how slots work, what do you guys think?

[bb28]

This thread has been an interesting read......indeed.

[Mousey]

Originally Posted by NASHVEGAS

Unless you happen to be be playing a continuous shuffle machine of B&M BJ (and most casinos tried to pull that-CSM'S-off on a few tables and realized it was not going to fly), then you have to know the online "random shuffle" of BJ does not apply at a B&M. (Assuming Mousey you were speaking of all games and not just slots,ftr)

Sorry, I should have clarified... I was referring to B&M games that have RNG vs. the same type online games (slots, VP, etc. -- in other words, machines). BJ (and other card games) is a totally different animal as a computer RNG should have nothing to do with B&M card shuffler.

FTR... Hubby got the 'creeps' whenever he (rarely) played BJ online. He won't touch it anymore. No, we have no 'proof'. We only know it just doesn't play like the same game.

And I am NOT saying online BJ is rigged, I'm only saying it just doesn't feel right to me. Rather like showering w/my socks on, the end result may be acceptably the same, but getting there just doesn't feel right.

[lojo]

I get the distinct 'feeling' when playing online card games that it creates a 'result' that is statistically random, not that it is a process that produces random results. Does that make sense? Because I would stake my gut, not my mind on this question. It just doesn't feel 'right'.

[peteyweestro]

you really notice how unrandom the numbers seem to be sometimes when playing one of my fav games on mg...poker pursuit

[kimss]

Originally Posted by hippo925

but here's an important point: IF slots work in cycles, whether one big one (a machine with lots of lines) or a bunch of small ones, AND no one purposely messes with it.... isn't it still gonna be pretty random for any of us that play? i mean, does it really matter HOW a slot is programmed as long as no one who plays it knows any more than anyone else?

True... Unless... Say the system is aware of good and bad portions of the cycle. Say after a win you will be served bad portions of the cycle until you lost your way back to 90% payout - then are served a good portion again? This is my MG theory. Anyways.

Originally Posted by hippo925

the real issue is if a slot can have multiple algorithyms for things like different bet sizes, country of origin, bonus user, etc.... that's the part that scares me, though i don't think i have seen obvious signs of that in all the years i've played slots.

It's quite known that lowest bet size will give many more lower wins - while max bet will give fewer low wins but higher ones. Several online sites, and documentaries on casinoes and sllots confirms this. (Not to say own gameplay) This has been discussed several times before aswell.

Originally Posted by lojo

I get the distinct 'feeling' when playing online card games that it creates a 'result' that is statistically random, not that it is a process that produces random results. Does that make sense? Because I would stake my gut, not my mind on this question. It just doesn't feel 'right'.

You don't say... I think the MG BJ is a slot like everything else, except that the spin is shown with cards instead.

[lojo]

Hippo, I wasn't able to find the cct article that specifically denotes the number of generations in a 'cycle' and how many generations per second, etc. but HERE is a list of good articles to peruse. The only item I take exception to in all of their information is that they repeatedly state that it 'is illegal for Nevada slot machines to vary payback per coin size' whereas NGC rule # 101 states:

... and for slot machines which have a difference in theoretical hold percentage which exceeds 4 percent for a single-coin play
versus maximum-bet play...

[Mousey]

Originally Posted by lojo

...... The only item I take exception to in all of their information is that they repeatedly state that it 'is illegal for Nevada slot machines to vary payback per coin size' whereas NGC rule # 101 states:

Lojo... have you access to a magazine called Strictly Slots? Month after month they list payback percentages for slots (by denom) in Nevada, AC, etc. Just thought you'd find it interesting.

[vinylweatherman]

Originally Posted by kimss

Also, I must add. One of the companies here in town made alot of headlines in the local press here. What they did was the following.

They had slots in thir office, sat wagering wagering wagering until they got the jackpot, then they put the slots out again for others to play... Oh they made money this way, since the machines ate huge money back! They also got some bad press out of it since this man wasn't excactly a nice guy.

They could easily do this, since they was informed about the cycles and such from their slot, and since two jackpots do not occure within the same cycle.

Another one, tihs is funny! Have you ever heard of the times the machines have a bug which can be manipulated? So that you get a sure win all the time, happends on new slots! I myself have emptied slots this way.

But here is the kicker - when you have done this, have you ever played on the slot afterwards not using the trick? Loooser, you will not win shit!
I wonder why!

Again, knowing all this - hence my belief on online slots. Since noone else is fair, I doubt the online ones are. What count's in the end is the payout % - this is the numbers being served to the public and this is what is looked at as fair play! Aslong as you get that % you should smile and be happy - it's all good.

Probably made for export, here in the UK by Barcrest

[NASHVEGAS]

Originally Posted by Mousey

Lojo... have you access to a magazine called Strictly Slots? Month after month they list payback percentages for slots (by denom) in Nevada, AC, etc. Just thought you'd find it interesting.

So does it's more widely circulated sister magazine "Casino Player". May be able to find the monthly list(s) Mousey refers to at www.casinocenter.com, the higher the denomination,the higher the payback percentage across the board regardless of location (State).

[NASHVEGAS]

Originally Posted by lojo

Hippo, I wasn't able to find the cct article that specifically denotes the number of generations in a 'cycle' and how many generations per second, etc. but HERE is a list of good articles to peruse. The only item I take exception to in all of their information is that they repeatedly state that it 'is illegal for Nevada slot machines to vary payback per coin size' whereas NGC rule # 101 states:

Originally Posted by Mousey

Lojo... have you access to a magazine called Strictly Slots? Month after month they list payback percentages for slots (by denom) in Nevada, AC, etc.Just thought you'd find it interesting.

Originally Posted by NASHVEGAS

So does it's more widely circulated sister magazine "Casino Player". May be able to find the monthly list(s) Mousey refers to at www.casinocenter.com, the higher the denomination,the higher the payback percentage across the board regardless of location (State).

An example from the October 2006 issue for the State of Nevada