NO JOY AT "CASINOJOY"

[kassiap]

Hi All


I really do like throwing myself into the "guinea Pig" role with some of these new casinos.I think i just really enjoy the stress of it all

Anyway on to my (or shall i say theirs) latest victim;

"casinojoy" really needs to work on the customer service they already seem to think is the best in the business.

First off the 800 number they have advertised through the menu at the casino is out of service but the one they advertise on there web page works

Next is the way they answer the phone.....the operator answers "players help" ... i ask players help for whom.....She says who am i calling for...finally i say "casinojoy" and she say oh ok i can help you


I am not sure if all casino's do this but i thought it was a little strange to not even identify your casino group.I then ask what casino's she represents and she tells me that she cannot disclose the group she works for


So the last difficult situation was the bonus and i warn all you now to be careful because as good as "ecash" may be there is a problem here that i am not sure of who is at fault.

I enter the bonus code and method of deposit on the ecash front page it then takes me to my deposit choice and i deposit 60 euros.It approves and take me back to the casino homepage.It tells me at the website to refresh the balance.I refresh and it says 60 and i did not get any bonus


That is when i found "out of service" phone numbers listed.I thought why would you advertise a phone number that is disconnected??I told the
operator and she said "oh that is weird"....used those exact words??

And when i told her that i did not get the bonus,she told me she would call me back at home after she spoke with someone else.She admited i was a new customer and i had not yet played and yet she had to talk to someone.


I waited 40 minutes and she called back and gave me 2 choices

1 -withdraw my money and deposit again with bonus code(Would like to point out if they are rogue then i would have deposited twice...and that would be almost 220$ here in canadian dollars)Big money for me


2 play my deposit until i reach 30 times playthrough and they would manually credit the bonusi ask why not just manually credit it in the first place and she said they do not do that.So i just said i would play my money WITHOUT bonus and never play again.

I am sure my playing tonite will be quick and swift until i am broke.


Would just like to say also that if i tryed and played my 60 original non bonus euros 30x to get there manually credited bonus i would still have to wager 1800 euros first to get the bonus and sometimes that is a little hard to do unless you get lucky first.

And besides that is NOT what the advertise.I say again be careful at this new casino

Thanks

[vinylweatherman]

If they refuse to disclose the casino group YOU ARE DEPOSITING YOUR REAL MONEY AT, then this should be "run a mile".

I have experienced poor CS before with the Crypto casinos, most seem to use a single shared support centre, so why didn't the rep say this.

I believe that if ECash is used in the cashier, then in fact it is ECash that is the "casino group" the CS rep refused to divulge. ECash is the same as at Intercasino, so in itself, is far from a rogue operator.

The bonus code affair though, does sound odd. When these are entered, a pop-up appears to tell you that you have been granted the promotion, or whether, in fact, the code has failed (a reason is given, even though it is often wrong).

If you went too quick, you may not have read the pop-up, missing the code failure message, and depositing thinking all was well.

If they can't even get the phone number right, perhaps the same is true with the bonus code.


Altogether, given the odd attitude of the CS rep, this looks like a "white label" operation using Cryptologic software and ECash. It is possible, therefore, that unlike Intercasino, it is NOT ECash that makes the decisions, but the group "renting" the white label, and maybe this is the group the CS rep could not mention.

This seems to tally with the opinion that Cryptologic have moved to renting out games to other operators or software suppliers, perhaps in this case, they are renting out an entire Cryptologic casino skin to another operator.


For me - the name was enough to make me suspicious, nearly every casino with "JOY" in it's name has proved to be quite the opposite - one is even in the rogue pit.

[kassiap]

So after i got real pissy with the lack of intellegant support i decided to fire of an email and got the normal Acknowledgment of reciept


One thing that struck me as "the dumbest thing i have seen in a while from a NEW casino" was what they tag there emails with.I will post the whole thing and see if you can notice the "DUMB" self accreditation:




Dear Player,

Thank you for emailing our Customer Support Team.

Our goal is to personally reply to all of our emails within 2 hours although during peak times this may take a little longer.

We appreciate your patience and thank you for playing.

