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Western Union More Detail on the letter I received

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by duke7123, May 27, 2006.

    May 27, 2006
  1. duke7123

    duke7123 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    CEO
    Location:
    Philippines
    Just to let all of you know that I have just today received a letter from Western Union demanding that I comply with the emails that they have been sending me. It seems that I played a site so much in the past 6 months and have sent maybe more that 15,000.00 USD to them and or a agent. I have never cashed or won at the site but now I am as of this day being question about my transactions. This was done via email from Western Union asking me to name the people that I was sending to. They have a new form now and its really on the watch list. I have so many emails from them and have shared it with the site, and also several phone calls. Now I am not sure what to do with this letter. They have asked several times that I sign a Affidavit so that they can investigate to whom I was sending the money. I know they now to whom I was sending it to, but they needed me to sign so that they could close the office I guess and also try and get the 3rd party that was receiving the money, from a agent and it was not being sent to the site. They had a arragement with many peoples names and from time to time and may I add that these people were blocked from receiving the money. To that end I have also been blocked from sending to that Country. This has cost me many dollars in fees and now it seems that I am going to have to deal with it. In one email Western Union stated that maybe and I say maybe " Money Laundering" which I am not really sure how one would define this. I will tell all that I was shocked today to get this letter here in the Philippines where I have a home as well as the states. So beware all and I guess I need to discuss this matter with the site. Also I guess it's worth copy and pasting this which I went to Western Union Site and it is on there just like this. :eek:

    PART OF THE LETTER I RECEIVED! 5-27-06We routinely monitor consumer transaction activity to confirm that those who use our services comply with their agreements with us. Failure to abide by the service terms and conditions will result in corrective action by Western Union including, without limit, suspension of an individual's right to use our services and/or indemnification demand from Western Union for any losses suffered by Western Union. These observations are made without prejudice to any other rights or remedies available to Western Union including, without limitation, Western Union's right to refuse service to any person for any reason. Questions of this nature should be referred to your personal attorney for reply at your expense. "including without imit any laws relating to money laundering, illegal gambling activities, support for terrorist activities, or fraud." This requirement is the same across all of our service channels. "I HAVE NOT PUT ALL DETAILS HERE BECAUSE IT TELLS THE PEOPLES NAME AND LOCATION THAT I WAS SENDING TO, TO PLAY THE SITE. I CAN TELL ALL THAT THIS IS VERY SCARY TO ME. HOWEVER I WILL HAVE TO DO SOMETHING" THERE IS MORE VERY DISTURBING PARTS IN THIS LETTER.

    Carol A. Brown, Director
    Compliance, Fraud, International and Off-line Operations


    The maximum send amount for a money transfer is $2,999.99 per 30 days.


    Western Union strictly prohibits the use of its Internet service to directly or indirectly fund illegal Internet gambling and/or illegal activities.

    So beware all !!!

    Duke
     
  2. May 27, 2006
  3. brianzz

    brianzz Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Work
    Location:
    TN
    Tell them you'll sign the papers if they refund all the fees you've paid to send money, otherwise you're not legally obligated to do anything. They're so high and mighty they can find out for themselves.
     
    1 person likes this.
  4. May 27, 2006
  5. duke7123

    duke7123 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    CEO
    Location:
    Philippines
    Thanks but

    Thanks Brainzz but its not just the papers that they want me to sign I though this was over and like I said they know who I sent the money to. They just don't know all the details like a 3rd party picked up the money and then gave it to the site, which is what they are saying is Money "L" when it sent to someone for what they deem as not legal. So that is why they want me to sign so that they can open a full blown investigation into the site that in the end received the money for a fee that the site paid agents to get for them. it is so much depper than just what I have written.

    Thanks,

    Duke
     
  6. May 27, 2006
  7. Lord_Have_Mercy

    Lord_Have_Mercy Quit Gambling

    Location:
    Parts, Unknown
    Its none of their business. Don't give up your rights to privacy because they think that you don't know your rights. Tell them to kiss you a$$ and go about your business. You know you haven't done anything wrong. Let them do it on their own. If they want legal action take them to court. People got to stop rolling over from being scared. What can they do to you? NOTHING!!!
     
