William Hill issues

[dionysus]

Ok 2 cents. The tone in your messages come across as antagonizing. Youve expressed your thrill in the torment and fun. Its really become rather hard to take much of anything you posted seriously about WH because of the manner in which youve relayed it.
And frankly, it isnt your thread. Its Bryans. Having a go at your host probably isnt the best course either.

 

[Lady Soitaire]

Well, this new information should have been revealed from the outset. It gives quite an important insight to the bug that is causing this. Online games are supposed to be robust enough to withstand this type of thing, and restore to the point where play stopped. It would appear that this game has a weakness in that it can be corrupted due to a dodgy internet connection.

Now, the biggest challenge of all for the game comes when you leave it till the evening. This means restoring it on a different PC. The bug probably relates to this, and may even be caused by local cached copies of game content that are loaded during the restoration. This is careless programming on the part of the game developer, as this is a real money game, and NOTHING should be left in the control of the client machine.
William hill probably know about this potential weakness, hence they accuse you of cheating, but won't reveal how they think the problem occurs.

1. That leave till evening instance, it worked then! On my home PC, a different PC. The only thing different? I was not about to win the Solitaire game.

2. This current 'stuck' game issue, it happened when I was playing on my laptop. When I was about to win. I immediately relaunched the game. When it remained 'stuck', I got in touch with support. They kept telling me to "clear cache, use different browser". I tried Chrome and IE. My usual browser is Firefox. Then , the accusations began.

 

[Lady Soitaire]

Keeping other material private isn't helpful (unless you intend to PAB). You failed to mention a very critical piece of information that would have been very useful in trying to replicate the problem, that of how you would close the game when your boss caught you by surprise, and relaunch it later for completion.

Please read properly. That was a different time and instance. It worked well then. So, why did it crash and get 'stuck' when I was playing at home and immediately launched it? Why does it only seem to crash when I am on the verge of winning?

 

[Lady Soitaire]

The Pitch a B**ch words on the top right , next to Quick Links, is not click-able. Please advise

 

[dionysus]

https://www.casinomeister.com/player-arbitration-pab/

 

[Lady Soitaire]

Thanks. I have now successfully submitted a PAB. When I tried to add attachments, it said that I did not have rights or something, but the PAB was submitted successfully.

 

[dionysus]

If you have any pab comcerns, max is the pab guy. You can reach im here for pm
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/

 

[Lady Soitaire]

What if the discrepancy between server and PC display was that the server considered no further passes were available, but the browser display showed that there was one left. In such a case, the browser would present an activated and clickable deck of cards instead of the "X" symbol. When clicked, a request would be sent to the server to move to the next pass, however the server sees no next pass as being available, so sends back an error, which would explain the "stuck" nature of this game.

I don't understand. How can there be a "discrepancy"? The contents displayed on my PC screen comes from the server! To use your own words, "This kills your theory stone dead". "Bleedin' obvious", no?

Unless..... you are saying that I have some magical powers to change change the cards? LOL!

 

[dionysus]

If youve submitted a pab, as per the terms, you are NOT to discuss the matter in the thread any more

 

[maxd]

PAB received but there's not much we can do with it. The OP is basically asking us to squeeze an apology out of the casino which, as specified in the Pitch-A-Bitch FAQ §1.2, is beyond the scope of the PAB process. I'll forward the OP's details to the casino so they are aware of the player's dissatisfaction but my involvement will end there.

Thanks. I have now successfully submitted a PAB. When I tried to add attachments, it said that I did not have rights or something ....

You really ought to read the Pitch-A-Bitch FAQ. You'd save us and yourself a lot of time:

• we specifically request that you DO NOT include extra materials with the PAB. The PAB form asks for the basics of your issue and that's all we need or want up front. If we want more we'll ask for it. All this is spelled out in the FAQ, that's why it's there in the first place.
• you didn't provide a valid email address, I had to specifically ask you for that.
• you're continuing to post after you've submitted the PAB, that'll usually kill your PAB right there.
• your PAB as submitted is not an appropriate PAB issue. Please read the Pitch-A-Bitch FAQ, §1.2: we're not in the business of making people apologise.
• etc.

