Casinos & hacking

[tallnthatsall]

Hi All,
I'm new to the forums, my name is Julez & I've been lurking for years, just never felt I had anything important enough to post about. However, having been a frequent player with the JackPotFactory group of casinos, I feel compelled to warn others and also hear others' views of an issue that just reared its ugly head.

This really shocked me that anyone would think that this is o.k. and is acceptable. I've been playing at the JPF casinos for years, I played so much I was invited to join their VIP Lounge (by invitation only). For years I thought this group to be very credible, and like anywhere, I've had some good sessions, and some bad, but all in all, I was pleased with this group, their customer service, their software and their comps. I was not aware that MicroGaming was pulling the plug on the US market.

Fine, nothing too shocking about that move. I was not aware that is, until a few days ago when I tried logging into my VIP Lounge account. Not only could I not do so, my VIP software was nowhere to be found on my computer. MY VIP software had miraculously turned into All Slots software. I know, All Slots is a member of JPF, however, not only had the software been changed without my knowledge, it was done in such a devious manner that it had the same icon as VIP software, had the same location on my hard drive, but it was different software. So, I emailed VIP support asking what was going on, i.e., does JPF support uninstalling/downloading/installing (essentially do they support hacking into their members' computers) of software without the consent and knowledge of their members?

I also asked if perhaps I had missed an email or some sort of notification that this was to occur to the software on my computer. I also asked if I missed some sort of notification that VIP was no longer going to accept play from their US members (I had only found this out after scouring the VIP Lounge web site after this incident occurred). Meanwhile, I know that I did not receive notification of any of this. Well, JPF pretty much confirmed what I already knew with such an insulting, wish-washy, lame response, that convinced me that I will never play at a JPF casino again.

Not only did they not answer any of my questions, not only did they skirt the entire US Player issue, but worse, they did not respond to my question regarding the installation/changing of software, nor did they acknowledge the compromise they had done to my computer. They did however inform me that I may now play at All Slots! Thanks, very good of them to allow me to play anywhere and do me favors of forcing the software.

Some may think this is an over reaction on my part, however if one thinks about it, this is a no-brainer, and it is devious, underhanded and ignorant to do any type of alteration to software without a warning to the owner of the computer on which the software is installed. Sure they own the software, but they do not own my computer. Therefore when someone compromises my computer without my permission - they are no better than distributors of malware/grayware/virus/trojan, etc.

When I realized that the VIP software on my computer had been messed with and I did not feel like using their All Slots casino, I tried logging on to three other casinos that are installed on my computer. Guess what? The software of the three other casinos had somehow been altered. Two of them I could not even open, and the other had been compromised to the point that even though I could log on, I could not navigate within the casino. These other casinos were not MG software, and they are casinos that welcome US players. I realize I have no way of proving that JPF altered any other software but their own. But this is exactly why this should never, ever be done by any casino, or by anyone regardless of who/what they are or represent.

I am an IT Pro. I know my computer. These programs had been running flawlessly until JPF decided to 'do me a favor' by switching software on my computer without my knowledge. Yeah, their software works, has functionality, but none of my other online casino progz are functional.

I'm sorry for the rant, but I really think this is a huge issue that folks need to be aware of. To me the integrity & credibility that I had once thought JPF to posses has gone down the toilet. The email in which they responded to my questions was so disrespectful, insulting and lame that it made them appear not only deceitful but also ignorant.

For all the US players out there; if you have been playing at any of the JPF casinos, and in the event you have not received an update from JPF, you will now be welcomed at only one of their casinos, that being All Slots. I'm assuming if you are already a member of the JPF family, you are grandfathered and will be allowed to play @ All Slots. Heads up; your computer may be compromised by JPF when you are not looking, so don't bother to reformat/reinstall your operating system (as I had) - it's only those jokers over at JPF messing around where they have no business, changing stuff on your hard drive!!!

Go figure.

Because I am an IT Pro I take this stuff very seriously. There is nothing in JPF's terms that address this. I would love to learn of issues like this with JPF or other groups/casinos that are thought to be credible. I would also be interested in knowing if any other US members of this group received any sort of notification regarding this issue. According to the email they just sent me today, in response to the above questions, this was in effect May 25. Because of this issue, I am now in process of re-evaluating all online casinos and wondering if they all do this crap. If they all do this or similar, it is just not worth the small entertainment value that they offer.
Again, sorry for the rant, and thanks not only to the site but also thanks to all the savvy contributors to the forums.

