When free ain't free...

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
Just received this $25 ND offer from Windows Casino who had even gone to the trouble of creating an account for me (grrrr thats annoying).

Anyway here are the terms...can YOU spot where the bulls*it starts??

To participate in the promotion the player must have received an invitation e-mail, and/or does not have a real account already registered at Windows Casino and/or never received any No Deposit Bonus previously at the casino.
Please ensure that you download the casino from the promotional e-mail recieved.
This bonus is automatically credited upon logging into your real account. Should the bonus not be automatically credited the player will be requested to provide proof of receipt by faxing or emailing a copy of the promotional letter/email/offer.
The Wagering Requirements for this bonus are as follows:
25x the aggregate value of the bonus on Slots and Keno games ONLY before withdrawing any winnings or playing any other games. Progressive Slot games are also EXCLUDED from this promotion.
The maximum cash out from this bonus is 5x bonus value. A minimum deposit of 50 (all currency) must be made in order to cash out winnings. Note that the 1st Deposit Bonus will be awarded in this first deposit and players will have to complete the wagering requirements before making any withdrawals. In the event that the player wishes to play without the bonus then he must wager his deposit at least two (2) times in any game.

These terms are so full of c*ap I can almost see the steam rising off the words.
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
OK here is my problem with this promo.

It states:

Note that the 1st Deposit Bonus will be awarded in this first deposit and players will have to complete the wagering requirements before making any withdrawals.

but then states:

In the event that the player wishes to play without the bonus then he must wager his deposit at least two (2) times in any game.

So first it says you have to complete the bonus requirements, and then it says you dont have to - in fact, when they say 'the bonus' it isnt clear whether they mean the $25 or the 1st deposit bonus. You could ASSUME they mean the deposit bonus, but it isnt 100% clear. i.e. do they mean 'play without the $25 bonus' or 'play without the 100% bonus'..??


ALSO, what happens if you reach the 25x wagering for the $25 bonus and you have a balance of $1000, and you then make your $50 deposit and go down to $500 and then back up to $1500? Will they then say you can only withdraw $125 + $50, considering you used the $1000 you won from the previous bonus to win the extra $500?? The bonus is for PLAY purposes as well so you would actually have to withdraw $150.

Add to that the 4 business days for withdrawal and all the ID stuff and even IF you win $25 its hardly worth it.

It is also interesting to note that many playtech casinos wont remove automatic bonuses on an ad-hoc basis. You either accept bonuses on your account from the get-go or you dont, so not accepting the 1st deposit bonus may well retrospectively exclude you from the $25 ND.

Anyway, the fact that I could write all this about what is supposed to be a FREE NO DEPOSIT bonus shows that it is indeed a crock of protein submarines.

I personally think its unreasonable to expect a deposit from a player to who you have given a NO DEPOSIT bonus with a MAX CASHOUT. Its fair enough to require ID etc, but not a deposit.
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
** UPDATE **

After scrolling RIGHT to the bottom of the promos page I found the terms for the 'special letter bonus' which is what I received, and the terms are different...WORSE!


FREE 25 No Deposit Exclusive Bonus

* This bonus is automatically credited upon logging into your real account if you have visited the website via the promotional letter and/or entered the correct coupon code upon completing your Real Money Account registration. Should the bonus not be automatically credited the player will be requested to provide proof of receipt by faxing or emailing a copy of the promotional letter they received.
* If you received your Username and Password in the letter, your account will automatically be credited upon logging in for the first time. You will receive //$ 5 (Five) upon logging in and receive the remaining //$ 20 (Twenty) once you have updated account details.
Please contact our support team through one of the methods listed on our website HERE in order for them to update your details and credit the remaining FREE //$ 20 (Twenty) bonus.
We request that you update your account with the following details:
Email Address
Mobile Telephone Number
Date of Birth (optional)
Gender (optional)
* If you received your Username and Password for a pre-registered account and find that the currency is not that of what you would like to transact in, we ask that you contact our support team and request for your account to be converted to another available currency of your choice. This will not affect your eligibility for these offers.
* The Wagering Requirements for this bonus are as follows: All accounts are asked to wager the bonus amount 60 times before making a withdrawal. Players from UK and Ireland are asked to wager 80 times.* Bets placed on all versions of Baccarat, all versions of Roulette, all versions of Sic Bo, all versions of Darts, Heads or Tails, Casino War, and Craps do not count towards the fulfillment of the wagering requirements. Play on ALL PROGRESSIVE GAMES is PROHIBITED prior to meeting the wagering requirements on this bonus.
* Bets placed on All Blackjack variations, 3 Card Poker, Pai Gow Poker, Casino Hold'Em, Let Them Ride, Red Dog, Stravaganza contribute one third of their original value towards wagering requirements. In other words, the sum of the bets placed on these games is divided by three when calculating wagering.
* If any excluded game (listed above) is played at any time before wagering is fulfilled, all game plays/winnings are void.
* The maximum withdrawal amount for this bonus is 100 (all currencies) and the minimum is 80 (all currencies). If the balance exceeds the maximum withdrawal amount at the time you wish to withdraw, players are asked to contact support to get their excess balance cleared out. All comp points earned from play with the free bonus will also be zeroed.
* All players wishing to make a withdrawal will have to make a deposit of at least 50 (all currencies). Note that the 200% exclusive bonus will be awarded in this first deposit and players will have to complete the wagering requirements before making any withdrawals.* The Casino reserves the right to withhold any amount of the player's winnings if the Free 25 is wagered on the above excluded games, before the wagering on allowed games is completed fully

Geez what a load of nonsense. You actually CANT opt out of the 1st deposit bonus in this case (200% with 25xD+B).

