All the signs point to one conclusion.

[Seventh777]

No matter where you look or what you experience first hand in the intricate world of online gambling, it all boils down to one disturbing similarity, and that is no matter which software or favourite casinos you play out, be it the 100% accredited and trustworthy or the more predictably corrupt rogue variety, the end result is alarmingly identical......

Another fruitless deposit that yielded neither a nice hit (even from those diehard old faithful`s we all have in times of need), nor the life saving feature bonus - which if we are lucky enough to hit, in 99% of the cases does not even cover anywhere near the amount of cash it just took us to trigger it.

Stand back and take a few minutes to have a deep look and a good read of the many threads/posts from the numerical websites and forums, cast aside the stereotypical rants from the few that appear to have slipped under the age restrictions net and lost this weeks pocket money, but instead, pay careful attention to the older, wiser, slot veterans, whom mostly play for entertainment and fun values, listen as their posts entail in explicit details how their once weekly deposits, that not many months ago would have brought them a whole nights and sometimes a few days worth of entertainment and joyous moments, have now dwindled down to nothing more than the time it takes them to press the spin button, in comparison with their chosen spin cost divided by their deposit amount.

This is rife right across the board, from the giants at MGS, RTG, Rival, etc, etc, to the stand alone`s, like I say, look deep and hard, every single casino from the good, bad, and ugly, has felt this pinch that is the world recession, and adjusted their software to suit.

Some food for thought...

Every one here must have read the ongoing saga involving This is Vegas and an $80,000 withdrawal request, why would an accredited casino risk losing it`s integrity and good standing, thus jeopardizing it`s own future by refusing to payout a fully legitimate withdrawal request?, do the maths....

Look at around the time the guy had this good run of luck, it was nigh on this period in time that we all started to notice the diminishing returns on our deposits (for those of us that use MGS it was around the time of the 1st updates, for Rival and RTG users - remember the times you could log on with no self updates preventing you from logging on for a few minutes?).

So, the answer to the question, is quite simple really, this guy had the misfortune of hitting really big just before the tightening of the belt was enforced right across the board, they didn`t pay him, because there wasn`t the funds available to pay a win this big, it really is this plain and simple.

Right win, right place, wrong time.

[Mavin1]

I agree with much of what you have said as I and others have pretty much voiced the same observances. However I feel the real impact of what is going on started back in 06 with the UIGEA. Many casinos lost half of their player base when they pulled out of the US market, which has caused a major ripple across all online casinos.

Then having processor problems with making payments, again due to the US restrictions, loss of payment types and white label casinos going from good to a smoldering pile of dung and they have seriously wounded the industry related to them.

There are so many reasons things have gone the way they are and not all players see it, yet. But the day will come where either things will come back around again to what it once was, or online gaming will become nothing more than a once fond memory for so many.

But oh well, nothing we players can say or do about it anyways. So enjoy it as long as you can, for tomorrow you may be looking for other forms of "entertainment".

[blacklabrador]

I too agree with you but to group them ALL into one is not fair. As I have said in the past , I play on Riverbelle and that casino has lost a few games but overall their payoffs have not dropped ONE BIT over the last 3 months like RTG sites have. In fact my cashouts over the last 3 months are larger than the previous 3 months. Does that have to do with the face that i play mostly video poker? Maybe. But when i take a break and dabble on other games ( Isis and Ladies Night) I have had several wins in the $400-1k range, and when I buy in, its alway for $60-$100.

[secret2]

Very well said, guys.

When I played at the Rushmore Group, almost two years ago on a usual basis, and winning on my favourite slot, 'Crystal Waters' and getting the bonus almost every 20th spin and getting the fish x 8 and compare that to now???...blah!...just a small example of how they have, indeed, adjusted the software to the current economic climate.Now , unless it's 'your day to win' the bonus feature hardly appears.

I play at JC, Club World and Inetbet just because they have a fast payout but the payouts are so extremely slim in comparison to a couple years ago. I am wondering about Inetbet more and more not just because of the tightness of the reels but also the CS is short , sharp and cold.

I brought to the attention of Inetbet that their Triple weekend bonus was wrong: the usual 50%, 75% and then 100% bonus showed instead with a 50%, 100% and then 150%. but the terms said otherwise....all I got was a curt reply ...(paraphrasing)...'you want to cancel your deposit'?...well excuse me,I just saved you a ton of grief from a ton of depositing players.!

But anyway..it is what it is. Two more years.

[Mavin1]

I may consider trying Riverbell again, if they allow me back. For the US some of the MG's won't allow former accounts to be re-opened if it has been closed for a period of time. But worth giving it a try.