Cheers,

Julez

[zap987]

I really don't see the issue, all casinos modify their files now and then to update the software or they could never release any new games or fix any problems. This time it changed some graphics including the name of the casino but not really different than any patch to any program.

[HadEnouth]

I really don't see the issue, all casinos modify their files now and then to update the software or they could never release any new games or fix any problems. This time it changed some graphics including the name of the casino but not really different than any patch to any program.

You should be notified when your software updates and most trustful software lets you know when updates are being appiled. updates done without warning and even makes complete changes of software is just wrong... If they do that, bloody hell knows what info they look at on your computer. Like a trojan. You gived the casino software promission threw your firewall, So they are free to spy on you.

[footdr]

there are several casinos that I simply cannot load no matter how I change security settings they download spyware that my virus program continually reports as a high threat. The only way to load these Casinos is to disable my virus, spyware and firewall protection. Something wrong with that picture.

[tallnthatsall]

The issue is that a.) what is the big deal for the casino to relay the issue of US Players not being able to play at the casino that is on our computer, rather than herd the user into the casino they choose. (I feel it should be my choice if no longer welcome somewhere - my choice as to determine if I want to have that new casino on my computer and use that casino.) b.) when I noticed that my VIP software had become transformed into another casino software - at that time I did not realize that All Slots was a member of the JPF, there is nothing within the software interface to indicate that. c.) the switch in the software was not just a graphical interface change, there was also a member ID and password change (of which I was not aware of, of which I did not have which rendered that software useless unless I had that info). If one can view this as o.k. and merely as a software upgrade - perhaps when they decided to take it upon themselves to change a program without my knowledge, they should have also installed with the change whatever member ID and password they intended for me to use.
I'm aware that software must be updated, however when that occurs I have not noticed a software publisher to change the title, change the user ID & password, along with totally changing the GUI to where it looks nothing as it did. With all the rogue casinos out there and all the hijackers/hackers, etc, how is one to know that the software that all of a sudden has a new title and a new GUI and a new member ID is legit?
Again in their terms there is nothing stated that they have the right to totally change the casino that you have on your computer in order to reroute you to a different casino of their choice.
Never mind, I guess they were just too busy with all of their 'updates' to communicate the fact that US Players could no longer play at any of their casinos except for one. Since I posted the first time about this, I have spoken with a couple of my friends that used to play at All Jackpots (member also of JPF). The same thing had happened to them and they were not aware of what was happening either. I guess if this is not a big deal, I will go sit in the corner now and again become a lurker to these forums cuz really, I just don't get how this is o.k.
Sorry, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, I respect the fact that you have one, even though it is way different than mine!
Cheers

[tallnthatsall]

Yes, HadEnough, that was precisely my point. If it is not a big deal for them to do that and if there is nothing underhanded intended, then they should be very upfront & forthcoming about that information, i.e., let the user know that their software is going to be changed, not just updated. As you also pointed out, a trusted publisher will alert the user of this.

[zap987]

I agree, they should definitely have informed you what was going on, even more so if they changed your login information. Just think that is the issue here, not the changes to the software.

[tallnthatsall]

I have received further communication from a rep of JPF. Again, the issues that I have raised were not addressed. The rep had mentioned (among other b.s.) that what I had experienced was "merely a software update". "The software was merely updated to the new version. Software always updates itself in any case."

Puuhhhleeaaaseee!!

'A software update'!!!?? I find this disturbing that anyone thinks this is an acceptable answer. Additionally, I'm insulted that they played this off as an update. This is not acceptable, nor should it be used as an excuse for their aggressive behavior. There is no excuse!! For years, any and every time there was a new MGS game release, I was flooded with emails, announcements, & promos describing the new release, and also informed of when to look for the release. Whenever I logged into my account at any of the JPF casinos there were notices, ads and promos on the home page also giving notice of new releases. Additionally, at some point, not sure of when, US Players were given notice that they would no longer be able to play progressive games. A short time later, US players were given notice that we no longer will have access to new releases, and will not be able to play them. There had been no problems with these communications to keep the player informed. So, in relation, when it came down to a huge change, informing their US players that they are no longer supported, and informing their US players that whatever JPF software they have on their computer will be 'updated' to a new version, will have a totally different appearance, and renamed to All Slots, and that they are on their own when it comes to logging into the 'update' because they not only wiped out the user log in info with their update, they neglected to give any new log in info leaving the whole thing blank informing us of anything was not priority in their communication efforts. They knew these changes were to be implemented well ahead of their May 25 cut off. Their behavior sure stinks of unethical to me.