Its also interesting when you read these terms:

* Players with pending withdrawals cannot receive bonuses. If you wish to receive your 1st, 2nd or 3rd Welcome bonus, please cancel your withdrawal in the cashier, or click on the online support icon for assistance.


*Players must not have a balance greater than $///R 2 (two) on their account in order to receive bonuses

So if you win your $125, you cant withdraw it because you wont be able to deposit your $50 and get your bonus (which you HAVE to according to the terms), but you cant get a bonus if your balance is greater than $2

Why would anyone bother??????



and then
 

[email protected]

Dormant account
Joined
Mar 31, 2009
Location
United Kingdom
As much as I would love to comment on the above, I don't think it would be professional too, so I'm afraid I can't!

All's I will say is that I don't set people to 'No Offers' just because they choose to opt out of 1 promotion. Promotions are there to make playing more exciting and give you something to play towards, not to penalise people.
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
PABinit
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
As much as I would love to comment on the above, I don't think it would be professional too, so I'm afraid I can't!

All's I will say is that I don't set people to 'No Offers' just because they choose to opt out of 1 promotion. Promotions are there to make playing more exciting and give you something to play towards, not to penalise people.

I agree with you totally but a promo such as this one from Windows just makes the heart beat faster - for all the wrong reasons though.
 

sweiger

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 28, 2006
Location
Copenhagen, Denmark
As much as I would love to comment on the above, I don't think it would be professional too, so I'm afraid I can't!

All's I will say is that I don't set people to 'No Offers' just because they choose to opt out of 1 promotion. Promotions are there to make playing more exciting and give you something to play towards, not to penalise people.

These kind of promotions does exactly that IMO: PENALIZE the player.
And it's typical playtech casino terms: unclear, confusing, lots of "what if's" -half-hearted, so the casino can hold themselves free from their obligations at will, because they can interpret their terms as they want.

[Thread derail]
Many PT casinos are also notorious for sending multiple "offers" that interact with each other date-wise, so you never know what bonus you get until AFTER you deposit.[/Thread derail]

Well, having said that, PT is certainly not the only casinos with bad/unclear terms. A certain "accredited" RTG has been the subject of this here more than once.
 

grazza7777

Dormant account
Joined
May 10, 2006
Location
AUSTRALIA
weather it be playtech or RTG, they r 97% crooks, stck to microgaming and rival and save your self some greif, from 1 aussie to another, i feel for you m8...grazza7777:thumbsup::thumbsup::lolup::lolup:
 

alexbuzz

Dormant account
Joined
Apr 5, 2009
Location
London
more than few CM accredited RTG casinos on the site, mate; think it's hard to brush all operators due to their software platform choice which is made by a number of factor (but especially commission back to the operator!).

Not in windows defense, but let me tell you that coming up with compelling promotions that get players excited and give them a real shot at winning and yet don't break the bank is a tough job.

Feel free to ping me with any suggestions (other than change platforms, cheers) for what you think are cool and fun promos and if we run it you'll be duly rewarded (in so far as I can given CM rules).
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
PABinit
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
I agree with Alex that we shouldnt treat all RTG casinos as one. In fact, over the past year more than half a dozen great RTG casinos have arrived on the scene. I hope that they will get a greater market share and boot the scums out so that no more players will get screwed by them. Ever since the safebet era RTG casinos are considered to be mostly rogue. I hope this changes as some of their games especially the slots seem to have better themes than the MG clones. The payouts though, are sometimes quite low but that's gambling I guess.
 

catrina m

Dormant account
PABaccred
Joined
Feb 8, 2007
Location
US of A
Why must a promotion have a zillion ways to deprive you of any winnings?

Why must you have to contact a lawyer to sort out the meaning of T's and C's.

I am amazed we haven't seen in small print " we reserve the right to not pay you anytime we feel like it"

If you speak badly of some casino's in a forum they can confiscate your money. I have seen these terms posted here lately!

The most important thing is, why do people keep giving the jack ass casino's money?
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Playtech also seem to think us Brits are better at SLOTS. Surely they are EFFING RANDOM, or are we missing something:mad:

I also have yet ANOTHER letter from these Jokers at Windows, with account number and password, and free 25. This only adds to the confusion, since I already had an account created through membership of Wager Junction RTG casinos, took the 25, and then played a bit. Then, they went all "Brit hating" on me, so they got uninstalled. I reinstalled once more for another free 25, and lost it, and now have yet another. This is a complete waste of effort. They have wasted a stamp on an offer that isn't going to get them any further than perhaps me playing out the 25 in an idle moment. The required deposit is presumably to prevent players winning by serially playing the free 25 chips but never depositing, HOWEVER, as soon as you deposit the 50, you might as well kiss goodbye your winnings from the free 25 AND YOUR 50 DEPOSIT (this is the cunning part of the offer, and is nothing short of trickery).

Marketing the offer as they do is a breach of the law here in the UK, since they use the word "free", yet a PURCHASE is MANDATORY to BENEFIT (by winning & withdrawing) from what is offered as "free".
 
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