Winner Casino is not paying. Who played recently?

[hermanikann]

Is CM still looking at this case?

 

[Casinomeister]

Is CM still looking at this case?

Yes, I am still dealing with this.

 

[love2vegas]

I suspect that they are hoping that the majority of winning players prejudiced by this affair will do just that - give up and be content with their deposits being returned as a "better than a kick in the ass" solution.

The way I see this, players had monies in their accounts which they had legitimately won and regardless of the alleged software glitch these should be paid.

Exactly. I don't think this is one the online community should let slide. Compare it to a "regular" business. Let's say "honest Jack" worked for an electronics store for years. He decided to open his own shop, but decided rather than pay those high franchise fees, he'd use his friends distribution company. All goes well at first. Then, Jack decides to go the next level. He advertises ipods for half of what everyone else is getting. His distributor says they can do it. The ads are placed. The customers come & sales are great! Some in the business (pros) can't believe he is selling for less than they buy for. (See the similarities??!) Some of them buy some units, because they know a good deal. Still others (semi-pros?) buy for themselves, their relatives-everyone they know who ever wanted an ipod at half price. But the majority of buyers are just regular customers, who know a deal and want an ipod. (regulars) A few people complained, because they bought ipods the day before the sale went on at full price (losers).

After the weekend, Honest Jack sees sales have hit the roof! Not only in ipods, but in other merchandise,too! Only problem: a "glitch" in his figures.
Maybe it was the distributor (forgot to mention shipping costs), maybe it was the promotion company (put the ipods cheaper than expected), or other reasons, but bottom line: this is going to cost HONEST JACK a bundle (maybe even his business??!)

Here's the rub: Honest Jack notices 90% of his sales were made by CREDIT CARD! Is there a way to undo his mistake??

SORRY, not in honest Jacks world. Unlike the online casino operator, he is unable to retroactively charge his customers more or "undo" the sale. Oh, rightfully, he can stop any further sales-he can be glad he has increased traffic-he can take solice in the fact that his other products helped make up for the mistake. But, he can't reverse the charges on those who have already bought and either charge them more or have them "bring the ipods back". NOPE. THIS IS THE RISK OF BEING IN BUSINESS. OF NOT PAYING THE HIGH FRANCHISE FEE. OF NOT MAKING CERTAIN (double check, triple check) that all angles are checked before starting the sale.

Why would ANYONE expect that it is 'right" that the winners not get paid (get their ipods) and that HONEST JACK penalize whoever was at fault (the distributor- i.e. software provider) or simply take the loss like a reputable business person?

 

[dresden]

I suspect that they are hoping that the majority of winning players prejudiced by this affair will do just that - give up and be content with their deposits being returned as a "better than a kick in the ass" solution.

I won't be in that hopeful majority.

 

[winbig]

OR THAT ANY DEFECTS IN THE SOFTWARE WILL BE CORRECTED,

That's the most hilarious thing I've read all day!

IN THE EVENT OF COMMUNICATIONS OR SYSTEM ERRORS OCCURING IN CONNECTION WITH THE SETTELMENT OF ACCOUNTS OR OTHER FEATURES OR COMPONENTS OF THE SOFTWARE WE WILL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU OR TO ANY THIRD PARTY FOR ANY COSTS, EXPENSES, LOSSES OR CLAIMS ARISING RESULTING FROM SUCH ERRORS.

There were no "communications" or "system" errors. They changed the code. I doubt it was malicious, but they screwed up, plain and simple. The code is in question, not the servers or network. What they outline above is a system crashing during the middle of a game, or you getting disconnected during a game. If that would have happened, they would have returned the bet in question, not take the whole session winnings.

[/B] WE FURTHER RESERVE THE RIGHT IN THE EVENT OF SUCH ERRORS TO REMOVE ALL RELEVANT GAMES FROM THE SOFTWARE AND THE WEBSITE AND TAKE ANY OTHEHR ACTION TO CORRECT SUCH ERRORS.