Again, the changes to the program on my computer should have been at my choice, not theirs and I should have been informed in no uncertain terms that as a US player I am no longer supported. To not inform was clearly a choice made by whomever, and the change-out of the software clearly a thought out action (a ruse) ensuring that JPF software remained on US computers for whatever reasons. I have my theories as to what their reasons were, however I will refrain from going there.

I am not about to complain about depositing $$ at their casinos, of course that was my choice. However, I do feel that since my contributions and other US players' contributions to their earnings should have been considered by them; and at minimum, we should have been given some type of notice, given a bit more courtesy and their actions should have been given much more thought b-4 taking it upon themselves to implement the change for us. Why anyone in any type of business would think that their customers do not need to be informed is beyond my understanding.

Re footdr's post:
there are several casinos that I simply cannot load no matter how I change security settings they download spyware that my virus program continually reports as a high threat. The only way to load these Casinos is to disable my virus, spyware and firewall protection. Something wrong with that picture.

Indeed, you are correct, and thanks for pointing that out. I have yet to find the installation of any online casino that does not prompt my AV to give me notice. I am ashamed to say, I had ignored the warnings as being false-positive. My bad. There is indeed a reason why we are given notice, and I am beating myself up for choosing to ignore my AV. In retrospect, that was naive and ignorant, and a big lesson learned.

[vinylweatherman]

I have received further communication from a rep of JPF. Again, the issues that I have raised were not addressed. The rep had mentioned (among other b.s.) that what I had experienced was "merely a software update". "The software was merely updated to the new version. Software always updates itself in any case."

Puuhhhleeaaaseee!!

'A software update'!!!?? I find this disturbing that anyone thinks this is an acceptable answer. Additionally, I'm insulted that they played this off as an update. This is not acceptable, nor should it be used as an excuse for their aggressive behavior. There is no excuse!! For years, any and every time there was a new MGS game release, I was flooded with emails, announcements, & promos describing the new release, and also informed of when to look for the release. Whenever I logged into my account at any of the JPF casinos there were notices, ads and promos on the home page also giving notice of new releases. Additionally, at some point, not sure of when, US Players were given notice that they would no longer be able to play progressive games. A short time later, US players were given notice that we no longer will have access to new releases, and will not be able to play them. There had been no problems with these communications to keep the player informed. So, in relation, when it came down to a huge change, informing their US players that they are no longer supported, and informing their US players that whatever JPF software they have on their computer will be 'updated' to a new version, will have a totally different appearance, and renamed to All Slots, and that they are on their own when it comes to logging into the 'update' because they not only wiped out the user log in info with their update, they neglected to give any new log in info leaving the whole thing blank informing us of anything was not priority in their communication efforts. They knew these changes were to be implemented well ahead of their May 25 cut off. Their behavior sure stinks of unethical to me.

Again, the changes to the program on my computer should have been at my choice, not theirs and I should have been informed in no uncertain terms that as a US player I am no longer supported. To not inform was clearly a choice made by whomever, and the change-out of the software clearly a thought out action (a ruse) ensuring that JPF software remained on US computers for whatever reasons. I have my theories as to what their reasons were, however I will refrain from going there.

I am not about to complain about depositing $$ at their casinos, of course that was my choice. However, I do feel that since my contributions and other US players' contributions to their earnings should have been considered by them; and at minimum, we should have been given some type of notice, given a bit more courtesy and their actions should have been given much more thought b-4 taking it upon themselves to implement the change for us. Why anyone in any type of business would think that their customers do not need to be informed is beyond my understanding.

Re footdr's post:
there are several casinos that I simply cannot load no matter how I change security settings they download spyware that my virus program continually reports as a high threat. The only way to load these Casinos is to disable my virus, spyware and firewall protection. Something wrong with that picture.

Indeed, you are correct, and thanks for pointing that out. I have yet to find the installation of any online casino that does not prompt my AV to give me notice. I am ashamed to say, I had ignored the warnings as being false-positive. My bad. There is indeed a reason why we are given notice, and I am beating myself up for choosing to ignore my AV. In retrospect, that was naive and ignorant, and a big lesson learned.

The rep is completely wrong. This was NOT the usual "MGS update", but a MASS MIGRATION of the entire US player base to new software that had licensed a number of games from MGS, as well as the various "look & feel" aspects that would normally be considered to be covered by trademark. This software is NOT MICROGAMING, it merely contains some Microgaming games, and so far nothing else.

A far better solution would have been to send all affected players an email with a link to download the new software. This would have ensured a "clean install", and would probably NOT messed so many other things up on your system.

