I hesitate to say this but... is this rogue?

[labeled]

So, this is harsh.. but if you are able to deposit via Visa but are given NO way to cashout.. is that rogue behavior?

I won't name any names, but one I'm thinking of is accredited and the other is a widely respected group. But this whole QT fiasco has been going on long enough to have at the VERY least pulled the ability to deposit if NO withdrawal method is going to be given.

That is really not cool.

ETA: One is NOT, I repeat, NOT accredited - for some reason I thought they were.

 

[Glunn11]

I really don't think this is information that should be hidden from public view. People need to know which places are trapping deposits before they get trapped.

 

[dingdingding]

Taking money without providing a way to pay the players sounds pretty roguish to me...

I'd expect a non-rogue Casino to always try their very best when it comes to paying players their winnings and that should contain stuff like WU too if there's no other option

 

[labeled]

I really don't think this is information that should be hidden from public view. People need to know which places are trapping deposits before they get trapped.

My hesitation stems from the general reputation of the other group.

But for the time being, all discussions of "rogue or not" aside - the Box24 group and Sloto/Desertnights are accepting Visa as a deposit option with no option for withdrawal. Email queries have confirmed that there is no withdrawal option available.

 

[Brooklyn]

I would consider that to be very roguish. I don't understand how these places can sleep at night sometimes.

 

[Marie2473]

What about a check or bank wire? Not possible?

 

[FreeDomme]

These are extraordinary times. (not unexpected) Those casinos that were prepared will prosper. Those that were well funded will survive. If honest and flexible they may even thrive.
Should Casinomeister, aids and loyal followers throw the entire advocacy system that has served players and decent casinos well for so many years into turmoil over the culmination of a five year (assumed if not expected) meltdown? I think not.

Of course the "smart money" (no offense to those who grew complacent and put seemingly well founded trust in a company that should have been immune to seizures) would not expose itself at the moment.

In no way am I implying that you are, but I sense it simmering in many other posts - Rather than start a rumor of the sky falling or fire in the theater or fox in the hen house it might be time huddle up and support the work that must be going on behind the scenes.

Of course exit strategies may be in place, but it has always been, and especially since 2006, caveat emptor - buyer beware.

I suggest that what may have been rogue in one environment may not be today and would hope that information can be shared (some private some public) that will help informed gamblers make informed decisions. This is no time for the weak of knee or spine, nor the person who feels they must gamble no matter what. It's time for inward focus and outward awareness and to help each other through.

 

[FreeDomme]

I have a comical solution If the casino has a maximum cashable amount on a coupon that you take with a deposit, insist on a letter of credit equal to that amount be put in escrow contingent upon the terms. lol just trying to lighten things up a bit.

 

[sparkz]

I know what he means... All Rival casinos do this.

They advertise accepting visa card payments. But what they dont tell you in terms is if you win you wont be able to cashout a thing since they dont pay to cards.

They only pay to E-wallets and they wont pay to an E-wallet unless you have deposited via that method (useless and misleading so players without an E-wallet can see they accept card, deposit but then never be paid cause they dont pay to card so they lose both ways)

Rogue as rogue should be. If they cant pay to a certain method then they should never be accepting deposits via that method... no excuse

 

[anniemac]

Some are more than willing to pay anyway possible (not Rivals, don't know about them).

 

[hannie]

i deposited with entropay visa to sun vegas, on cashout they denied me to cashout back to entropay visa or visa, really bad in my opinion.

 

[sparkz]

Some are more than willing to pay anyway possible (not Rivals, don't know about them).

yea some do but 100% rivals dont.

It happened in the days before I moved away from rivals. I used MB with some but after seeing MB fees and whatnot I decided to never deposit with an E-wallet again and instead exclusively deposit via my debit card and withdraw to it as well (saves the hassle of charges and I know the money will go direct to my bank for me to withdraw).

I remember signing up at new rival casinos. Some I lost $1000's at, but the second I won something and wanted to cashout I saw that card payment option was not there, for most rivals (if not all now) cheque payments were not an option there either.

It was pretty much just MB and a few other E-wallets. I even went through the process of re-activating my MB account. But then the second I put in my MB details for the withdraw and clicked cashout it was refused and said something like "you can only withdraw to methods you have used to deposit". It was too much hassle funding my MB account, then depositing at the casino solely to withdraw $100 so I lost the money and terminated accounts.