[blacklabrador]

I may consider trying Riverbell again, if they allow me back. For the US some of the MG's won't allow former accounts to be re-opened if it has been closed for a period of time. But worth giving it a try.

Mav,

You are the 1st person mentioning closing an account at Riverbelle that I can recall. Mind me asking why?

[Mavin1]

Mav,

You are the 1st person mentioning closing an account at Riverbelle that I can recall. Mind me asking why?

I never closed it, just haven't played there for a long time and with some MG's if your account is dormant, they won't let you activate it again. So I will have to see if they will activate my account.
I should have said dormant rather than closed, sorry for the confusion.

[vinylweatherman]

No matter where you look or what you experience first hand in the intricate world of online gambling, it all boils down to one disturbing similarity, and that is no matter which software or favourite casinos you play out, be it the 100% accredited and trustworthy or the more predictably corrupt rogue variety, the end result is alarmingly identical......

Another fruitless deposit that yielded neither a nice hit (even from those diehard old faithful`s we all have in times of need), nor the life saving feature bonus - which if we are lucky enough to hit, in 99% of the cases does not even cover anywhere near the amount of cash it just took us to trigger it.

Stand back and take a few minutes to have a deep look and a good read of the many threads/posts from the numerical websites and forums, cast aside the stereotypical rants from the few that appear to have slipped under the age restrictions net and lost this weeks pocket money, but instead, pay careful attention to the older, wiser, slot veterans, whom mostly play for entertainment and fun values, listen as their posts entail in explicit details how their once weekly deposits, that not many months ago would have brought them a whole nights and sometimes a few days worth of entertainment and joyous moments, have now dwindled down to nothing more than the time it takes them to press the spin button, in comparison with their chosen spin cost divided by their deposit amount.

This is rife right across the board, from the giants at MGS, RTG, Rival, etc, etc, to the stand alone`s, like I say, look deep and hard, every single casino from the good, bad, and ugly, has felt this pinch that is the world recession, and adjusted their software to suit.

Some food for thought...

Every one here must have read the ongoing saga involving This is Vegas and an $80,000 withdrawal request, why would an accredited casino risk losing it`s integrity and good standing, thus jeopardizing it`s own future by refusing to payout a fully legitimate withdrawal request?, do the maths....

Look at around the time the guy had this good run of luck, it was nigh on this period in time that we all started to notice the diminishing returns on our deposits (for those of us that use MGS it was around the time of the 1st updates, for Rival and RTG users - remember the times you could log on with no self updates preventing you from logging on for a few minutes?).

So, the answer to the question, is quite simple really, this guy had the misfortune of hitting really big just before the tightening of the belt was enforced right across the board, they didn`t pay him, because there wasn`t the funds available to pay a win this big, it really is this plain and simple.

Right win, right place, wrong time.

This Is Vegas was NEVER Accredited as far as I know. It just had an active rep when first launched who gave it some "good standing" in the forum. It has always been a "white label". I believe two Rival casinos made it into the list, Vanguard and Slot Power. Shortly after making the grade, they WENT BUST and the Rival shenanigans began. After this, Bryan adopted a policy of "No white labels" in the accredited section.

Rival followed this with one disaster after another, and many more white label operators went bust. Others just started deploying one excuse after another to either delay payment, or not pay at all. It became clear that the driving force behind all of this was that they didn't have the funds to meet all their payments, and thus were heavily relying on other players depositing and losing in order to keep paying winners.

This forms the basis for the impression that This is Vegas simply CANNOT pay out this $80,000 without going bust, so merely being dumped into the rogue pit for non-payment is at least the better option for them. Another casino struggled for MONTHS to pay a mere $20K to a player, although not Rival, it was an indication of the SEVERE problems faced by ALL casinos that rely heavily on US players and US facing processors.

Casinos NOT affected by the US problems are those that have not exposed themselves to the US market for a long time. Even they will face problems due to the general downturn, and consequent fall in luxury spending.

As far as I know, MGS is the least "gaffable" software there is, although this does NOT necessarily include the USA facing "MGS like" casinos since this is NOT MGS, but games and code licensed out to unkown software houses and operators, who MAY have made some changes related to the RTP of the games.

RTG and Rival are probably the most "gaffable" softwares, since we KNOW that RTG operators can change the slot RTPs between around 91% and 97%. We also KNOW that similar facilities were built into Rival software, and despite assurances, it seems that SOME operators have managed to "do the impossible" according to official statements by Rival, and have been daft enough to get CAUGHT doing so by some members here.

