Planetluck stole $8200 from me

**aodat2** · 31st January 2006, 08:53 AM

Originally Posted by phynqster

Dubi,
Great win, and good thing you kept all of the corespondence. I have one question though. Did you use a credit card for deposit or did you use an e-wallet? I know when I ran a casino, I banned players from Israel because we would have a number of players come in and deposit by credit card and all made large wagers on roulette. The ones who lost, charged back, the ones who won demanded imeadeate payment. Thats why I asked about the credit card deposit.

I'm not entirely understanding what difference does it make by using a Credit Card or an e-Wallet, phynqster.

Dubi made only a $100 deposit. Got their 100% bonus. Played roulette and won some, then went over to flat bet BJ to fulfill their WR (like a normal Bonus Abuser would) and he even admits that he's somewhat a bonus abuser. But the fact is that they denied him payment because he played Roulette before fulfilling the WR.

This to me is a very clear cut case that the Casino is actually trying to stiff him and till now, they are actually doing a very good job at it. As a listed company in the London Stock Exchange, is this the way to conduct themselves?

Also, since you've run a casino before, could you give us all some advice as what to do if we do encounter such problems in the future? How do we go tackling this problem and etc?

**jetset** · 31st January 2006, 10:38 AM

Dubi, a word to the wise. I understand that you feel cheated and angry, and believe me I can sympathise with that. However, when you communicate with corporate execs at groups like Party Gaming, keep your cool.

Be hard and factual by all means, and let them know that you intend to push this matter as far as is necessary, but keep a level of control and a businesslike courtesy. A lawyer's letter works even better in illustrating your absolute determination, and tell them you will hold them responsible for your legal costs at the end of the case.

Listed companies are particularly sensitive to issues that may generate adverse publicity, especially in strong, genuine cases such as this one.

**caruso** · 31st January 2006, 02:27 PM

I cannot believe iGlobalmedia will not be officially rogued at Casinomeister for this behaviour. This case is as open and shut as they come.

Bryan, what is the status your end? Did you get onto them, and if you did, did they get back to you?

Dubi, don't go pissing away fistfuls of cash on the legal eagles until you absolutely have to. Tell Party Gaming you WILL be suing them if they don't pay you, but hold back on involving lawyers until there remains no other option.

**mitch** · 31st January 2006, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by phynqster

Dubi,
Did you use a credit card for deposit or did you use an e-wallet? I know when I ran a casino, I banned players from Israel because we would have a number of players come in and deposit by credit card and all made large wagers on roulette. The ones who lost, charged back, the ones who won demanded imeadeate payment. Thats why I asked about the credit card deposit.

I think this is a reasonable question for Dubi to answer and also to confirm that he has never made a cashback after losing such a bet.

Lets be honest how many ordinary players are going to make such a play?

These type of bets are not being made for the fun of gambling they are designed purely and simply to take advantage of bonuses especially sticky ones.

Play like this is going to set a red flag at any casino and get you labelled as an advantage player because they are the only players who will make such a bet.

Also as advantage players are only interested in turning a profit how could such a player be reasonably certain he was going to make a profit, without cashback, given the huge variance on this type of bet? Such a player would know he could hit 100 casinos consecutively and lose every bet, hard to imagine very many people of ordinary means risking such big sums. If the player was rich he wouldn't bother.

Of course if a group of people got together and pooled resources and all agreed to play the same way and to share winnings amongst the group then the variance problem almost certainly disappears and casinos are facing a huge bonus bill.
Perhaps Dubi would also like to confirm whether he is a member of such a group.

If casinos detect such activity do people think they should still pay?

Do people on the forum approve of such behaviour, given the impact it has on casinos changing T&Cs and the general restrictions it places on the average player?

If players do approve perhaps Bryan can arrange to set up a 'Meisters' player group and we can all coin it in.

(joke Bryan!)

Mitch

**JohnGalt** · 31st January 2006, 07:11 PM

Mitch, there's no evidence or even suggestion that any of that is what went on. Also, note that the wizard of odds recommends betting exactly this way with a sticky bonus.

**mitch** · 31st January 2006, 07:31 PM

John

I usually make an all in bet with a sticky bonus but not on a single number on roulette. (I consider this a sensible and reasonable play and casinos seem to think so to as I have always been paid without question.)

I agree this is advantage play but not of the gross kind of the roulette bet.

The huge variance on such a bet would mean there could be no guaranteed profit ( you have to factor in the odds of a casino refusing to pay on those few occasions when the bet hit) in anything like a reasonable time scale unless I was part of a group or I didn't really intend honouring my part of the bet.

It does not surprise me that some casinos consider such gross and obvious advantage play as crossing the line into bonus abuse.

Dubi claimed in his first post that he played Roulette initially for his own fun. ( one bet all in then switched to blackjack, yeah right!)

Anybody believe that statement for starters?

Mitch

**dubi123** · 31st January 2006, 08:40 PM

Thank you Jetset for the advice, I really took it too seriously but that's me, I lose my sense of Humour when it comes to cheating.

I used NETeller and never charged back. I will never charge back even if the caisno has not return the deposit(by the way they never return the deposit because they want me to play again the signup bonus with 200 in the account , now they put another 200 as a "compensation")

I never charge back, they do not worth my time lying for them.

Any chargeback concern lying even if they have not paid you with no reason , because you tell the Credit company you never dealt with them and this fact is a lie.

Anyway no chargeback is involved not here not in the past. I always deposit by NETeller.

**vedat** · 31st January 2006, 09:08 PM

hello i saw there is something like this at www.playersclubcasino.com
at winners section they put that girl into winners storys and i am sure they payed her you can see me there at winner section

))
"
Bet it all
November 3, 2005

'tt' (USA) deposited $100 and received a $100 match bonus. Not often players put it all on the table in the very first bet, but with $100 each, the 5 and the 10 must be her lucky numbers. Only a single spin of the roulette ball was needed (10) to convert the accountsum to $3600.

Congratulations,
Player's Club Casino team"

**GOCC** · 1st February 2006, 11:03 AM

These terms of Advantage players always brings a rye smile to my face.

Lets say for example the are 2 shops in a precinct. They are both selling exactly the same plasma TV. This plasma TV is the dogs whatsit.

Shop A, selling it for £2999
Shop B, has a sale on and its £2499

I buy the TV from shop B.

Does that make me an advantage shopper never to be allowed into Shop A AGAIN

At the end of the day, we have £x for betting. If I can get X +20% from someone, I will.

If the casinos dont like advantage players and just want mugs, well they are in the wrong business. They need to factor in advantage players into their WR.