    1 person likes this.
  8. May 27, 2006
  9. SlotsWizard

    SlotsWizard Dormant account webmeister

    Occupation:
    I currently work for the Wizard of Odds
    Location:
    North of Antarctica
    Trap them in their own logic

    Here is my 2 on this situation:

    Western Union says that their service is not to be used to fund ILLEGAL gambling. If the bigwigs in Washington are just now trying to pass a bill to make internet gambling illegal (http://www.casinomeister.com/news/may2006.html#big), then that means that internet gambling is currently NOT ILLEGAL. Therefore, you have used Western Union to fund LEGAL gambling, and they have no right investigating a legal activity.
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. May 27, 2006
  11. Linus

    Linus Dormant account

    Occupation:
    asdf
    Location:
    TX
    If you've sent $15,000 to a foreign gambling operation, without ever cashing out, the first advice I'd give you, is to stop gambling. If you think you can't stop, look in the phone book for a gambling anonymous organization where you live.

    Internet gambling is illegal in the US. However, nobody's ever been prosecuted for being a player. The whole reason for the laws prohibiting it is to protect people like you, not to put you in jail.

    If all you've been doing is sending money to an offshore gambling operation, you don't need to worry about being prosecuted. If there's more to it than you've told, I can't comment on that.

    Whatever Western Union is worried about, they're trying to protect their own butts, not yours. I'd suggest not responding or talking to them at all, unless or until they can tell you exactly what it is they're worried about, and they can convince you that whatever it is they're trying to accomplish has nothing to do with taking any kind of action - legal or otherwise - against you. Even then, if you can afford it, you might consider talking to a lawyer first. (Though honestly, few lawyers are going to have any expertise or experience in the scenario your discussing.)

    US financial companies have an obligation to make sure their customers aren't involved in money laundering or terrorism. I'm sure they're just trying to cover themselves - but if they want your help, they need to be willing to provide assurances they aren't going after you.

    If they want your help, they shouldn't be treating you like a suspect. If they are, you should respond like one, and refuse to cooperate.
     
    1 person likes this.
  12. May 27, 2006
  13. aodat2

    aodat2 Senior Member PABnononaccred PABnoaccred2 PABaccred2

    Occupation:
    I have a job
    Location:
    Malaysia
    Duke, here's what I could tell you since I studied law a bit some time back.

    If WU wants to take you to court, they could demand that you release the name and address of the person you're sending it to. They could also intimidate you so much so that you'll be giving them the site where you got the info from. But other than that, they could do nothing to you.

    Since WU already have the Name and Address of the person you're sending the money to, there's no way they would want that again. They most probably think that you're actually sending this money to fund some terrorist group or something like that so that's why they are demanding that you sign papers and etc.

    As for Money Laundering, you don't really have to worry much about that either. $15K is chump change as compared to the real money launderers. They launder about $15M (at the least). If you need more information about money laundering and etc, please do visit You must register/login in order to see the link. or You must register/login in order to see the link.

    Other than that, don't worry about the letters or emails or etc that they send you. But if you really wanna feel secure, just consult your local Lawyer and he/she will be able to advice you accordingly.

    Don't let methods of intimidation fool you.

    Just a side track story. A friend of mine actually registered a domain name which has the word "dell" in it. After 1 month, she received a Fedex from DELL's Lawyer from the USA (she lives in Malaysia) and it demanded that she gave up the right to the domain and gave it to DELL. She was so intimidated by the lawyer letter that she agreed.

    After knowing me, asking about this and etc. I brought her to my friend who is a lawyer in Malaysia and she found out later that she need not do that. No Lawyer in another country has the right to prosecute you unless you've done something wrong in the Original Country that the prosecutor resides.