MGS software is notorious for cocking-up PCs, and a full clearout and reinstall from new would be far better. As well as screwing things up, I bet this method of migration has left GIGABYTES of useless "crap" behind from the earlier incarnation, along with many references in the registry pointing to the wrong files (those from the old MGS, rather than the new software).

Others have reported various problems resulting from this migration, and I have had many problems from nothing more than the regular monthly updates.

Every now and then, I uninstall everything MGS, and do a clean install. I often find that software upgrades and in particular internal file/folder reorganisations, have left behind large amounts of useless data. I have also experienced errors resulting from incorrectly set registry values, where an update has made a dog's breakfast of a major update.

One particular dog's breakfast related to the move from "program files" to a COMPULSORY install location on the C drive, where existing casino files were relocated and DUPLICATED, leaving behind a mess of unwanted files, along with incorrect registry pointers. The only way to fix this was to uninstall, and then manually delete the rubbish left behind, followed by a clean reinstall.


I suggest that US players clear out MGS and this new migration altogether, and do a clean install of those casinos they have been migrated to. This should ensure the most stable installation, and fewer errors.

Uninstalling MAY restore those other casinos too, it is possible this migration created conflicts with other casino software.

[tallnthatsall]

The rep is completely wrong. This was NOT the usual "MGS update", but a MASS MIGRATION of the entire US player base to new software that had licensed a number of games from MGS, as well as the various "look & feel" aspects that would normally be considered to be covered by trademark. This software is NOT MICROGAMING, it merely contains some Microgaming games, and so far nothing else.

A far better solution would have been to send all affected players an email with a link to download the new software. This would have ensured a "clean install", and would probably NOT messed so many other things up on your system.

MGS software is notorious for cocking-up PCs, and a full clearout and reinstall from new would be far better. As well as screwing things up, I bet this method of migration has left GIGABYTES of useless "crap" behind from the earlier incarnation, along with many references in the registry pointing to the wrong files (those from the old MGS, rather than the new software).

Others have reported various problems resulting from this migration, and I have had many problems from nothing more than the regular monthly updates.

Every now and then, I uninstall everything MGS, and do a clean install. I often find that software upgrades and in particular internal file/folder reorganisations, have left behind large amounts of useless data. I have also experienced errors resulting from incorrectly set registry values, where an update has made a dog's breakfast of a major update.

One particular dog's breakfast related to the move from "program files" to a COMPULSORY install location on the C drive, where existing casino files were relocated and DUPLICATED, leaving behind a mess of unwanted files, along with incorrect registry pointers. The only way to fix this was to uninstall, and then manually delete the rubbish left behind, followed by a clean reinstall.


I suggest that US players clear out MGS and this new migration altogether, and do a clean install of those casinos they have been migrated to. This should ensure the most stable installation, and fewer errors.

Uninstalling MAY restore those other casinos too, it is possible this migration created conflicts with other casino software.

Thank you very much for your very informative post. Your explanation is entirely what I had suspected, and it is now blatantly obvious why the issue had been at first totally ignored when I queried their actions, and when it finally was addressed I was given a bogus answer. Regardless of their reasoning for taking it upon themselves to 'migrate', I still feel this was an intrusion and a liberty that should not have been taken by them or anyone else. If they feel it is o.k. to install software other than MGS on my computer and they feel it is o.k. to 'migrate' me (I feel just like a sheeple) without my knowledge, where do their silent install actions stop? As I mentioned in a previous post, for years I thought JPF to be very credible. Their aggressive actions, lack of notice of their actions, lack of explanation and finally their b.s. explanation when asked of their actions has left a very bad taste in my mouth. It has also led me to be suspicious of their integrity.

Regarding your statement; A far better solution would have been to send all affected players an email with a link to download the new software. This would have ensured a "clean install", and would probably NOT messed so many other things up on your system.
Exactly my point. Because at the same time this 'migration' was implemented other progz began acting shifty, although I can't prove it was the result of their actions, it does leave lingering questions. Seems to me that if there were the slightest possibility of this occurring, anyone with any integrity would have thought twice about this intrusion.

Your suggestion of the clearing out this migration is excellent and is something I had already done; however I do believe that thoroughly clearing it out i.e., clearing/cleaning the registry is beyond the average computer user's capabilities, thereby leaving the average user with useless crap spread all over their computer. By that I mean useless to the user, I'm not so confident that it is useless to the casino.

Again, I appreciate your taking the time with your detailed post. Too bad such care did not come from JPF.