Without a doubt all rivals should be in the rogue pit for this since a lot of players wont have an E-wallet. (afterall it takes days if not weeks to set 1 up. The E-wallet takes a certain amount as a small deposit from your bank and you report back how many $'s they took to verify funding to your account. Personally 1 problem I had with MB was I have a UK bank, they operate in USD. Now when they took this "small deposit" from my bank it of course showed up on my statement as GBP. So I had to use a currency converter to work it out... not good since 3 wrong amounts entered and your locked out). So potentially a player can lose $1000's without knowing that even if they won they wouldnt be able to cash a thing out.

 

[dcpam39]

I won off of a free chip at davinci gold, and they told me in chat today that they do not expect to have a way to withdraw, ...ever. Here is my chat!

info: All operators are currently assisting others. Thanks for your patience. You are currently placed in queue number 1. The average wait is 12seconds. An operator will be with you shortly.
info: You are now chatting with 'Coleen'
Coleen: Welcome to DaVinci's Gold Live Support. How may I assist you?
Coleen: May I have your Login name and email address please?
dcpam39: hi, i want to clear my coupon at davinci, and cannot because of no withdrawal
dcpam39: dcpam39
dcpam39: xxxxxxxxxx
dcpam39: can you take care of for me?
Coleen: ok - it's cleared now.
Coleen: Is there anything else I can help you with?
dcpam39: thanks. when will the withdrawal situation be taken care of?
Coleen: We are not expecting it be be resolved.
dcpam39: what happens to the money in the casinos, it will be lost?
Coleen: I don't know. sorry, about that.
dcpam39: okay, thanks
Coleen: Thank you for using Live Support. Should you have any future questions, please contact us again.

 

[Nifty29]

I won off of a free chip at davinci gold, and they told me in chat today that they do not expect to have a way to withdraw, ...ever. Here is my chat!

info: All operators are currently assisting others. Thanks for your patience. You are currently placed in queue number 1. The average wait is 12seconds. An operator will be with you shortly.
info: You are now chatting with 'Coleen'
Coleen: Welcome to DaVinci's Gold Live Support. How may I assist you?
Coleen: May I have your Login name and email address please?
dcpam39: hi, i want to clear my coupon at davinci, and cannot because of no withdrawal
dcpam39: dcpam39
dcpam39: xxxxxxxxxx
dcpam39: can you take care of for me?
Coleen: ok - it's cleared now.
Coleen: Is there anything else I can help you with?
dcpam39: thanks. when will the withdrawal situation be taken care of?
Coleen: We are not expecting it be be resolved.
dcpam39: what happens to the money in the casinos, it will be lost?
Coleen: I don't know. sorry, about that.
dcpam39: okay, thanks
Coleen: Thank you for using Live Support. Should you have any future questions, please contact us again.

That sucks.

Out of interest, why did you ask them to clear the coupon?

 

[Webzcas]

dcpam39: thanks. when will the withdrawal situation be taken care of?
Coleen: We are not expecting it be be resolved.dcpam39: what happens to the money in the casinos, it will be lost?
Coleen: I don't know. sorry, about that.

At least it was only off a free chip

Are they seriously accepting deposits from US players yet have no way or means for those same players to withdraw.

UNREAL.

 

[jstrike]

Eh -- I'm not on any Rivals casinos, but just to clear this up: Visa and MC usually (in countries where they allow 7995 deposits) allow withdrawals back to the card up to the amount deposited. Are you guys saying Rivals-thru-Visa doesn't allow ANY withdrawal to the card it was deposited on? Even if it's less than the deposited amount???

<edit> If nothing else, this should be mentioned to Visa corporate as a gross violation of their terms that's gonna lead to thousands of chargebacks.

 

[Nifty29]

At least it was only off a free chip

Are they seriously accepting deposits from US players yet have no way or means for those same players to withdraw.

UNREAL.

If they are a warning needs to be issued right away.

 

[Glunn11]

Coleen: We are not expecting it be be resolved.

Aside from Betfair stealing money out of bank accounts, this is probably the most rogue thing I've ever seen. In addition to still taking deposits in the midst of all this, they aren't even trying to get a single withdrawal option available. Thank god it was just a free chip.

It's only a matter of time before an unsuspecting gambler hits a jackpot on a Rival, and we'll be bombarded with yet another epic-sized thread.

 

[dcpam39]

That sucks.

Out of interest, why did you ask them to clear the coupon?

I had a max cash out amount, and my balance exceeded that amount. I needed them to clear so i could play other games, vp, etc.

 

[Nifty29]

I had a max cash out amount, and my balance exceeded that amount. I needed them to clear so i could play other games, vp, etc.