Sorry to be blunt about this but if you can't be bothered to read and/or respect the FAQ guidelines, never mind ignoring our requests that you do so, then don't be surprised if you find us rather unsympathetic to your cause. As I've said I'll forward your details to the casino but after that I think we're done here.

"Hello this is Max from Casinomeister, this player has been annoyed by a bug in your software, make sure that you apologize to her when you're done fixing it"

That is about the size of it, and it's an alleged bug at that. Not the sort of request that's going to get a lot of respect from the people involved. For this reason the FAQ now explicitly states:

1.2 Q: Under what circumstances would my Pitch-A-Bitch NOT be accepted?

A: There are a few things that would keep us from accepting your PAB:

• ...
• the crux of your PAB is "they were mean/rude/disrespectful/unfriendly/curt/abrupt/unneighbourly to me and/or behaved in some other manner I didn't appreciate. I want you to make them apologise." Sorry, relationship counselling is beyond the scope of the PAB process; PABs based on such issues will be rejected.

 

[Balthazar]

The OP is basically asking us to squeeze an apology out of the casino

Still don't understand why so many people were suggesting a PAB to begin with, especially since the problem could have been local, the casino was aware of the situation and she didn't lose money with it. Not sure what you were supposed to do here?

"Hello this is Max from Casinomeister, this player has been annoyed by a bug in your software, make sure that you apologize to her when you're done fixing it"

 

[Casinomeister]

What a bloody waste of time.

Lady Soiltaire can't be bothered with reading the forum policies and rules. She can't be bothered with reading the PAB rules. She can't be bothered with doing her due diligence by opening her eyes and noticing the i-Gaming reps tab. In fact, all of this is spelled out via an auto PM (what to do if one has a casino complaint) when one first signs up, yet she couldn't be bothered with that too.

And I don't like being bothered by PITAs. Sorry if this is "unbecoming" of me but here's a 30 day suspension for being annoying.

 

[maxd]

Turns out the OP should be the one apologising to the casino people. Apparently she has sent the same abusive message to CS about 100 times, featuring the ever so charming "GO F*** YOURSELVES!" (beeped for the post). Some people's children.

 

[Casinomeister]

Upgraded to permanent boot. The Internet gives people a sense of empowerment by enabling a veil between them and reality. They can say what they want without consequence. It's a perverted dream for some - like this "lady" (who's probably really a guy).

 

[Alice_73]

Please note these important points (especially important for the posters like Balthazar who spout nonsense above):

1.
I did lose money. I played a £52 Solitaire game. I was about to win this game. It got 'stuck'. So, I lost either £208 (for the win), £52 (the Solitaire bet) or £24 (see pictures on Page 3 of this thread, it shows 6 cards already sorted in the pile). If they had reset the game with my balance remaining 'stuck', then it would have been another £452. Also, as mentioned umpteen times, this has happened before. Want proof? Am happy to dig up old e-mails with William Hill CS.

2.
From the screenshots of Page 3 of this thread, note that I had a balance of £452. At first, this balance was also 'stuck' It was only after repeated chats/requests with Live Chat, did they get the £452 back to my Main Balance. I suspect that when they did this, it might have further corrupted the 'stuck' Vegas Solitaire game, hence them trying to hide and cover up now. I say this from experience, having had this issue in the past.

3.
I have had this 'stuck' problem on a number of occasions in the past. Just like this instance, it was never resolved. It was always a 'reset' after a week or so. This is wrong. Balthazar says it might be a "local" problem. I tried it on my PC at home and work. Colleague's PC. Even an internet cafe. The problem persists, irrespective of location or PC. Why? Because it's not "local"!!! The game comes from William Hill Vegas. It is corrupted. It is flawed. But they are not doing anything to fix it!

4.
William Hill will not provide any so-called "logs". One has to wonder why. This is a William Hill Vegas Solitaire "no download" game. When you launch or re-launch the game, all data (i.e. whatever that's presented on your screen) comes from the William Hill gaming server or whatever it's called. As such, since everything comes from them, why can't they provide a concise answer and "logs", showing the issue at hand? Why can't they detail the stage at which my game crashed? Are they afraid that this will lead to the question, "Why does the game crash when the player is about to win?" Surely there must be "logs" for this, so they know exactly when the game crashed, how the game should relaunch, etc.???