Again, They knew of the "problem" 1-2 days after launch, but yet didn't take any measures to ensure that nobody played blackjack for another 4-5 days. If you ask me, this in itself shows malicious behavior whether or not it's a "problem" they created on purpose.

Let me reiterate a little here.

I'm assuming they recompiled the code for the blackjack engine on the new servers. If this code was corrupted, it would have been spitting out errors left and right. There is no way they would have been able to compile without knowing something was wrong.

Even if it was precompiled, again, there would be noticible errors if they indeed tested it (Which they apparently didn't).

At the least, it's gross negligence. They should be held accountable.

 

[Pinababy69]

Yes, I am still dealing with this.

I'm glad I saw that before I posted what I wanted to post. Probably best to say as little as possible right now..interesting edit indeed Jetset.

 

[Katty]

Has anyone had winnings from other games played during this time confiscated as well? I had my video poker winnings confiscated along with my BJ ones. Here's the thread detailing my experience:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/winner-casino-revoked-winnings-of-715.11718/?posted=1

 

[Katty]

Are there any other casinos part of the same group that we should stay away from? How come this casino isn't listed on the "evil ones" list yet? What other gambling forums are there that I post my tale on to warn others?

 

[chesterp]

I won't be in that hopeful majority.

I am definitely not going out like that either. $4000 stolen from me is no laughing matter. Apparently they responded to one person that the glitch was that we were able to double/split, etc. more than we should have been able to. What a horrible reply. First of all, that isn't true. Secondly, it would decrease the house advantage, not eliminate it or give the player an advantage.

 

[Casinomeister]

Are there any other casinos part of the same group that we should stay away from? How come this casino isn't listed on the "evil ones" list yet? What other gambling forums are there that I post my tale on to warn others?

It is - under Casinomeister Cautions:

Other casinos on the same server:
Website
www.Casino-on-net.net Not to be confused with the real Casino-on-net
www.Casino4aces.com
www.Casino4aces.net
www.Casinoforaces.com
www.Casinoforaces.net
www.Casinoforaces.org
www.Casinofouraces.com
www.Casinofouraces.net
www.Casinofouraces.org
www.Casinoonnet.net ditto
www.Casinoonnet.org ditto

And then there is winner.com

 

[Casinomeister]

Heads Up!

All affected players please contact the casino manager with the subject header: "March Crisis". I've been told you'll be taken care of.

manager@casinoforaces.com
manager@winner.com

Thanks!

 

[chesterp]

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Finally they realise what is best for them! Let's just hope they're telling the truth and it isn't a stall tactic! SOOO much thanks Bryan in advance if they pay up!

 

[love2vegas]

Congratulations! Nice to see them responding/ But will the players get to keep those great $25 Amazon gift certificates?? Great work, Bryan!

 

[Slugo]

Another thanks in advance

Thank you thank you

for looking into the Winner debacle.

I'll be sending them a note ASAP.

Thanks again

Paul

 

[liquidsoap]

:notworthy :notworthy bryan, you work wonders
you are the greatest thing that happened to the online gaming world

 

[Pinababy69]

I have to add my kudos as well Bryan, because I don't think you get thanked (or respected) nearly enough for what you contribute to this industry. The people in this particular thread have been very good in that way, but just in case you're not sick of hearing it....you rock!!! If everyone who's involved in online gaming (as an affiliate and as a player) followed the examples you set here, we would all be so much better off. :notworthy

 

[dresden]

It looks like either Casinoforaces/Winner have an odd definition of the words "taken care of" or someone didn't get the memo.

I wrote the email titled "March Crisis" as CM advised.

I got this back:

"Dear xxxx,



I apologize for any misunderstanding; please allow me to clarify the situation.



Casino ForAces did a full casino upgrade that occurred from March 10th to the 14th. During the upgrade, a faulty blackjack system was accidentally installed into our system. This allowed for an incredibly unfair advantage to be given to the players. As soon as we discovered this problem, we froze all our player accounts in order to fully examine the situation.