    So, unless you did do something wrong in the Phillipines and/or did break some law or something, WU could only prosecute you by getting a Phillipine Lawyer and not try to pull a hoax or something by getting a US Lawyer to prosecute you. If they do try it, your country will stand up for you. Trust me, it's been seen and proven over time and time again :)

    Hope this bit helps.
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2006
    1 person likes this.
  14. May 28, 2006
  15. spearmaster

    spearmaster RIP Ted

    Occupation:
    Devil's Advocate
    Location:
    Heaven
    This statement is incorrect, Linus, just so you know.
     
    1 person likes this.
  16. May 28, 2006
  17. dominique

    dominique Dormant account

    Occupation:
    webmistress
    Location:
    The Boonies
    Internet gambling is NOT illegal in the US, which is why they try to pass a law against it year after year after year.

    Using telephone lines to do sportsbetting IS illegal in the US.
     
  18. May 28, 2006
  19. duke7123

    duke7123 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    CEO
    Location:
    Philippines
    Western Union Reply Spearmaster and Thanks

    First of all I would like to thank all of you for your input and advise. they state that because even if the transaction was done by me here in the Philippines ,it has to go though a channel which is located in the USA any and all transactions go though them in the states, that is how they were able to stop me. I had conversation with the site and they told me that they have agents that pick the funds up for them and then give it to the site. I have also had phone conversation with the site and was told that Western Union can do nothing. Well they did they held my funds and fees until they get the information that they are asking for. They claim that under the W/U aggrements that they have a right even when I get back in the states to requied the informatioon from me if I don't comply with their request. In the letter that I received they also mention that if these funds were sent for any other reason that what their policy states, that I might be able to have them returned to me via the agent or the 3rd party receiver. I could go on and tell more in the letter that I received here at my home in Philippines and by the way I was informed that a letter was also sent to my home in USA. So as you can see I am trying to get a handel on this. It seems that they are after the other parties and not me but just want the information from me. By the tone of the letter it sounds like they want to go after to whom the money went to.

    I also would like to say that I don't have a gambling problem and sent 15K+ and that is not unsual for a player in 6 months. Maybe I am playing the wrong site. All I know that all of this was condoned by the site and that maybe I should just give the name to them and also all of the online chats and emails that I have received from them, even telling me that Western Union on their end has blocked the names of who to send the money to. I had to find out the hard way from them that the person that I sent to was blocked. So the site provided me with additional names. This would change like once a week I had no idea what was going on until I received a block and emails from the site. After all of this I am not sure as to how and or what to do. One thing is for sure that I guess the end play would be is to get an attorney as I have done here in the Philippines as well as talk to my attorney in the states. I will say that I did send money again to the site under my wifes madian name and that they site accepted it and credited my account even she was not a a registered player. As you can see its very complex for me as who did what wrong? If anyone has in put who did what wrong please let me know your feelings or suggestions. Once again thanks to all!!!:confused:

    Duke
     
  20. May 28, 2006
  21. dominique

    dominique Dormant account

    Occupation:
    webmistress
    Location:
    The Boonies
    You keep saying "site".

    What kind of site?

    Casino? Sportsbetting? Poker? Bingo? Some kind of agency placing bets for you?
     
  22. May 28, 2006
  23. Pinababy69

    Pinababy69 RIP Lisa

    Occupation:
    Crusader
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario - Canada
    I hope it wasn't Futurebet, was it Duke?? LOL....sorry, couldn't resist. :D
     
    1 person likes this.
  24. May 28, 2006
  25. duke7123

    duke7123 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    CEO
    Location:
    Philippines
    Sorry its a Online Casino Site Slots etc

    Sorry but until now I onlu assumed that all would know that it is a online casino site a Microgaming software. 99% of the time I played the slots and video poker. Once again sorry but I will not name the site as of yet.

    Thanks again and sorry that I did not tell what it was.

    Duke
     
  26. May 28, 2006
  27. duke7123

    duke7123 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    CEO
    Location:
    Philippines
    No Pinababy69 I will never paly after seeing on here

    Any Futurebet sites I have learned from many forums that it is best to stay away from that site. and Or any sites that have their sofware. It was a MICROGAMING software site. Which I have played now for 6 months.