Cool, thanks pam.

So they cleared the excess, and then you were free to play without any restrictions? i.e. you could cash out more than the free chip max after that?

Sorry for the questions, but it is an important point as someone had $1000 confiscated in this very same situation.

Cheers

 

[Sloto]

All our members were informed about the departure of UseMyWallet (Quicktender) immediately. We have since informed all our US members that we will have wire option available next week.

We do not behave like a rogue casino and have always been very upfront with all our members!

Ms Sloto

 

[chayton]

If there was no way for players to withdraw, I'd hope that legit casinos would also temporarily suspend accepting deposits from those players - at least until such time as they're able to process withdrawals again.

The uncertainty of "oh we'll be getting something" or "we're working on something" or the "sorry we don't know when" is not acceptable IMO.

 

[labeled]

All our members were informed about the departure of UseMyWallet (Quicktender) immediately. We have since informed all our US members that we will have wire option available next week.

We do not behave like a rogue casino and have always been very upfront with all our members!

Ms Sloto

Great news! But you might want to check that those emails were sent - if the information was shared through email, that is - I for one never received them to my registered email address.

 

[Sloto]

labeled
Please provide me with your username as emails have been sent all week keeping our members up to date with the situation.

Ms Sloto

 

[sparkz]

Are you guys saying Rivals-thru-Visa doesn't allow ANY withdrawal to the card it was deposited on? Even if it's less than the deposited amount???

Yep...

When depositing Visa card is a deposit option

When going to the withdraw section however visa isnt there as a withdraw option... meaning you cant even cashout a fraction of your deposited amount to it. At least 6 months ago I first noticed that, even support at rivals said they cant pay back to visa cards



edit:

Sloto - (guessing your from slotto cash?) Isnt the above true however? That no notice has ever been given that you dont pay out to cards and cant pay to any other method unless the player deposited via that method? Meaning visa card only players can deposit and lose all they want but its only when they win and go to cashout they realise you cant issue payment back to their card (like support at rivals have said). Obviously not having a dig about it directly at you but no other rep has said a thing so far in this thread.

Furthermore havent many casinos (non rival) stated that on a withdraw they must return at least the sum of the deposits to the method the player used to deposit (aka card) for "anti fraud" and "anti money laundering" purposes? Which just goes to show either casinos that say that are talking bull or rivals should not be accepting card payments at all (Personally I believe both to be true)

 

[Sloto]

We have always made it very clear in our welcome email and on our website that we do not pay back to credit cards:

IMPORTANT NOTICE
Due to restrictions imposed upon the Casino by Visa International and MasterCard, we can no longer process any portion of any withdrawal to a Visa or MasterCard credit card including the players' original deposits made by Visa or MasterCard credit cards. All withdrawals will be processed by any of the other withdrawal methods provided and stated in the Withdrawal section of the Casino Cashier.

Ms Sloto

 

[LisasLuck]

We have always made it very clear in our welcome email and on our website that we do not pay back to credit cards:

IMPORTANT NOTICE
Due to restrictions imposed upon the Casino by Visa International and MasterCard, we can no longer process any portion of any withdrawal to a Visa or MasterCard credit card including the players' original deposits made by Visa or MasterCard credit cards. All withdrawals will be processed by any of the other withdrawal methods provided and stated in the Withdrawal section of the Casino Cashier.

Ms Sloto

I played at rivals often until I figured out I had no way to collect if I won. Was not impressed.

 

[NicolasJohnson]

As a Rival Powered operation I'm proud to say we have the ability to pay our US customers via Person2Person transfers where our players get their cash, guaranteed.

Kind Regards,
Nicolas Johnson
Bet Phoenix Casino Affiliates Manager

 

[3mptyseat]

All our members were informed about the departure of UseMyWallet (Quicktender) immediately. We have since informed all our US members that we will have wire option available next week.

We do not behave like a rogue casino and have always been very upfront with all our members!

Ms Sloto

Upfront would be to announce on the deposit page that w/d are currently unavailable and a new method is expect next week...

That, IMO, would be upfront.

Expired Image

but u dont

In fact, its kinda misleading that you say nothing at all, some green players might think, "They must have a w/d method..."

Expired Image

 

[Webzcas]

Exactly.

Seriously ANY casino that currently does not have a solution for players to withdraw, should suspend the ability to fund the casino account. Until such time a new withdrawal facility and method becomes available.

Especially in light of the events of the past week.

 

[dcpam39]

Cool, thanks pam.