Tradition set the ball rolling by having a "trainee" reset Blackjack to pay 1:1 for a dealt Blackjack, a setting that should not even EXIST in a standard BJ game, on top of the fact that the excuse for this was pretty lame (letting a TRAINEE have unsupervised access at this level to the back-end console). Worse, Tradition tried to bluff their way out of the true severity of this lapse, but were caught out AGAIN in these lies by other players. Tradition then simply shut up shop and "did a runner", leaving Rival to clear up the mess (which they DID, and players didn't lose out on balances, and compensation was paid for PROVABLE wrongly paid BJs on the game).

These scandals are what is damaging the trust in ALL software, and it is hard to accept the "bad luck" excuse for a prolonged losing streak. This is not helped when CASINOS find it just as hard to accept that a long term WINNING player was simply "lucky", and look for evidence of "cheating". Some of the reasons for non-payment seem to be from the pages of a fantasy novel, such as "magic" bots that don't just auto-play one hand after another, but that can even "influence the outcome" of the game by virtue of their use.

The TIV case was supposedly an AUSTRALIAN player who had somehow managed to persuade a CHINESE bank to issue him with a CHINESE credit card, which he later used to deposit, and then charge back, losses of $10K.

Even THIS lame excuse was ONLY produced after another issue between this player and SlotOcash was RESOLVED, and related to a much SMALLER amount apparently charged back "on the players account". The fact that Sloto later gave this player the "all clear" meant that this issue was fully resolved, so should NOT have had any bearing on his play at TIV. Despite this issue having been fully resolved between the affected parties, TIV are using this as the mainstay of their excuse for non-payment of the $80,000. Sloto is not even a "white label", but a FULLY INDEPENDENT Rival casino with NO connection whatsoever with TIV other than that they both use Rival software.

.....and they wonder why player don't TRUST them....

[Mavin1]

Well I tried and was denied, oh well . So dormant US, is a no go.

Hi there Evelyn,



Thank you for contacting Casino Support.



Your accounts have regrettably been locked as the casino no longer accepts registrations from the USA. We apologize for the inconvenience. Should you wish to game further, you're welcome to visit our sister casino, Slotastic.



Kind regards,

Peter-John

Player Host

[vinylweatherman]

Well I tried and was denied, oh well . So dormant US, is a no go.

Hi there Evelyn,



Thank you for contacting Casino Support.



Your accounts have regrettably been locked as the casino no longer accepts registrations from the USA. We apologize for the inconvenience. Should you wish to game further, you're welcome to visit our sister casino, Slotastic.



Kind regards,

Peter-John

Player Host

Rather odd interpretation of UIGEA

UIGEA prohibits ALL transactions related to online gambling. If these US facing MGS like casinos can take SOME players, they are no MORE breaking the provisions of UIGEA by taking on new players than they already are by continuing to take money from existing ones.

Before MGS pulled out completely, they allowed EXISTING players to continue playing, but did not allow NEW players to register.

Now, MGS have pulled out altogether, and licenced the code & games to a different operator who is willing to continue to service the US market.

Now, the really ODD thing is that it appears that MGS ARE STILL CALLING THE SHOTS, and this supposedly new operator is bound by the OLD MGS policy of no longer accepting new players.

If this were TRULY what we have been lead to believe, it would be up to the OPERATORS and the current software house as to whether NEW players would be accepted.

I feel the evidence points to MGS STILL being very much in charge of everything that is going on, and this illusion that MGS have tried to pass off that it is now different software is a load of bull.

MGS have never said WHO they have licensed the software and games to, and the operators are equally evasive. It looks like that MGS have NOT licenced anything to anybody, they have merely altered the existing product, stripped it of all branding, taken away enough games to claim it is "different" from a standard MGS casino, and licensed it to the SAME operators in a "secret deal" that allows them to carry on servicing the US players they already have, yet keeps the name of MGS out of it in case things go horribly wrong.

MGS execs should learn from the Neteller execs. THIS WILL NOT WORK!! The Neteller execs were arrested, charged, and convicted AFTER THEY HAD LEFT NETELLER, and more to the point, AFTER Neteller had ALREADY pulled out of the US, which was itself BEFORE UIGEA became law.

WE are not fooled by this, neither I suspect are the US authorities. The ONLY thing happening is that PLAYERS suspect the situation is even WORSE than it actually is, and that these "unknown operators" are potentially operating a "gaffed" version of MGS software because they have the source code to hand under the terms of this agreement. This will all come to a head when an innocent bug that ONLY affects the US version is discovered, which will be interpreted as hard evidence that this variant has been "gaffed", and they have just been caught doing it. How will MGS counter this without contradicting the current "official line" regarding the circumstances surrounding the move of US players to this new, but very familiar, software.