William Hill has stolen 750$ from me!

[Louise_75]

I have been playing at their casino for more than two years and I had played 10 months (mostly with the monthly bonus) untill I had my first win of aprox. 420$, which was paid....

Well, I was travelling in Asia, from where I was played a couple of times, and I guess that must have triggered they security defense..

I couldnt believe it, when they sent the email to me.
Thank you for your e-mail.

We have checked your account details as requested and note that the bonus has been removed from this account in accordance with our Terms and Conditions, whereby we reserve the right to withhold any bonus. The complete ruling states

"The Casino and/or its authorised agent reserve the right to review transaction records and logs, from time to time, for any reason whatsoever. If, upon such review, it appears that end users or any one or combination of them are participating in strategies which the Casino and/or its authorised agent in their sole discretion deem to be abusive, the Casino and/or its authorised agent reserve the right to revoke the entitlement of such end user(s) to the promotion".

Later on, I was not even able to log in to my account, and I didnt know what they were talking about, so I wrote them again:

Thank you for your e-mail.

Please note that our security department decided to close your William Hill and the funds
will remain inside the account for breaching our terms and conditions which clearly states that:

In addition to any other remedy available, if you breach any of these Terms and Conditions or any rules of any game you play in the Casino and/or Poker Room and/or Skill Games and/or Bingo, your winnings will be forfeited. In these circumstances William Hill may retain any positive balance then existing on your Account pending investigation and/or the conclusion of any legal proceedings.


I kept asking for details but everytime they just copy/pasted a line form their terms and conditions which seemed to be different from time to time:

Our casino gaming/fraud department are of the opinion that you abused the casino bonus that was available to you in conjunction with our terms and conditions on availing of the bonus.

On this basis, we confirm that we have closed your willhill account permanently - and that no other payment to you will be forthcoming. This decision can be directly linked to the points below, which can also be found via this link:

<http://www.williamhillcasino.com/terms.htm>

1. Each promotion is available only once per end user. The identity of an end user will be determined on the basis of all or any combination of the following: name, mailing address, e-mail address, IP address, credit/charge card number, computer, and any other forms of identification which may be required. Where multiple participation is permitted, the Casino and/or its authorised agent reserve the right to limit the number of bonuses that may be given to any one participant

I had purchased 40$ and when I finally have a little bit of luck, winning 750$ (30$ was redeemed comp points) they just take the winning and close my account....

I dont know what I have done wrong and they just refuse to tell me, every time I ask for a specific answer, I just get some lines from their terms and conditions. I have done nothing wrong, It shouldnt be disallowed logging in and playing from other countries when you are on vacation should it?

I have even sent them scans of my drivers license, passport, paper statement etc etc, but nothing helps. My account is closed and my money is gone for absolutely no reason!!

What can I do now?
I can see, reading through the threads opf this forum that William Hill confiscates money all the time, why would they do that beeing such a big (apparently unreliable) company?

[tencardcharlie]

Did you play from a computer available to the public, while traveling? If so, that could be it.

[Louise_75]

Yeah I did, from an Internet café, but I wouldn't expect a lot of Thai people to have enough money to gamble, and if they have they would probably have enough money for having a connection in their own house...

However, can't deny the possibilty that another tourist have played William Hill from there, but it is not very likely...The thing is, William Hill won't give me any details at all, I don't know why they would wanna hide something..

By the way: I am in the EXACT same situation as this guy:
http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/...-shafting.html

I had to send all my scanned documents too, had to wait three weeks, and then they let the bomb fall as well.
The similarity is that it was also my first big win (750$) at their casino, so all the times I have lost the purchase (more than 15 times I think) there are no problems, but then as soon as I win, they take the money....I had fulfilled the wager requirements too, played legal games....

[spearmaster]

You just explained it.

Thailand is a blocked country for many casinos and sportsbooks - maybe you can check their T&Cs to see if Thailand is on the banned list.

Nevertheless, I think their decision is probably wrong, especially if you have been playing from home most of the time. There is no reason why you cannot play from an Internet cafe, even in Thailand, and if they make any claims in that respect (such as gambling is banned in Thailand, or it is illegal to play in a public place, or anything of that sort) please feel free to let me know.

[Louise_75]

Yeah I know, but that shouldnt be reason for closing my account and taking all the money, even the money I deposited myself + the Comp. points...

If the thing about Thailand was the problem, why couldn't they just let me know instead of trying to confuse me referring to different parts of their terms & conditions depending on the person who answers to the email...I must have violated every point in their terms so far if I look through all the emails I got from them, different answer every time, but never any specific explanation. I just don't get it...

[vinylweatherman]

This looks like yet another "bonus abuse" case, brought to light only after a big win.
Provided the account was registered from home, and all documents match the details given at the time, this "Thailand holiday" is just a red-herring. Likely they have banned you for being from Denmark, a country whose residents are genetically predisposed to abuse bonuses so it seems

I expect that they were happy while you lost each month, but check when you win. Bonus abuse is all about just meeting WR each month so as to get the bonus, even if you lost. No doubt, the 750 represents all bonuses you have ever claimed, and any winnings made from them. They SHOULD, however, return ALL your deposits that they have not previously paid out as "winnings", since they have effectively voided all wagering.

It is worth also pitching a bitch here, in case there is a way to resolve this.

It is this high handed attitude from casinos that makes players feel it is "them Vs us", rather than about entertainment with a fair chance of winning. More transparency about this issue of "bonus abuse" is needed. Surely they should just ban players from future bonuses, doing a 10-month backdated confiscation is "evil" - and not what I would expect from William Hill.

[sdaddy]

At the very least, the player should get a clear explanation of precisely what rule was violated to have the winnings confiscated.

Otherwise, a casino can use this vagueness to conceal its attempt to retroactively void winnings from a bonus even though all T&Cs were met.

[Louise_75]

Should I "Pitch a Bitch" or would it be pointless?

It seems that William Hill don't care at all about their reputation, at least I have never heard about anyone who have gotten their money back when they have been confiscated in the first place....

[sdaddy]

Should I "Pitch a Bitch" or would it be pointless?

It seems that William Hill don't care at all about their reputation, at least I have never heard about anyone who have gotten their money back when they have been confiscated in the first place....

If they can't tell you why your winnings have been confiscated, then absolutely you should Pitch a Bitch. At the end of the day, I don't believe that an established shop such as William Hill will sacrifice its good name just to keep your $750 without proper justification.

By the way, I checked the registration form for William Hill, and signups from Thailand are allowed.

[tristan727]

These lot are becoming the shame of the UK casino industry, very fast. Any other casino I can think of, from the lowliest criminal operators worldwide up - wouldn't have the cheek to both dishonour their terms & confiscate funds earnt legitimately and still leave the terms unchanged. There've been too many reports here recently of such activity by them, to imagine how it could be any other way - and all a mistake....other than a over-zealous manager acting in what he believes a justified commercial capacity - but which is regarded by almost all here as theft.