Kind Regards,

Lambros
Contact Centre Manager
CasinoJoy

GOLD AWARD WINNER Best Contact Center In The WORLD 2008, ContactCentreWorld.com
GOLD AWARD WINNER Best Contact Center EMEA 2007 and 2008, ContactCentreWorld.com



I really am not making this up.Maybe whoever gives out this "GOLD AWARD WINNER" award is high up in "make believe land" but i also could not but help notice that they themselves make the word "world" capped like it will impress us all or something


Maybe it is "i" that is lost and delirious but to me all this is adding up like a real bad bad but not to expensive "rogue dream"

[chuchu59]

Well, I just received an email from Poker Heaven claiming this is 'their' casino. It uses Crypto software but Crypto doesnt allow Hong Kong players so I didnt read further.

[vinylweatherman]

So after i got real pissy with the lack of intellegant support i decided to fire of an email and got the normal Acknowledgment of reciept


One thing that struck me as "the dumbest thing i have seen in a while from a NEW casino" was what they tag there emails with.I will post the whole thing and see if you can notice the "DUMB" self accreditation:




Dear Player,

Thank you for emailing our Customer Support Team.

Our goal is to personally reply to all of our emails within 2 hours although during peak times this may take a little longer.

We appreciate your patience and thank you for playing.

Kind Regards,

Lambros
Contact Centre Manager
CasinoJoy

GOLD AWARD WINNER Best Contact Center In The WORLD 2008, ContactCentreWorld.com
GOLD AWARD WINNER Best Contact Center EMEA 2007 and 2008, ContactCentreWorld.com



I really am not making this up.Maybe whoever gives out this "GOLD AWARD WINNER" award is high up in "make believe land" but i also could not but help notice that they themselves make the word "world" capped like it will impress us all or something


Maybe it is "i" that is lost and delirious but to me all this is adding up like a real bad bad but not to expensive "rogue dream"

This seems unlikely to be a genuine award, and quoting fake accreditation as if from an independent body should be a warning sign. The website itself might trace back to the casino, and this would be evidence of the award being fake.
For CRYPTOLOGIC to stoop to this kind of thing beggars belief - but there again, the same kinds of issues have arisen with MGS.

Trust is a rapidly endangered species in this industry, and casino operators had better have a word with the "conservationists" before the species becomes irreversably extinct.

If trust goes, we will all be looking for guarantors, and this will stifle the ability of the industry to retain existing players, as well as generate new ones. Regulators too will be seeing these trends. Some DO know what is being discussed in the player community, as they have "lurkers" to monitor the most popular player forum. eCogra has "friends of eCogra", where knowledgeable players and affiliates give feedback as to what is going on in the forums. eCogra also have their own records of complaints. Other regulators probably have a more distant view, but who knows - the civil servants in the UK Gaming board do not have as much to do as was planned for, so maybe they spend their time having a look round the internet for intelligence as to the machinations of the industry.

Well, I just received an email from Poker Heaven claiming this is 'their' casino. It uses Crypto software but Crypto doesnt allow Hong Kong players so I didnt read further.

[spearmaster]

This seems unlikely to be a genuine award, and quoting fake accreditation as if from an independent body should be a warning sign.

C'mon mate, we've covered this ground before. Did you even check the website?

[vinylweatherman]

C'mon mate, we've covered this ground before. Did you even check the website?

Given that this casino has just emerged, they cannot have won an award for 2007, and even an award for 2008 seems questionable.

This is a common practice, and there is just no way on earth that EVERY casino is "the number one.......". There can only be ONE "number one" at anything, plus a number of runners up.

Because of the above, it is more likely that an award is "fake", as in rigged, rather than completely bogus. The lamentable performance portrayed by the OP's tale falls well short of what would be expected of a competent support centre, let alone the "number one".

I have seen this award rigging before, some casinos send frequent emails to players urging them to vote for them in some awards, and a small numner even offer a bonus (or bribe) for voting for them. I can only suspect they take this on trust, since hopefully, they cannot know whether an individual player voted for them, or just said they did when claiming the bonus.

Evidence:-

I really do like throwing myself into the "guinea Pig" role with some of these new casinos.I think i just really enjoy the stress of it all

and:-

GOLD AWARD WINNER Best Contact Center In The WORLD 2008, ContactCentreWorld.com
GOLD AWARD WINNER Best Contact Center EMEA 2007 and 2008, ContactCentreWorld.com

A new casino that has just come to light CANNOT have even been in the running for an award for the period "2007 and 2008", so either this award is "fake", or it belongs to someone else, and they are misusing it.
The top award is highly dubious, as this casino can only have been running towards the end of 2008, so there is not really enough evidence for this organisation to have chosen them, against all other contenders, to be the winner.