All players' accounts balance was reset, exactly as you wrote, back to the starting point.

Accordingly, your account balance was reset to the starting point of 900, which contains your 300 first deposit in addition to the 600 Welcome bonus given to you.

You are more than welcome to stay and play, however you have the choice to withdraw your funds if you wish.



In addition, I have sent you an Amazon certificate code as a token of my sincere apologies about this situation.

Apparently Amazon supplied us with a whole series of invalid certificate codes.

In case you encounter any problems redeeming your Amazon certificate, please do not hesitate to contact me or our Customer Service team, and will be more than happy to provide you with a new, valid code.



In case we can be of any further assistance, please do not hesitate to contact me (at this email address) or our Customer Service team, at- service@casinoforaces.com.



Sincerely,



Chris O'Reilly

Casino ForAces Manager

www.casinoforaces.com"


I sure am being "taken care of," just like the mafia takes care of people. No mention of any resolution or my removed winnings.

 

[winbig]

Did anyone happen to get their game logs from this place yet? Would be interesting reading. If they won't release them, then why?

 

[Slugo]

Last night I recieved a phone call from them. I've been sending them increasingly hot Email because I havn't been getting a reply. She said that they have been sending replys but I don't seems to be getting them. Hence the phone call. but I'm digressing.....

the way they were set up is you could use the bonus up to 3 times.
I had lost all on the first time thru and was ahead $343 on the second. I figured that I would cash out at that point and did the withdraw. Then all the bla bla happened...

Now on the phone last night she stated that my account has been reset to $570 which is the 2 $100 deposits and the 2 $185 bonuses. I have an option of taking my $200 and leaving or playing them out at a WR of 3420.

I tend to think take the $200 and get the F.....irst train out of town.


Good luck

Paul

 

[chesterp]

not as rough as dresden, but winner is only offering to give $500 of my winnings. that's less than half. no word from 4aces yet, where my big win was. i'm not sure how to respond to that email, as $500 is obviously better than nothing. but i still feel i'm being robbed of a lot of money without an explanation of why. suggestions?

 

[scrollock]

from the history of this group and from what little info we have, i have no doubt that this software is manipulatable and the problem that has occured here is that when it was manipulated to screw players it was cocked up and instead of ripping players off, it was giving them an advantage.

interesting that this place is run by ex-playtech people and that one of them was associated with club dice, is there anychance that this guy is the mathematical genius we know as the ex-joyland comps manager ?

it would certainly fit the profile outlined above that some idiot was trying to rip off the players, but ended up giving money away instead.

 

[Slugo]

This is a chunk of the last email I got from them. $200 is what I have in deposits. so I can continue to play at a place that doesn't seem too stable or take my deposit, and promise to leave them alone. It makes me wonder if I should keep my $ there to see what happens rather than sign future rights away. If I do leave it there will it even be available in the furture.

Soooo I guess the questions is do I gamble with my gambling money?



If you wish to have your initial deposits transferred to your Neteller account, please reply to this email with the following statement:

"I accept the offer of $200.00 to be deposited into my Neteller account, which will resolve any further requests I have surrounding the "March Crisis" issue".

 

[winbig]

I'd hold out, but that's just me. If you take them up on this "offer", then you lose all stake in any future resolutions for other players that may come along.

edit: Also, take screenshots of the balance as well as save any and all emails you recieve from them promising you your $200. That way if they don't come to some resolution for full payment of winnings, you can always go back and get the $200.

 

[jetset]

That's good advice, because it is becoming increasingly clear that these guys do not have sufficiently acute forward vision to realise that a fair and fast resolution is the best way out of this mess they have landed themselves in - they still seem to be trying to cheapskate winning players on these deals.

And to repeat an oft-made comment in this thread: has anyone seen their gaming logs from this outfit yet?

I would treat these folks with great caution now and in the future.

 

[winbig]

You've had 2 replies to this already...please take the time to read them in the other threads you posted to....hint: click on "new posts"