So they cleared the excess, and then you were free to play without any restrictions? i.e. you could cash out more than the free chip max after that?

Sorry for the questions, but it is an important point as someone had $1000 confiscated in this very same situation.

Cheers

yes i believe so--i saw the bet phoenix thread so i understand your reference. However, a mute point, (for my situation) as there is no withdrawal method.
Pam

 

[Sloto]

3mptyseat

You didn't click on the Visa option, but if you had you would have seen the message regarding withdrawal options not being available until next week.

We have many loyal members who trust us and wish to continue to deposit which is why the option is still available.

Ms Sloto

 

[Redbush54]

labeled
Please provide me with your username as emails have been sent all week keeping our members up to date with the situation.

Ms Sloto

Really? I haven't received an email.

 

[Redbush54]

All our members were informed about the departure of UseMyWallet (Quicktender) immediately. We have since informed all our US members that we will have wire option available next week.

We do not behave like a rogue casino and have always been very upfront with all our members!

Ms Sloto

Not true.......I haven't received an email of any kind and I just looked and my acct has the correct info.

 

[Webzcas]

3mptyseat

You didn't click on the Visa option, but if you had you would have seen the message regarding withdrawal options not being available until next week.

We have many loyal members who trust us and wish to continue to deposit which is why the option is still available.

Ms Sloto

I personally disagree with this. If at this current moment in time you are unable to facilitate withdrawals to US Based players, then you should also disable the ability to deposit to the casino for the same US Based players.

It is not a case of trusting your casino. It is a case of you might not be able to find a solution no matter how hard you try.

 

[3mptyseat]

WHERE???

3mptyseat

You didn't click on the Visa option, but if you had you would have seen the message regarding withdrawal options not being available until next week.

We have many loyal members who trust us and wish to continue to deposit which is why the option is still available.

Ms Sloto

Screen shot taken two mins ago,,, Where is that message? Any other suggestions?

 

[FreeDomme]

Regardless of email snafus this is one of a handful of casinos that were prepared and won't be going 'south' with deposits. I can understand where it could set a dangerous precedent to say its okay if you really plan to have the facility to pay out go ahead and accept deposits. But the track record of certain casinos should well lay enough confidence for individuals to make educated choices in trust. I have seven casinos I am playing at right now with total confidence. Most were here before QT and they will survive long after the current separating of wheat and chaff.

Some people are making out like the feds won. Other than the unfortunate seeming loss of funds in QT (which they may yet recover) this is not such a bad thing for players at all. There were far too many casinos IMO and if the weak fail, all the better for the players in the long run as long as enough diversity remains for true competition for our dollars.

 

[Webzcas]

Reputation regardless whether good or bad of any casino not withstanding, but in my opinion, no casino should accept new deposits, until they have a facility in place to process withdrawals.

Certainly as a player, I wouldn't deposit at any casino which at this moment does not allow you to withdraw your bankroll. Also as an affiliate and webmaster, there is no way I would recommend such a casino to my visitors.

Reverse Withdrawal is a major pain in the backside and big bug bear of mine. But no withdrawal is ten times worse.

So, Sloto get a withdrawal option up and running next week, all well and good. But in the meantime, the majority of the people who were up there, have gone and played their winnings back, whilst waiting for this withdrawal facility to become available.

It is wrong and is a very short sighted approach.

 

[3mptyseat]

Regardless of email snafus this is one of a handful of casinos that were prepared and won't be going 'south' with deposits. I can understand where it could set a dangerous precedent to say its okay if you really plan to have the facility to pay out go ahead and accept deposits. But the track record of certain casinos should well lay enough confidence for individuals to make educated choices in trust. I have seven casinos I am playing at right now with total confidence. Most were here before QT and they will survive long after the current separating of wheat and chaff.

Some people are making out like the feds won. Other than the unfortunate seeming loss of funds in QT (which they may yet recover) this is not such a bad thing for players at all. There were far too many casinos IMO and if the weak fail, all the better for the players in the long run as long as enough diversity remains for true competition for our dollars.

What makes u think Slotocash is 'prepared' to weather a storm? I don't think they could make it thru a storm that most would dub "windbreaker' weather... And we are headed for blizzard country...

Hell, they can't even maintain the bill for their live chat service, let alone the live chat ops, and thats not mentioning the 12 hour shift they no longer offer CS help during ... All signs point to hypothermia...IMHO.

 

[Brooklyn]

FreeDomme, with all due respect, I don't believe that SlotoCash is doing the right thing and at this time they shouldn't be exempt from using common sense, no matter their reputation.

