when did they outlaw gambling online in canada?

**happygobrokey** · 10th May 2007, 06:51 PM

i went to get the aforementioned western union wire from betroyal, see all about this in "bonus issues - withdrawing with sticky bonus", and they (at money mart/cheque cashing place) said given the size of the request they had to ask what it was for etc. so i had to admit it was from gambling and that i did not personally know the sender (girl spelled "know" as "no" on her little post-it) and then she went and called someone for ten minutes or so, and came back to tell me they can't process it because gambling online is illegal in canada. wtf! so now i gotta figure out some way to sidestep this, which means more weeks to get my money. just a heads up to beware using western union for withdrawals, fellow canadians. this blows hard! it is not illegal, ffs, i hate america! so i gotta go sort this with betroyal now. on the plus side i did get out and get my betta fish and a hair cut as well. but now i'm flippin poor. i hate having all my money tied up like this. and now to find out that it is supposedly illegal to be gambling at all... oy vey!

edit: plus the money mart and also wu now have all my personal info and a heads up that i gamble. i sense suckage in the future. and fwiw i actually did the physical gambling back when neteller was open to canadians so i think these cashouts in any event are still legitimate (ie not proceeds from committing the "crime" of gambling). it just gets rougher and rougher. dammit

**me_and_ed** · 10th May 2007, 07:22 PM

Originally Posted by happygobrokey

i went to get the aforementioned western union wire from betroyal, see all about this in "bonus issues - withdrawing with sticky bonus", and they (at money mart/cheque cashing place) said given the size of the request they had to ask what it was for etc. so i had to admit it was from gambling and that i did not personally know the sender (girl spelled "know" as "no" on her little post-it) and then she went and called someone for ten minutes or so, and came back to tell me they can't process it because gambling online is illegal in canada. wtf! so now i gotta figure out some way to sidestep this, which means more weeks to get my money. just a heads up to beware using western union for withdrawals, fellow canadians. this blows hard! it is not illegal, ffs, i hate america! so i gotta go sort this with betroyal now. on the plus side i did get out and get my betta fish and a hair cut as well. but now i'm flippin poor. i hate having all my money tied up like this. and now to find out that it is supposedly illegal to be gambling at all... oy vey!

edit: plus the money mart and also wu now have all my personal info and a heads up that i gamble. i sense suckage in the future. and fwiw i actually did the physical gambling back when neteller was open to canadians so i think these cashouts in any event are still legitimate (ie not proceeds from committing the "crime" of gambling). it just gets rougher and rougher. dammit

I had the same thing at the Money Mart, it is not illegal, however due to the U.S act that was introduced I think W.U has bunched North America all together.

**happygobrokey** · 10th May 2007, 07:58 PM

so what do i do now? i'm on live chat with the manager of the casino, he said i oughtn't have mentioned gambling, but they bluntly asked because of the size of the wire what it was from, so what could i say? and now i've said what it's for, is it earmarked and i can never have it wherever i try to pick it up? i specifically went to money mart because the wire was in US$, and would need it changed to canadian. can you recommend a place that will do it or am i beat? aj is "just checking" now if he can stop the payment and he's just now been informed they have sent it and it's gone, so it is up to me to somehow claim it, and they can never recover it. i never opted to have it sent this way, i was originally told it was going to moneybookers, and only found out some two weeks later they wired it and here's the number go get it.

**me_and_ed** · 10th May 2007, 08:13 PM

Originally Posted by happygobrokey

so what do i do now? i'm on live chat with the manager of the casino, he said i oughtn't have mentioned gambling, but they bluntly asked because of the size of the wire what it was from, so what could i say? and now i've said what it's for, is it earmarked and i can never have it wherever i try to pick it up? i specifically went to money mart because the wire was in US$, and would need it changed to canadian. can you recommend a place that will do it or am i beat? aj is "just checking" now if he can stop the payment and he's just now been informed they have sent it and it's gone, so it is up to me to somehow claim it, and they can never recover it. i never opted to have it sent this way, i was originally told it was going to moneybookers, and only found out some two weeks later they wired it and here's the number go get it.

If you know somebody say a family member, send the money to them and have them withdrawl it, it will cost more but at least you can get it.

