Webcast: Playing with bonuses

[Zoozie]

In the recent Webcast, Casinomeister once again touched issues regarding bonuses. This is because the bonuses are the reason for many disputes, basically because the software does not support the bonus-systems so the user has to press every button very carefully.

But what I want to bring up is CM's 'advise' not to use bonuses and you would avoid many of the pitfalls. Is unfair indirectly blame the casual customer for taking a bonus and getting into trouble, instead the blame should be solely on the casinos for making bonuses the platform is not designed for.

I better advice to the players would be simply be to update the rogue/not recommended section with these casinos. Then the players are warned whether they will play at that casino with bonuses or without.

A good advice to the casinos/software providers would be implement a consistent bonus system into the software. This is not rocket-science and
many platforms already have this:WagerWorks, Crypto, 3Dice, WagerWorks,Rival and MG (except for the few MG casinos that are not following the intended EZ/clearplay bonuses system).

Another of my arguments is that many casual players getting into problems are slot players. And they are playing against 4%-12% house edge and this
is quite an insult. Of course players can just stop playing, but most also do not realize how utterly fast they the slots are taking their money. I myself
have the will to never play slots without a bonus(though I learned my lesson years ago.)

So my advice to slot players are almost opposite of yours: Never play slots without a bonus and avoid the rogue/not recommended list.

In the last 3 years I have maybe lost 2000$ at slots, and I am a low roller at 0.25$/bet! But I have also gotten maybe 15000$ in slot bonuses. So without the bonuses I would have lost 17000$ instead. (But then I would not have played the slots of course). So playing with bonuses first of all 'saved' me 15000$, but most of I got a lot more entertainment (number of spins) for my money.

If a player do not care about money he can play the slots in fun mode. It there was some 2% at most house edge slots around I would consider playing without bonuses. And if the casual player understood what the house edge is doing to his money, I am sure he would also not find it worth the entertainment.

And to CM, keep up the good Webcasts!

 

[lojo]

In the last 3 years I have maybe lost 2000$ at slots, and I am a low roller at 0.25$/bet! But I have also gotten maybe 15000$ in slot bonuses. So without the bonuses I would have lost 17000$ instead. (But then I would not have played the slots of course). So playing with bonuses first of all 'saved' me 15000$, but most of I got a lot more entertainment (number of spins) for my money.

Zoozie, I know you are very knowledgable about gambling, so with all due respect please don't think that all I am going to say is meant to educate you, I'm just offerring a differing opinion.

To each his own I suppose.
Of course there are formulae using boni wherein, over time, you can 'beat the house edge' and make a profit at slots. This usually requires many losing sessions for the occasional bigger winning session. Many people on this board do it. It may appear to be 'gambling' but it is something else altogether, it is manipulation, imo.

All games are 'negative expectation', meaning you can expect to lose your money over time if you keep playing. But you can also win a tidy sum on your first spin. This is gambling.

Over about two years I am down maybe $200 and I rarely use bonuses. I averaged +/-$200 a week in deposits until 9-10 months ago and a lot less since then. When I sit down to play I fully expect to lose all of my money, if I can't afford to lose it, I won't play with it. Of course, I also hope to win.

Playing at an accredited casino I'm assured of the things we see as CasinoMeister criteria. If I don't use a bonus, I never have to have a hassle; the bet is placed, the bet is accepted, if I win I am payed. This is gambling.

If I accept a bonus I have to devalue my money... @30xb&d my money is worth 1/15 what it was on payday... a dollar becomes worth less than .07c.
I also have to comingle my money with theirs which means I have to play by rules that have nothing to do with 'place bet, win get paid' because it's their damn money I'm playing with they get to make up new rules! No thank you.

I see one reason and one reason only to ever accept a bonus... that is to play a Microgaming progressive where I am doubling my chances and will be paid the whole mess if I win. Sweet! This is of course extremely high variance, but probably better than state lotto tickets

If I want to increase the number of spins and decrease my stress level in re bonus hassles, all I have to do is bet much smaller; 1c per line on a nine liner, play only ten of 40 lines available, etc. I don't need to use a bonus to extend my play time. In the ridiculous I could lower my bets to one penny, one line and play 15x longer than 1c on 15 lines.

The key to enjoyable gaming, ime, is to never bet more than I can stand to lose - and to quit while I'm ahead.

As I'm currently an overall, lifetime 'loser' I have to examine my future and how much I'm willing to lose over my lifetime. As I was +/-$5,000 ahead at one time I'm making that my total allowable loss. If I ever get there and if I ever gamble after that I will have no hopes or expectatons of winning, but simply be spending money on the entertainment... and I can think of a lot of things more entertaining than giving away money

So, in closing, I'll say again, to each his/her own. But when I look at the time I've spent reading T&C, hassling with CS, etc. etc I could have been earning money to actually gamble with and expect to be paid if I won. I have no desire to devalue my currency, nor to play with their money if there are going to be rules attached, so.. no mo boni for me.

 

[SlotsWizard]

I have no desire to devalue my currency

<derail>
You don't need to. Our government is doing a fantastic job of that for us.
</derail>