    Thanks

    Duke
     
  28. May 28, 2006
  29. Linus

    Linus Dormant account

    Occupation:
    asdf
    Location:
    TX
    Duke - I'm not sure why you don't just use Neteller or Firepay, if Western Union doesn't want you to use them.


    Spear & Dom - There's some ambiguity about whether Federal law prohibits gambling.

    State law, however, is clear.

    All the states generally prohibit gambling. Most states also have exceptions. Nevada allows it in state-licensed casinos. Others have state-run lotteries. Still others limit it to Indian reservations.

    But if your gambling doesn't fall under one of those exceptions, it's not legal. And no state has an exception for gambling on the internet. The mere fact you're doing it on the internet doesn't make it legal.

    The penalties do vary from one state to another. For example, in my state (Texas) it's a Class C misdemeanor. In Washington, supposedly, it's a felony.
     
    1 person likes this.
  30. May 28, 2006
  31. duke7123

    duke7123 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    CEO
    Location:
    Philippines
    Linus I am really not sure and It all about West/Union

    Linus, I have only told the truth here its not about neteller or firepay or ecocard. Its about what I have posted here just telling all what I have and still going though in this matter. The fact that even the casino site accepted funds made via Western Union in my wifes madian name and then they credited it to my account and she is not even a registered player nor was the funds sent in my regesitered name. The casino credited my account because like I said I have played them now for 6 months and sent a lot of money. So I guess it like Carl huttons story if one feels that they are going to win and I have played several sites. Then maybe his story is true even on page 2 he talks about Western Union and names. So I am just not going to name the site because I am a owner of several corporations and I will respect the site until I get a chance to talk with them. We have address this before but now its becoming a nightmare for me and the site is ok with that. Having said that I feel I owe it to them even if it means taking some heat because the deserve a chance to help me with this.

    Respectfully,

    Duke
     
  32. May 28, 2006
  33. spearmaster

    spearmaster RIP Ted

    Occupation:
    Devil's Advocate
    Location:
    Heaven
    Your statement said "Internet gambling is illegal in the US."

    This is not regulated by federal law as you have pointed out - and to refer to the US rather than the individual states implies that federal law governs this.

    Just because something is not explicitly legal does not make it explicitly illegal as well. This is the basis on which I said that your statement is incorrect.

    There are states which indeed have laws directly referring to online gambling - and of which all of those that I know of do in fact make internet gambling illegal. There is no state which has declared internet gambling legal as far as I am aware, unless you include intra-state gambling online, which is legal in Nevada for residents within state borders, but financial transactions must otherwise be made in person at the casino/sportsbook in question.
     
  34. May 28, 2006
  35. Linus

    Linus Dormant account

    Occupation:
    asdf
    Location:
    TX
    Spear, a general prohibition against gambling covers gambling on the internet, just like a law against stealing prohibits using the internet to steal.
     
    1 person likes this.
  36. May 28, 2006
  37. duke7123

    duke7123 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    CEO
    Location:
    Philippines
    Linus Just sent Pinababy69 under moneygram

    It seems to me that you are correct and I have just scanned part of the letter that I received and email in the moneygram. I think you will see that they are very serious.

    By the way Thank you.

    Duke
     
  38. May 28, 2006
  39. spearmaster

    spearmaster RIP Ted

    Occupation:
    Devil's Advocate
    Location:
    Heaven
    There is no federal law that provides for general prohibition of gambling, other than the Wire Act which prevent the placing of a wager across state lines - and this has only been found to apply to sports wagering at present.

    Furthermore, not every state has general prohibitions against gambling. Thus your statement cannot be held to be true.

    edit -> Clarification - what may be considered gambling in one state may not be considered gambling in another. Statutes and age limits vary widely from state to state - and as I have pointed out before, Internet gambling DOES have some legal status in Nevada. Thus a blanket statement such as "Internet gambling is illegal in the US" cannot possibly be accurate.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2006

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