do not return to any casino that you suspect of running a rigged game. You'll be much better off in the long term. Have a good one.

I try to keep track of the bad ones and avoid them. But this is a sistercasino to Casino on Net, which I have tried previously and thought was dealing a fair game.

Of course there is a minimal chance I just was very very very unlucky.

[caruso]

There is no such casino - you mean "Reef Club". It helps to have at least the name correct in the title. Without the CON reference I'd have been none the wiser.

Assuming 4.8 SDs is 200,000 to one, then you's need a random sample of 200,095 hands to expect one such run of 96 hands. That's within spitting distance of my last two Gambling Federation experiences, and I'd say you have valid cause for concern.

Oh no, hang on, silly me: take a look at the bottom right of the ReefClub homepage and lo and behold, what do we see? "Certified by Ecogra".

So Ecogra, via PWC, have analysed the Cassava software and declared it "fair". And also bear in mind that, within ONE DAY of opening, two years ago, ReefClub tried to screw a bunch of players out of their winnings after their first play:

http://mb.winneronline.com/showthread.html?t=5673

What a joke Ecogra is. Crook casinos, probably crooked software, rubber stamped by Ecogra. I hope nobody invests that nonsense with any credibility.

Freudian: have ReefClub issue you your game logs and post them here where they can be looked at by those posters who might be in a position to draw some meaningful conclusions.

[Freudian]

I finished my wagering requirements and I did pretty well in the last hands. So I am in the strange position of being able to cash out more than I deposited (with bonus) despite suspecting everything isn't kosher with the software. But that doesn't change the fact that during my playing there I had a session that is highly unlikely to happen. And that is always a reason to be weary when we talk about online casinos. And even earlier my eyebrows were raised a bit by five straight blackjacks for the dealer. So basically we have a casino that was ok 85% of the time and insanely rigged 15% of the time. In a way I would be more comfortable calling them out if it felt rigged non-stop. But my wallet surely is grateful for those 85%.

I'll get my money out and request logs. I just checked it through the in-program log function. The bad session ~100 hundred hands isn't such a big sample of course. But to reach almost -5 SD in so few hands the result has to be very extraordinary.

(if the admininstrator want to change the topic to say Reef Club, it would be appreciated).

[caruso]

Five consecutive dealer blackjacks? At ReefClub?

That's a 4,000,000 to one shot. Assuming you're not exaggerating, PLEASE post those logs.

[jetset]

"I'll get my money out and request logs. I just checked it through the in-program log function. The bad session ~100 hundred hands isn't such a big sample of course. But to reach almost -5 SD in so few hands the result has to be very extraordinary."

Yes, Freudian - please make all of your logs public and asap so that the genuine experts here can evaluate the situation. Some unbiased assessment and the facts will make a welcome change from Caruso's "the sky is falling" style posts.

"What a joke Ecogra is. Crook casinos, probably crooked software, rubber stamped by Ecogra. I hope nobody invests that nonsense with any credibility."

A typically irresponsible and inaccurate statement.

[Freudian]

Some small corrections. The in-casino viewer is buggy so it doesn't always show 8 new hands when pressing "next" or "previous" (basically every even 25 it repeats the hands to make the page end on an even 25/50/75/00). So when going through them again it is just 87 hands. I am down 45 betting units in those hands. I noticed two errors I made (not hitting on 12 vs 3, and standing on 16 vs 7 once) so that probably would have brought the result down to -41. Sorry for the mistakes there, I didn't expect the in game log viewer to show some results twice on a few pages. Unfortunately it only extends back 750 hands so the five BJ in a row can't be viewed that way. Have to get them by normal log.

So -41 betting units in 87 hands (100 betting units wagered) gives us -3,82 SD (somewhere around 1 in 10000 chance of that happening), which is closing in on "really really bad luck" territory and away from astronomical. Anyway, I'll have the logs available in a while.

[Freudian]

When asking for logs I just got sent some summary statistics (and 50$ got credited to my account for some reason) and when once again requesting logs I got the following message.

"Thank you for contacting Reef Club Casino.

xxxx, to view your individual hands please go to
"history" in the lobby. You can find the last 750 results of each game you have played there. This is the only records that we keep and it is very easy to access .

xxxx, I hope this is helpful to you. If you have any specific
enquiry we will be happy to check it for you if you give us the time and date
and any other relevant information.

Should you have any further comments or queries please feel free to
contact us at any time. We are here for you 24 hours a day, everyday
and are always happy to help."

So they don't keep logs for your play, which is pretty unusual. I did grab screenshots of all the logs for this bad run if anyone wants it. It is a giant .jpg. Unfortunately the five BJs in a row for the dealer is forever lost since I didn't think of grabbing a screenie of the log when it happened and did play a few thousand hands since then.

[murder1]

Dude don't go through the trouble of download and posting such a large file. Just take your money out and leave. You were fortune enough to survive the rigging. Now get to digging (out).