Problem with Crystal Palace

**mdeitrick** · 14th November 2006, 03:04 AM

I'll get right to the point. I tried to get this sorted out with their manager in private, but that doesn't appear to be going anywhere. I played at Crystal Palace and received their first deposit bonus, and lost everything, deposit and bonus, $0 in my account.

I deposit again and claim the second deposit. Their terms and conditions say that you can't have any balance in your account when you claim the second bonus, and I remember checking my account balance right before I deposited just to make sure.

SO, I go on to win almost $900 in addition to the bonus I received. And when I try to withdraw, after fulfilling all of their terms, I'm told that ALL of my winnings, and the bonus are being confiscated by the casino, because I had a balance of $60 when I deposited.

On to Montana Disputes we go. I file the dispute, and apparently as soon as the casino made their counterclaim, they closed the case, even though I dispute several facts of their case. They claimed that there was a balance of $60 in my account one week BEFORE I deposited, but AFTER I lost all of my money from the first deposit. They're claiming they have an "auto-cashback" feature, that puts money into your account somehow, even though there's no mention of it on the website, and the money wasn't showing up on my balance (which said "0") when I deposited.

So, there are several compounding problems and arguments which make the casinos claim pretty dubious in my mind:

1. There was no balance in my account when I deposited. I'm willing to assume that this is simply a computer glitch or inadvertant human error until I see evidence otherwise, but there definitely was no money in my account.

2. Even if there was a balance in my account, the terms and conditions at Crystal Palace don't have a clause, like many online casinos, that says something to the effect of "if you violate the terms of this bonus, the bonus amount will be forfeited".

3. Even furthermore, assuming I was ineligible to receive the bonus, there is nothing in their terms about losing winnings if you violate their terms and conditions. So again, even if there was a balance, there's entitling them to confiscate the $900 or so in winnings; they're only entitled to confiscate the bonus money.

Like I said earlier, I hope this can get worked out without any allegations of cheating or lying, but needless to say I am very upset about being denied over $1000 on a minor technicality, which I didn't even violate. And I think Montana Disputes needs to re-think how they gather information and make rulings, because there was absolutely no chance for me to dispute the claims of the casino.

**umberto** · 14th November 2006, 04:04 AM

Good Luck.

**vinylweatherman** · 14th November 2006, 05:19 AM

They can get away with this because it is RTG. This could not happen at Microgaming as Cashcheck will prove the case, showing the deposit entering onto a null balance.
As this is Crystal Palace, this comes as no surprise, they seem to have the attitude of looking for reasons to not pay, however technical, rather than assuming that 99% of winners should be paid without quibble.
Microgaming has a similar glitch where the audit software fails to recognise a zeroed balance after a bonus, but with Playcheck and Cashcheck it is easy to verify the exact sequence of events.
It would seem that Montanna disputes just rubber stamp the casinos decision to give it more weight - it's hardly independent arbitration.

Challenge the casino to produce evidence of the exact time the $60 cashback was credited, this should not be a problem for a reputable brand that takes safeguarding the customer's money seriously.
Secondly, determine the exact time of the second deposit from when it was deducted from you deposit method.
See which came first, the chicken or the egg, or in this case, the cashback or the deposit.

**dresden** · 15th November 2006, 01:02 PM

They tried a very similar thing with me the one and only time I played there. They didn't claim any cash-back was inserted to my account. They just said I deposited and recieved a bonus while already having a balance. There is no chance this happended. None. The casino took my balance. I was dreading having to go through the Montana process. Eventually, after calling several times I was instructed to send detailed email whch would be considered by accounts. Much to my surprise, they admitted their error and refunded my balance to my account. I don't want to cast any unwarranted aspersions but perhaps this is a tactic.

In the OP's case I would think this would be detectable by looking at the transactions history in the cashier. But then, they might say this 'auto-cashback' leaves no record. This appears devious to me.

**dc9999** · 20th November 2006, 09:59 PM

Please see my issue under the "Bonus Issues" section. It is a reply to a thread titled "Crystal Palace is a scam artist".....

Bottom line:

This casino - and many RTG licesees - continue to make life miserable for their customers. And that's a shame especially in light of recent US legislation making it more difficult (if not impossible) for many of us to engage in this activity.

Back to the Crystal Palace Gaming Group: they say "history repeats itself", and when you objectively analyze the antics of these guys...all you can do is shake your head and say "wow".......