If they win an award for 2009 though, and quote it after having been running through 2009, then it would look genuine enough, and it would then be down to who ContactCentreWorld.com are, and how many contenders are entered for the award, and how the winner is decided.



Website & 2008 awards:-

Best Contact Center in the World Winners (under 50 agents)
Gold: WagerLogic (Cyprus)
Silver: Dynamic Funds (Canada)
Bronze: Nippon Boehringer Ingleheim (Japan)

Well, it was NOT "casinojoy" that won, but Wagerlogic, for their Cyprus contact centre. The email signiature misquotes this as being an award for "casinojoy". The poor support received by the OP does not look like what would be expected from the GOLD award winning Wagerlogic contact centre, who would be all too familiar with how the software and bonus codes work, and therefore should have quickly resolved the OP's problem resulting in this thread not appearing at all. The site seems to be a consultancy, so the process of awarding prizes does not seem to be independent of the vested interests of this consultancy firm with regard to getting various support organisations to take their services, over and above others. This is very similar to the "fake" awards that are based on paid for "advertorials" in various magazines that promote a small selection of it's major advertisers with the dishing out of awards, which they can then quote.

The "under 50 agents" category is a bit worrying, although not so much now that many Cryptologic casinos have changed software. This low level of staffing may explain all the instances of prolonged delays in getting issues resolved, or even replies to emails. It takes only one major promotional cock-up to swamp 50 staff (who clearly cannot ALL be on duty at the same time - they have to sleep sometime).

There are so many categories that there are many more than ONE "number one", meaning that the claim in the signiature is over inflated, as it implies they have won THE award for number one, not just one of a number of such awards.

This is essentially what I meant by "fake award". Not that the award itself is simply made up, but that it is more an advertising trick than a genuine & independent peer & customer review based award.
No doubt, a different consultancy firm will have issued it's own awards, and the same can be said of a myriad of magazines, affiliate, and review websites. There are certasinly enough of these awards around for EVERY casino to selectively show they are "number one in the world", or "best casino".

I am not sure if all casino's do this but i thought it was a little strange to not even identify your casino group.I then ask what casino's she represents and she tells me that she cannot disclose the group she works for

Well, I can - she works for Wagerlogic, at their Cyprus contact centre. Why the hell hide this, it made the whole affair look very fishy indeed, and naturally she would not know which casino you were asking about until she had your account number (which would probably have been her next question). The long waits are probably down to peak demand (perhaps this was a global problem with the code for casinojoy), and a relatively small staff on duty to manage the load.
If she had explained this to the OP, rather than hiding bbehind the veil of secrecy in refusing to disclose who she worked for, then maybe again this issue would have not made it as far as a bitch and moan about another new casino messing up their launch offers.

A "number one in the world" support centre would have dealt with this in 40 seconds, not 40 minutes and counting, it should have been obvious that the code had failed on the deposit, and either the agent could have corrected it immediately, or suggested there and then to withdraw and redeposit trying the code again, rather than it taking 40 minutes to think this up.

I personally have the view that I receive mediocre service from the generic Wagerlogic support centre, and I have often had to escalate matters to the Intercasino rep here to get things resolved. This has all been while the support centre has held this top award, yet I do not recall ever being notified of the opportunity to cast my vote as a user of the service.

[Tom -CasinoJoy]

Hi everyone,

Good to meet you all - only I wish it was in more positive circumstances.

First things first - I would like to apologise to anyone that has been or thinks they have been let down by the service to date. As you state above we are a new casino (officially launched on Jan 14th 2009) and obviously there seems to have been a couple of issues attributed to this, for that i can only apologise and ensure these mistakes are not repeated.

Secondly I wish to address the issues at hand starting with any issues 'Kassiap' has experienced with our customer support. Our customer support centre is based in Cyprus and are tasked with dealing with a host of queries from day to day requests to specific player issues as seen in this case. Unfortunately in the example you have given below it seems that there has been as issue with quality of service and an individual rather then an organisation - again for that I apologise. It should always be made clear to the caller not only who they are talking to but also the company they are representing.