**happygobrokey** · 10th May 2007, 08:31 PM

i can't get the wire myself though. they won't pay it to me. how would i be able to send it to someone else. the casino says they can't get it back either. they told me to just try somewhere else and this time avoid mentioning gambling. rather tongue-in-cheekly i told aj i would tell the western union this time it was an "outstanding debt" which if you read my thread on betroyal you would get how that's funny. which indeed it is, as in truth the casino zeroed my balance and all my winnings, then voluntarily gave me all the money back and are sending it to me. so in reality the funds are just money they gave me after taking all the real winnings. so in a sense it is already laundered.

and if it comes to that, that is they still won't pay because it's been previously revealed to be a gambling win, i will tell the guy how the casino screwed me months ago and just now they up and paid me via western without my knowledge and that i don't intend to be using the wires for this purpose it just happened that way. in truth, when i played it was before any of the storm had blown over to canada, so the actual gambling in question was good to go at the time, just the payout is coming at a time when its legitimacy is for some reason in question. here i go to (sort of) commit fraud by now lying about what the money is for. is this really one of those situations where its generally accepted for one to lie, like it is on say a resume or to avoid heavy taxes on a private car sale? i feel so dirty, which is why i openly admitted what the money is from the first time round. i better not get arrested or anything. fuck!

**I<3Microgaming** · 10th May 2007, 09:24 PM

Wow that blows hard man. Awful to hear that. Damnit Western Union was really, really useful.

Can't you use EFT instead? EFT is fast, virtually free, no questions asked, money in the bank. That's what I'm using from now on.

Thanks for letting us know, now we can officially scratch off WU here in Canada

**eduun** · 10th May 2007, 09:33 PM

Its a person to person send, you don't have to disclose anything to an western union agent. I work in accounting at a grocery store that does western union and it is not a policy of western union to require that agents ask any personal questions, even if they think it is a suspicious transaction. They are just being nosy, just go to another agent and dont reveal a thing, except to say that it is money owed, etc. It is the policy of western union not to fund gambling transcactions, which is why you were denied your transaction in the 1st place.It is the reason why casinos make it a person to person send.

**Pinababy69** · 10th May 2007, 10:21 PM

I replied in the other thread Happy, but honestly, it has nothing to do with the US or what's gone on there in the last six months. Western Union (North America) has always had a clause in their T&C's that WU is not to be used to fund online gambling, or something to that effect. Of course it's never stopped many of us and many casinos from using it. For awhile before UIGEA, many Micros even had WU set up as a deposit option within their banking interface. But they went through Western Union Europe which is/was a totally different business entity. You would have had the same reaction two years ago if you'd said it was from gambling, long before UIGEA.

I would have thought that someone who has read this board as much as you have would have known NOT to mention online gambling to Western Union. Not trying to rag on you, just a little surprised is all. You should have told them that it was payment for a computer job, that you're a computer consultant or SEO specialist or something. Anything but gambling.

I'm not sure if your transaction has now been flagged in the system or not. But if I were you I would do as the above poster suggested. Go to a different Money Mart and try again. And have a story ready in case they ask. And if it has been flagged, try telling them that the original agent misunderstood. That you weren't gambling online, but simply did a job for an online company. Research, SEO, marketing....anything but gambling. It's worth a try.

**happygobrokey** · 10th May 2007, 11:03 PM

thanks guys. yes i ought to have known, but i wasn't expecting any interrogation, precisely because it is none of their business. and as it works out, i did hurry out to another place and it got through just fine, no questions asked. my guess is that money mart would pay in cash, where the next place i tried (the cash store it was called) cashed cheques by giving out a card with preloaded funds, or in the case of a wire they can also provide a cheque to deposit to one's bank. i took this option and with any luck the funds will be cleared in my bank after the usual span.

if indeed they do something like flagging my transaction not to pay me, what would happen to this money since it's already been wired (and according to the casino who sent it me) and once the funds are taken from the sender they are not recoverable? any time someone mentions it's from gambling then it becomes dead money that wetern union can just pocket? surely that's criminal.

and also in my case i never wired any money to a casino, so pina what you say about funding gambling is not entirely true. i know what you mean though, it still is moving money on behalf of and implicitly in support of gambling, but i never paid any attention to wire options since the only thing i know is they come with hefty fees of 15-40 dollars most times. i did not intend to get these funds via wire, it just happened that way, and hopefully all is well now... so it's all good, knock on wood

**Pinababy69** · 10th May 2007, 11:15 PM

Could you have taken your money via the preloaded card option Happy? Or was the only option the cheque? I would have taken the card (if I could), and hightailed it to the nearest ATM machine.

In any event, I'm sure the cheque will clear just fine. If WU had flagged the transaction in the system, I'm almost positive you wouldn't have been able to pick up the money in any form.

As to WU confiscating the funds, I believe that after a certain time, any transfers not picked up by the receiver, get returned to sender. It's happened to me before when WU stopped allowing any transactions to Antigua for a time. I had sent through a shitload of them to Grand Prive (this was a long time ago), and months later I got a call from WU to go to my nearest agent and retrieve the funds as they had been denied. I then got cheques in the mail for the fees that were involved. And the cheques all cleared just fine. I'm pretty sure that WU was well aware they were gambling funds, which was the whole reason that all transactions were denied in the first place. Had they started questioning me, I would have told them to kiss my ass. But then again, I've always been a bit of a rebel.