Interwetten - won't refund deposit

[mikehendi]

Hello,

I recently deposited at Interwetten (using moneybookers), and after some trouble, they stated that I recieved the 50% signup bonus they offer in my account. But because I was unable to find the bonus in my account, I changed my mind about playing in their casino.

So, I forfeited the bonus, and tried to cash out using moneybookers again. Unfortunately, This wasn't possible! They state that my first cashout MUST proceed with a bank wire transfer, for "security reasons".

I've played at about 10 different online casino's, and at about 8 online pokerrooms, but I have never had any problems cashing out with the same way I deposited (always neteller or moneybookers).

I emailed support, and after a few mails, this was their final answer:

- You must withdraw with a bank wire transfer because of anti-money laundering policies

- If you deposit, and then withdraw again WITHOUT wagering, we will keep 10% of your deposit!


My question is: Are these normal policies? can they just keep 10% of my deposit because I changed my mind about playing?

If needed, I will post the entire email conversation here.

[GrandMaster]

You must withdraw with a bank wire transfer because of anti-money laundering policies

Interestingly, most casinos will insist on least the amount of your deposit to the source where it came from, supposedly also to prevent money laundering.

If you deposit, and then withdraw again WITHOUT wagering, we will keep 10% of your deposit!

It does cost the casino money to process deposits and withdrawals. You are better of playing your deposit once on blackjack, you are likely to lose less than 10% of your money.

[winbig]

You are better of playing your deposit once on blackjack, you are likely to lose less than 10% of your money.

Or if you wanted to split hairs with them, bet the table minimum on one hand of blackjack and try to cash out then.

They said "without wagering", but failed to say how much wagering is required. Any bet placed should cover it.

[vinylweatherman]

Irrelevant, the casino reneged on an advertised 50% bonus, and is therefore in breach of contract. Player should get 100% return of deposit, and if hair splitting is in order, an additional sum to compensate for the breach of contract. If the casino did indeed add the bonus, then their levels of customer service are very poor indeed, otherwise the player would have been helped to find and play this seemingly missing bonus.

The statement about money laundering laws is bullshit, there is apparently no such thing, either for those casinos that blame such laws for requiring deposits to be returned to their origin, or for those few that just make it up as they go along, as in this case. If it were really down to "money laundering regulations", each and every casino, sportsbook, or poker room would have identical policies.

Many players would LIKE to be paid by bank wire, but funnily enough, THOSE players are told it can't be done, and they have to accept their money back to their deposit method, or by cheque. Just goes to show that casinos really ARE LYING about this - they have some hidden agenda, but are trotting out lies to obscure what is really going on.

[Rob]

Irrelevant, the casino reneged on an advertised 50% bonus, and is therefore in breach of contract. Player should get 100% return of deposit, and if hair splitting is in order, an additional sum to compensate for the breach of contract. If the casino did indeed add the bonus, then their levels of customer service are very poor indeed, otherwise the player would have been helped to find and play this seemingly missing bonus.

The statement about money laundering laws is bullshit, there is apparently no such thing, either for those casinos that blame such laws for requiring deposits to be returned to their origin, or for those few that just make it up as they go along, as in this case. If it were really down to "money laundering regulations", each and every casino, sportsbook, or poker room would have identical policies.

Many players would LIKE to be paid by bank wire, but funnily enough, THOSE players are told it can't be done, and they have to accept their money back to their deposit method, or by cheque. Just goes to show that casinos really ARE LYING about this - they have some hidden agenda, but are trotting out lies to obscure what is really going on.

I wonder did the OP check if the bonus was on the pending bonus bit of the account section in game?

And all that nonsense about breach of contract, the casino always has a rule similar to this one "14. Management decision is final. No discussion will be entered into.". If they decide they are going to charge you for depositing then withdrawing straight away that is their choice.

And hidden agenda, wtf are you talking about; its only dependant on what withdrawral services each casino supplies, and you know it changes from place to place. Most casinos let you deposit/withdraw via the same method. And any evidence to prove that those who want to withdraw by bank wire are told they can't, and those that dont want that method are forced into it?

[vinylweatherman]

I wonder did the OP check if the bonus was on the pending bonus bit of the account section in game?