The final point I wish to address is in reference to the bonus issue. We offer players a 100% match up to €150 - with the money being added into the players account immediately. Naturally terms and conditions apply so I would like to review your case independently and then give a general response in the forum - 'Kassiap' if you could email me at tom@casinojoy.com or PM me here I will go over the issue with you and resolve it. At the very least i'm sure we can sort out a goodwill credit seeing as you have experienced unwanted issues

I hope this allays anyone's fears of our casino - we are a genuine operator that places player experience very highly on its agenda. If you have any further questions or issues please find below the following methods to find support:

Customer Support (24/7): support@casinojoy.com
Phone: +800 2353 1444

All the best,

Tom

Casino Manager - CasinoJoy

[kassiap]

I will be contacting you through e-mail Tom


I will post after this situation has been dealt with either way

[vinylweatherman]

Hi everyone,

Good to meet you all - only I wish it was in more positive circumstances.

First things first - I would like to apologise to anyone that has been or thinks they have been let down by the service to date. As you state above we are a new casino (officially launched on Jan 14th 2009) and obviously there seems to have been a couple of issues attributed to this, for that i can only apologise and ensure these mistakes are not repeated.

Secondly I wish to address the issues at hand starting with any issues 'Kassiap' has experienced with our customer support. Our customer support centre is based in Cyprus and are tasked with dealing with a host of queries from day to day requests to specific player issues as seen in this case. Unfortunately in the example you have given below it seems that there has been as issue with quality of service and an individual rather then an organisation - again for that I apologise. It should always be made clear to the caller not only who they are talking to but also the company they are representing.

The final point I wish to address is in reference to the bonus issue. We offer players a 100% match up to €150 - with the money being added into the players account immediately. Naturally terms and conditions apply so I would like to review your case independently and then give a general response in the forum - 'Kassiap' if you could email me at tom@casinojoy.com or PM me here I will go over the issue with you and resolve it. At the very least i'm sure we can sort out a goodwill credit seeing as you have experienced unwanted issues

I hope this allays anyone's fears of our casino - we are a genuine operator that places player experience very highly on its agenda. If you have any further questions or issues please find below the following methods to find support:

Customer Support (24/7): support@casinojoy.com
Phone: +800 2353 1444

All the best,

Tom

Casino Manager - CasinoJoy

Thanks,
This clears up things, and also shows we have a rep on board, so welcome to Casinomeister.

My gripe is the advertising exaggeration. Coupled with a posted bad experience, a claim that this has come from "best suport centre in the world" just looks fishy, as does a quote for an award for a year when the "winner" did not even exist. First impressions are thus of it being a "fake award", i.e, one where the casino has created a website, and manufactured an award to themselves. This was what happened with safebet, which offered fake accreditation to a stream of RTG casinos, all of which turned out to be self-awarded. The result - it nips you in the ass.

What has actually won the award, is the central Wagerlogic contact centre, and even this is only one of a number of Gold "best in world" awards. The "best in world" itself is over inflated, since only contact centres that are associated with the consultancy firm that gives out the awards are included, otherwise 32Red would have got one for their contact centre, which by all accounts outshines the rest, even the Wagerlogic one in Cyprus.

When CS get caught out by being asked "what company do you represent", telling the player this is "secret" information is another negative signal, leaving it to the imagination why on earth such secrecy is needed if the casino is up-front and honest. Perhaps in this case the CS agent misunderstood the question, or was not sure, but the best answer would be to state that they work for Wagerlogic, and provide support for a number of Wagerlogic casinos - and then ask the player for the casino they need help with, their account number, and any security questions.

From my experience, this issue may have arisen for two reasons.

1) The bonus code was subject to a "typo", and was not recognised by the software when entered, and the player simply pressed "next" assuming the code had been accepted through force of habit.

2) Code was correct, but player left cashier & deposited later - I have experienced this, and it is a "bug" in the cashier - you have to deposit immediately after entering the code. If you leave cashier, or it crashes, reenter the code on the next visit before depositing.


Asking the player to withdraw and redeposit is perhaps not the best advice, as the redeposit would no longer be the first deposit, and audit may well take exeption to a new player doing this, believing they were perhaps attempting to manipulate the system. In addition, the player would be charged one credit for this manouever for many withdrawal methods, not to forget the costs to the casino.

From my own experiences with the Wagerlogic support centre, I would not place them at number one, unless the implications are that the others are even worse! (Never had to contact Dynamic Funds, nor Nippon Boehringer Ingleheim).

With the closure of quite a few Wagerlogic casinos (including mergers, and transfers to other software), CasinoJoy fills a recently created void, and should be well placed to capture players from those others who do not like the changes.