A strong business with any class would do the right thing and wait for the "storm to settle". It's nothing more than greed for ANY casino to accept deposits without a form of paying out winnings.

Rogue.

 

[FreeDomme]

I totally understand your viewpoints, and I'm not suggesting to anyone else that they deposit. I personally trust them completely and am not the least bit worried that they will have a way to pay me. Call it loyalty or call it naivety. They aren't some 2 bit franchise or fly by night operation and the loss of QT will not ruin them IMO.

It's just not the big drama deal for good casinos every one is making the QT demise out to be. I will play on, others should probably wait it out or choose now to find another pastime.

Its an informed choice. I would think that anyone who would read a warning already knows whats going on anyway.

 

[billy_g22]

I have accounts at Sloto and desert nights. I haven't received any emails from slotocash but have received 3 different emails from desert nights over the last week regarding quicktender and not having a withdrawal option available.

Here is the latest email. received yesterday

Due to the recent loss of UseMyWallet (Quicktender) we have been busy integrating a new wire transfer solution to facilitate withdrawals. We hope to have this up and running by latest Monday and we thank you for your understanding in these difficult cirumstances.

New Game "Heroes Realm" now live!

Desert Nights is excited to announce the launch of Heroes' Realm, a 1-line, 3 reel slot.

Grab your sword and battle axe! Defend your kingdom with Heroes' Realm, Rival's latest 3 reel slot. Icons include the sword, battle axe, daggers, shield, flail, mase, magic vial, skull, and a treasure chest.

Landing on 3 skulls will take you to the bonus round, where you choose your hero to defend your realm from the advancing skeletal army.

Join us today and claim 300% match worth upto $1500 FREE on your next deposit!

Good Luck and have a winning week!

Warmest Regards,

Chloe

Casino Manager
[email protected]

 

[Sloto]

FreeDomme - thank you for your support this is the view of many of our loyal members.

We already have a withdrawal solution which is currently being integrated into our site, had we not got a withdrawal method then we would not be accepting deposits. As for playing back winnings, we often put a temporary block on accounts on request so members do not play back winnings.

I understand all of your comments and I agree with you, however we have a good relationship with our long term members who know the situation and still want the ability to deposit.

As it would seem a lot of you are not getting our emails, we have also set up a lobby message on login to inform members of the current situation and will fix the message issue in the casino cashier.

Thanks

Ms Sloto

 

[Redbush54]

As it would seem a lot of you are not getting our emails, we have also set up a lobby message on login to inform members of the current situation and will fix the message issue in the casino cashier.

Thanks

Ms Sloto

Just checked Desert Nights and Sloto.....not getting that lobby message either. Guess I'm special.

 

[Sloto]

Redbush54 - I have checked your account and the lobby message is there showing as unread. I also notice your account was set not to receive mail, would you like me to change this for you?

Ms Sloto

 

[Webzcas]

We already have a withdrawal solution which is currently being integrated into our site, had we not got a withdrawal method then we would not be accepting deposits.

But you haven't got one available at this moment in time and this is my point.

No matter how you spin it, IMO accepting deposits from players whilst they currently cannot withdraw is wrong.

For instance Redbush is unable to see the lobby message for whatever reason. So unless she read this thread, she could of well deposited without realising she would not be able to cash out at this current moment in time.

The correct and proper procedure would be to disable deposits for all those customers that you are unable to provide a withdrawal facility to. Thus re-enabling the deposit function at the same time, your withdrawal solution goes live.

You cannot convince me your actions on this are the right and ethical course of action to take.

Like I said previously in this thread, your outlook on this matter is shortsighted.

 

[Redbush54]

Redbush54 - I have checked your account and the lobby message is there showing as unread. I also notice your account was set not to receive mail, would you like me to change this for you?

Ms Sloto

I just checked and the lobby message was not there earlier but now it popped up at Sloto.....not at Desert Nights. Very strange because I use to receive emails all the time. Sure make the change. Thanks

 

[FreeDomme]

So many casinos have protracted and "re-delayed" cash outs these days. What 'processed' means at one casino may means something else entirely at another. A rogue action (which none of us would see for perhaps a month) would be for a casino to 'have' a withdraw facility listed as active when indeed they were 'planning on it'. A dishonest casino would use that approach surely.

Personally its a matter of trust now more than ever and if a player doesn't have a loyal place or two to play (with open lines of communication) its probably time to find one or sit it out.