And all that nonsense about breach of contract, the casino always has a rule similar to this one "14. Management decision is final. No discussion will be entered into.". If they decide they are going to charge you for depositing then withdrawing straight away that is their choice.

And hidden agenda, wtf are you talking about; its only dependant on what withdrawral services each casino supplies, and you know it changes from place to place. Most casinos let you deposit/withdraw via the same method. And any evidence to prove that those who want to withdraw by bank wire are told they can't, and those that dont want that method are forced into it?

There are numerous complaints about casinos forcing unwanted withdrawal methods on players. The casino here is blaming EXTERNAL regulations, if it down to merely the whim of management, they are STILL LYING by trying to blame "laws" for what is merely the whim of management.
Most casinos insist on paying back to the method of deposit. In this case, Moneybookers. There is no question here that being able to refund back to Moneybookers is something that ALL casinos can do if they have a merchant account there to accept the deposits. The hidden agenda is that they are not willling to disclose why they REALLY can't refund to Moneybookers, but the recent Playtech/Neteller issue has given the game away. Casinos were using every trick they could think of to resist paying out to Neteller, in order to hise the fact that they had not been verified by Neteller, and thus were not allowed to add fresh funds to their merchant accounts. This meant that they could ONLY pay back to Neteller what they had collectively received in deposits. These casinos, were, in effect, "money laundering" their way out of the crisis by using the funds that Neteller would not accept to pay players by other methods where they were able to get the funds accepted for transit - this was usually payment by cheque.

Their reasoning of "security" is also bogus, "security" is best served by refunding back to the method of deposit. Refunding to a different bank account, one that the player has given them, is less secure, and would also be an excellent way to defraud someone's Moneybookers account and get the money out by another method before Moneybookers could be alerted and act. The casino would then leave itself wide open to a "chargeback" from Moneybookers, but would no longer have the funds, and neither would Moneybookers, they would be in a bank account.
For security purposes, it is the document check that verifies the player, and most casinos will hold up any withdrawal until they are happy with the player's details.

[Rob]

Ah, didn't realise this you see. Cashouts for me have always been pretty straightforward.

[uungy]

i still have about £100 stuck in payspark(probably they have taken £10 a week for not using the account now) when bellerock decided to pay it out like that, even thogh i requested it to neteller. (they only let you withdraw your balance mninus £10 for charges, incase you go over etc)

so there is definatly something behind this payment saga

[vinylweatherman]

i still have about £100 stuck in payspark(probably they have taken £10 a week for not using the account now) when bellerock decided to pay it out like that, even thogh i requested it to neteller. (they only let you withdraw your balance mninus £10 for charges, incase you go over etc)

so there is definatly something behind this payment saga

Can't you just drop this into another MG casino?

Payspark were/are based in Lebanon, and had some kind of crisis a while back. I was given a Payspark account by BelleRock (and another by Jackpot Factory), but resisted temptations to activate it, but they did try to get me to use it. I was right not to do so, because after their crisis they just seemed to vanish with player's funds - they did not return contact attempts, and the accounts were inaccessible for a while. I think they rebranded as EZpay, and work for non-US players at MG casinos.

There was certainly something behind this, as they breached privacy rules, as well as financial regulations, in opening accounts without permission. They did this despite this particular "bank" being in Lebanon, not exactly a stable part of the world where players could be confident their funds were safe.

There is certainly something else going on, there is an increase in casinos having "anti Neteller" rules, often buried in general terms and conditions, and some also extend this to Moneybookers. At the same time, new payment methods are coming on stream and being promoted by special offers, not draconian penalty terms, as was once the case with Neteller and Moneybookers. Seems they want players to move away from tried and tested ewallet solutions in favour of these new upstarts that have little in the way of track record. Apart from the US and Canada, there is no reason why other players should be cajoled away from Neteller and Moneybookers, with the protection of UK and Isle of Man regulation, in favour of new and untested options regulated by "who knows".

Click2Pay is still being promoted, yet is far more problematic than Neteller and Moneybookers, and Clickandbuy has sprung up, a very similar sounding name as Click2Pay making me think there is some kind of connnection.

[gerilege]

They simply don't provide moneybookers as a payout option for me even after several cashouts, only wire transfer.

Edit: I removed wrong assumptions, because of explanation in reply to my post