Resolved Palace Group Rules Shenanigans

[gingeanth89]

I recently had a terrible experience with Spin Palace of the Palace Group.

I made a new account, deposited £150 and got a 100% matching bonus. Balance £300. Ive checked their terms and conditions and I can play 3 Card Poker which is great because thats what I normally play at land based casinos.

1st Hand, bet 120, call - lose.
2nd Hand, bet 60, fold
3rd Hand, bet 90, fold
4th Hand bet my remaining 30 quid and hit a straight flush! Happy Day! £2700.

I go to withdraw, but my balance is locked as the wager requirements have not yet been met. I play slots, eventually clearing the wager requirement and then cash out a tidy £2400.

I receive an email from Spin Palace asking me for ID and then another email offering me a 20% bonus on the full amount if I cancel my withdrawal with no strings. Tempting though this is, Im a bit short on funds recently so I decline the special extra bonus and ask them to just pay me.

Two days later I check my neteller account and The Palace Group have deposited £150 with me. WTF? I immediately contact support and ask them where the rest of my money is. They email back and say that their risk department has confiscated my winnings and the decision is final. After a few more emails they quote the following rule:

"Your withdrawals are more likely to be confiscated due to you breaking the terms and conditions of the casino. As per casino terms and conditions, before any withdrawals are processed, your play will be reviewed for any irregular playing patterns e.g. playing of equal, zero margin bets or hedge betting, **placing single bets using your entire or the majority of your account balance and bonus**, all of which shall be considered irregular gaming for bonus play-through requirement purposes. Should the Casino deem that practices such as this have been utilized, the Casino reserves the right to withhold any cashins and/or confiscate all winnings."

Here`s a quote from the eCogra ruling (against me)

* 1st bet, wagered 120 – 40% of balance and bonus and lost
* 2nd bet, wagered 60 – 33% of balance and bonus and lost
* 3rd bet, wagered 90 – 75% of balance and bonus and lost
* 4th bet, wagered remaining 30 and won 2700 with a straight flush – 100% of balance and bonus

Your 3rd and 4th bets are in breach of the clause and as such the operator is within his rights to withhold any cashins and/or confiscate all winnings. When the operator reviews an account for irregular playing patterns they take the original bets, the way in which wagering was met and other factors into account before making a final decision.

Im shocked. I didnt increase my bet size but because I was losing and my balance was going down the percentage of my balance being bet was going up.

A simple argument shows just how unfair this rule really is. If I had deposited £10 and gotten a £10 bonus then played jackpot slots at £1 a spin, losing the first 19 spins then hitting a big jackpot on the last spin I would have wagered 100% of my balance on the last spin breaking the rule and had my winnings confiscated. Does that sound fair to you? The whole Palace Group has this term hidden away deep in their Terms and Conditions. They all have the eCogra "safe and FAIR" seal. What was I supposed to do? Decrease my bet size after every loss to stay within their rules? What about if I had..Eventually Id be betting £1 a hand..then 50p...then 25p and so on and so forth to inifinty. I feel like I have been straight ripped off by this group. Your thoughts Casinomeister members? Anyone else had this sort of experience? I am doubly gutted because I found the casino on the Casinomeister accredited list and they are eCogra registered. I didnt think anyone on these lists would risk their good standing by hiding behind this sort of terrible rule which seems clearly designed to claw back wins in any way possible.

A very unhappy Spin Palace/Palace Group customer.

Anthony

[Casinomeister]

FTR Anthony had PABd and we looked at the terms and conditions, and whether we like it or not, they were broken with the last bet with the 4th Hand.

http://www.spinpalace.com/uk/terms.asp

Before any withdrawals are processed, your play will be reviewed for any irregular playing patterns e.g. playing of equal, zero margin bets or hedge betting, placing single bets using your entire or the majority of your account balance and bonus, all of which shall be considered irregular gaming for bonus play-through requirement purposes. Should the Casino deem that practices such as this have been utilized, the Casino reserves the right to withhold any cashins and/or confiscate all winnings.

If it wasn't for the clause that describes the "irregular betting pattern" I would have ruled in favor of the player. But the terms and conditions cover this - as do all of the Fortune Lounge and Palace group casinos.

Even though many of us may not like these terms, they are there. The casino has the right to dictate how bonuses are played out.

IMO the terms and conditions should state "majority of the deposit and bonus", not "majority of the balance and bonus" or even "majority of the balance".

The casinos (most FL and Palace Casinos) ought to revisit this term to make sure they aren't catching dolphins in the tuna net.

[Casinomeister]

And to nip this in the bud beforehand, this is a Casinomeister issue, not an eCOGRA one. Do not derail this thread. Thank you.

[lots0]

With rules like that...

I think this outfit needs to be blacklisted... Even if they are 'covered' by ecogra and their 'rules'.

This is outrageous... In my opinion this is nothing more than theft by the casino.

sarcasm - why not just have a rule that says players can't win? Oh how stupid I am... that is the rule they quoted...

[spiderlegz]

Off in to my personal rogue pit (E: which is big and deep already). Pure and simple theft, hope they go bust.

That term could be used to void any winnings when your balance is low enough.

[chuchu59]

This is pure theft. The 4th hand was played at a value that was less than the previous 3 hands although it counted for 100% of the balance. What if only $1 was remaining. Would a bet of $1 count as 100% and winnings of $90 be confiscated. What if he had bet $29? Would they have paid? Shouldnt the terms and conditions mean a percentage of the original balance rather than the remaining balance. That would make more sense in my opinion.

I am also outraged by the fact they offered a 20% bonus to the player if he cancelled his withdrawal. Sounds like Club Dice (Playtech) is back. This offer, to a certain extent, implies that they were willing to process the withdrawal and did not find any breaches of the Terms and Conditions during play. I hope that we can be shown this email from Spin Palace. Meanwhile, if Spin Palace continues this kind of rogue behavior they are just spinning themselves into trouble.

[lots0]

I am just doing a review of all the Palace Group casino's rules... If they all have this 'rule' I will add them all to my sites blacklist today...

[Mousey]

I'm terribly confused.... (I know, doesn't take much to confuse me when it comes to casino T&C)

If this player had LOST that last $30 bet would his deposit have been returned ... since he broke their T&C?

Let's say this player had $25 left (looking at the last hand) and he went to slots and bet $25 on ONE pull on say... Legacy.... and then won... would this still break their T&C?

[chuchu59]

Having read everything again I am doubly convinced that the balance that was referred to was the original balance of $300 and not the remaining balance of $30 for the 4th hand and $120 for the 3rd hand. Frankly, I would have felt more comfortable if they pointed their fingers at the 1st hand which was of the greatest value for the 4 hands in question. Frankly how can you say that within the same bankroll where you only played a few hands, the bet with the lowest value was the culprit that broke the bonus rules. Hogwash!

[doomed4ever]

Well the Terms really suck. Yet another for my own pit to avoid in the future. Vague terms which basicially mean we dont have to pay you if we want. Totaly sucks but then always read the small print and if doubt just dont go there. I know I wont be.