 

[Alice_73]

I really do not see how Casinomeister.com, being the respected fair play advocate that it is (or as claimed in its motto), can dismiss this case so lightly.

Why? The gist is, William Hill's Vegas Solitaire game is faulty. It crashes and causes the player to forfeit the game (and hence the game wager/winnings). Not only that, the player's balance is also affected. It took persistent pestering to get CS, at the very least, to return the balance to Main Balance.

In any other industry, this is called FRAUD. So much so, I even question now if it's not just limited to the Solitaire game, but possibly the whole lot of Vegas games that are "faulty"?


William Hill will confirm that I regularly maintain a four figure Main Balance. They will also confirm that I have played Vegas Solitaire games of much larger sums. Now, will Casinomeister.com only look into things if a big sum is involved? Like if it was a £520 Solitaire game with a £5k balance? You want to know why I didn't bother following the PAB guidelines (I really couldn't be bothered, but I did get a new gmail address as requested though )? Because I just knew..... that Casinomeister.com wouldn't really take a £52 Solitaire bet seriously. Too small a sum. But it's the seriousness of the underlying problem that needs to be addressed!!!


Finally, of course I want them to come clean and apologise!!! If they have a faulty game, people should know about it. Fair play, no? They should take the game offline, apologise to players (like myself) and fix the faults! Or..... is it OK for them to do a cover-up, insult players, continue offering their dodgy games? If it was a problem on my end ("connectivity" problem as they now claim), then prove it to all of us, showing how this happened, how my balance got stuck as well, etc.



P.S.
I couldn't wait for 30 days to post this, so I created a new account. I assume I will be banned for this. Season's Greetings to all.


P.P.S.
A good point made by my friend. If the gaming software was so reliable and trustworthy, there wouldn't be a marked reduction in people playing online. Why do they need to have the "Live Casino" now? I answer. Because players, like me, are finally realising that thir software platform is unrealiable (for want of a harsher word!). That's why they need to hire croupiers to tend "Live Casinos". That's why they need to incur these costs.

 

[Alice_73]

1.
I mentioned right from the start that I used profanity at them. Merely returning the favour.


2.
Mr casinomeister wrote:

Lady Soiltaire can't be.....

Since I am banned.....

Learn to use the spell-check function! Practise what you preach!!!

It's not limited to "choosing a username"!!! Check out valid complaints that come with proof. The Vegas Solitaire game is faulty!!! "Promoting fair play"? Practise what you preach. Otherwise, the word "hypocrite" comes to mind!

 

[vinylweatherman]

The problem is that you did NOT want the problem investigated, you failed to make the PAB about the problem with the software. Instead, you just wanted Max to drag an apology out of them. This would NOT have addressed the issue of the bug prone software, in fact, it would have provided a mechanism for William Hill to wriggle out of addressing the issue by merely apologising and sweeping the issue under the carpet.

Since you have sent 100+ "F*** you" style emails to them, I very much doubt you will be getting an apology. If anything, you could be in breach of the Telecommunications act of 2003, which DOES include the internet, and prohibits the use of any telecommunications system for illegal purposes, which includes the wanton transmission of profanities to another person of organisation. Will Hill could make a formal complaint and you could be arrested and charged. Telling a copper to eff himself (or herself) will see you spending the night in the cells, and leaving the next morning £80 lighter.

There is an impression that it is YOU that doesn't want a third party sniffing around your game logs, although you DO want the logs yourself. Why?

I suspect I know the answer to this in broad terms, if not the detail.

If this IS a more general issue, then it will affect another player soon, one who is also good enough at the game to regularly reach this stage.

You WILL be banned for signing up again, and if you sign up a third time, you will be banned again.

Sign up a fourth time, and you will be nominated for the "evil player" award in the Casinomeister 2012 annual awards.

 

[Balthazar]

Please note these important points (especially important for the posters like Balthazar who spout nonsense above):

1. I did lose money.

You seems to have anger issues.

I'll leave you with a little advice, since I know you're reading:
Next time that you lose money because of a glitch, try not to tell the CSR to go fuck himself, that might help.

 

[Casinomeister]

1.
I mentioned right from the start that I used profanity at them. Merely returning the favour.

I figured you'd be back.

Do yourself a favor and get some treatment.<snip>