What's the deal with Party's MTT w/rebuys?

[winbig]

Was playing in the Sunday $1M satellite tonight, and saw some interesting stuff. Seems if you go under your starting chipcount in a rebuy tourney, you can rebuy - in the MIDDLE of the hand. IE: Start with 3k, build it up to 15K, but add a rebuy if a bet/call/raise results in your chips going under 3k.

What's the deal with this? You've got people just adding and adding to their chipcount by abusing this "feature".

Is this indeed a "feature" or a true bug? I've never seen it like this at any other poker room.

[NoMouthToScream]

That is most definitely a bug and those who abused that feature should get their funds confiscated immediately. Party needs to do something about that.

[sweetdenny]

Not sure whether it is a bug winbig or just a feature of the tournaments but it was there a while ago when i stopped playing there. I thought they would have sorted it by now if it was a bug but guess not as allows the pot to be get a lot bigger guess helps meet the guarantee they set for tournament.

It doesent really matter all that much to myself either way as it just creates bigger stacks to pay me off after the rebuys end. If you play a lot of multis im sure youll know the game doesent start till after the rebuys have ended.

Also next time your in a multi take a note after the rebuy ends who the top ten chip stacks are then look back when the final table starts you will see very rarely the top ten after the break reaches it.

So my view is they have just added more value to the tournament for yourself so either play there and enjoy the easy chips or try any of the other dozens of sites that dont do this.

No-Mouth-To-Scream why on earth are you calling for the people who do this to have there funds confiscated they are doing nothing wrong the facility to do this is there they use it yet you think they should have the funds confiscted.

The facility is available to anyone so just because some use it and some dont no one should get penalised what next conficating funds as someone took an add on at the break.

Its no wonder casinos and poker rooms are so quick to conficate funds when even players first words are now confiscate the funds then get full details.

[pokeraddict]

This has been a long time bug at Party that they do not seem to care about. I can not imagine they would confiscate funds for exploiting a well known "feature" of their software.

[winbig]

Thanks...


There's a few valid points...yes, more times than not you'll get paid off after the rebuy period ends - IF you last that long. These donks getting 10-15+ rebuys really don't give a crap in the early going if they win the hand or not. They'll push all in with sh!t (can't tell how many times an 11-1 underdog preflop has came out on top by the river), not caring if they win the hand or not, because they (in their thinking) are losing (in this instance) 3k chips less of the stack whoever else called them with. IE: They push in with 10K, only one caller with 5K. The caller wins, Mr. 10K gets a rebuy for 3K before the hand is over, they're only out 2K - with a chance to win 5K overall.

If you're the one on the other end of these donks and don't want to sit in and have multiple rebuys, it's really an unfair advantage - if you don't want to play their game and spend a good sum on rebuys. IMO this "feature" turns the tourney into a BINGO match until that first hour is up.

As far as funds being confiscated, that's a little overkill. As it was said before, apparently it's a well-known "feature" and of course people are going to abuse the hell out of it. I realize now it's definately in Party's best interest not to get rid of this "problem", as they're making a % off each rebuy & addon, and the rare times that they don't make up for a guaranteed pool tourney, they definately cut what little loss they may have.

[guesswest]

The rebuy system just goes by the chip count as it registers, so if they have chips out on a bet that doesn't count. You're right that it shouldn't be allowed, but I'm sure the reason Party don't do anything about it is because it increases tournament prize pools and thus eventually their bottom line.

Question is more why you don't like it? I think it's a huge advantage having players do that. Like you say, their thinking is erroneous, because in your example they're not 'winning' an extra 3k like they think, they're paying for it. It just creates easier opportunities to pick up chips and a larger prize pool to boot. It does spike the variance having to show down more hands but it definitely creates more value, in much the same way more or less any kind of bad play from your opponents will. The majority of PP tourneys are freezeouts if it's not your thing, but I think there's way more value in the rebuys on there for these kinds of reasons.

[bpb]

Question is more why you don't like it? I think it's a huge advantage having players do that.

Playing with a large stack is an enormous advantage for a good player. It is worth paying double or triple the entry fee to start with double/triple the amount of chips.

That is most definitely a bug and those who abused that feature should get their funds confiscated immediately.

This is one of the stupidest comments ever posted on this board.

[guesswest]

Playing with a large stack is an enormous advantage for a good player. It is worth paying double or triple the entry fee to start with double/triple the amount of chips.

Of course it is, that's why it's advantageous having players that'll reliably pay you off when you're in with the best of it. The OP wasn't talking about guys that tactically try and double or triple up at the beginning, he's talking about the frantic rebuying maniacs you see on there pushing hand after hand.

The fact that it's an advantage having a big stack with a positive expectation game does not mean it's a good idea to shove and rebuy with every other hand, which is what some of these players are doing. These guys frequently reach the break needing FT minimum just to break even, and no matter how skillful you are you just can't achieve that reliably enough to justify that strategy. Not to mention the fact that it's not even very effective for stack building unless it's done in strict moderation - by the time you've doubled up once or twice the value is gone and you risk losing way more than you can add by rebuying when you push.

This is one of the stupidest comments ever posted on this board.

Is fair enough if you disagree with this poster, but some manners wouldn't go amiss.

[winbig]

The rebuy system just goes by the chip count as it registers, so if they have chips out on a bet that doesn't count.

Just goes to show you what PP is after...nothing but the $. Every other site I've seen, it will tell you the rebuy will be processed at the end of the hand. If, at the end of the hand you're not eligible, you won't get it; plain and simple

Thanks for the points, all good ones..


But like I said before, if you're on the losing end of one of these idiots pushing in with rags early on just to get their rebuys, and you don't want to spend the $ on 2-3 rebuys, then you're SOL, and the tourney was a waste of time...you won't even get into a position of letting them pay you off in the end.

Don't get me wrong - rebuy tourneys are great, but not the way PP has them setup.


edit: Cool little factoid - (lol, even the pros do it)

Past Fun With Rebuys: Daniel Negreanu actually made 27 rebuys (for a total of $28,000) in this event [
EVENT #14 ($1,000 NO-LIMIT HOLD'EM WITH REBUYS)] back at the 2004 WSOP. Investing that much money meant Negreanu would have had to finish 8th or better in the 538-player field to actually turn a profit. He finished third.

John Juanda reportedly had 11 tournament chips worth $1,000 each, ready for instant rebuys. Daniel Negreanu had 30. Michael "The Grinder" Mizrachi was seen going all in blind for six consecutive hands, and he easily crossed the $10,000 mark with rebuys.

(from http://www.pokernews.com/news/2006/7...ary-july-8.htm)

[ace4suited]

When i have played in their rebuys you couldnt rebuy mid hand and i am confident that has not been the case at least for 3 months if not for ever.

Their way of doing rebuys is different from others in that you do not need to be below a certain number of chips to rebuy. This means you can sit out of the first hour - or only play aa, kk etc and then just rebuy 9 times to be in a strongish position going into the 2nd hour. They create a lot of free chips floating arround from crazy play. What I would say is that you need a really healthy bankroll for these so if you are in a 33$r you need say 150$ to be willing to put into that tourney - and thats with little chance of moneying.

Because there are loads who dont last to the end of the rebuy period you can get the equivalent of buying in at a disount if you are willing to treat it like a 150$ tourney.

I would say the 33R is just about one of the best value of the +50$ buy in tourneys to go for but you need a really health bankroll for it. Normal rebuys are bad enough for your purse but these are crazy. There is some pretty poor play for the effective buyins going on so you need to be willing to risk chips to really exploit this. There are a lot of great players in these games but some of them are just using them to unwind so are often playing their D game