Virtual Group question

poser

Experienced Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2007
Location
Hamburg
Hi,

as I read that this group is in the rogue section, I have aquestion:

Do they just sometimes NOT pay or do they never pay ?

Do they just take the money and nothing ever comes out of it again, or is it just the BIG winnings they dont pay ?

Is there someone here who ever got a successful cash out ?

THX

poser
 

SlotsWizard

Dormant account
Joined
May 11, 2006
Location
North of Antarctica
I never played at any of their casinos, but if I were to guess I would say that anything less than $100 they might pay, anything beyond that and you're screwed.

Your chances of getting paid here are slim to none these days. Why not pick a reputable casino?
 

mrracetrack

Dormant account
Joined
Sep 14, 2001
Location
North of Pluto
Hi,

as I read that this group is in the rogue section, I have aquestion:

Do they just sometimes NOT pay or do they never pay ?

Do they just take the money and nothing ever comes out of it again, or is it just the BIG winnings they dont pay ?

Is there someone here who ever got a successful cash out ?

THX

poser

Just curious poser...

Are you considering playing at a Virtual casino?

Based on your questions... I would assume that you are.

And if you are... can you explain your reason why?

Thanks!! :)
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
The answers are:

1/ They sometimes pay because they want you to deposit more. You are normally paid a couple of times after you lose several of your deposits. Its highly unlikely that your withdrawals can get to even a fraction of your previous deposits.

2/ Big winnings! That will be a true novelty. I understand that occasionally something will come out from this rock but as I said they just want to attract more deposits. If they pay you just once and then offer you a 600% bonus you are bound to fall for it. Then they will start not paying.

3/ Five years ago, as a newbie, I played a couple of times there but lost so there was no withdrawal anyway. Then with Virtualted (Phynqster now at this forum) at the helm, I tried it again, won some money and the cashin was processed successfully. He left eventually and the complaints came in thick and fast. So you guessed it, I never deposited again.

Furthermore, I am appalled at their using the 911 event as a promotional gimmick. Just how low can you go? They are not Jack, for Christ's sake.
 

lanidar

Dormant account
Joined
Sep 5, 2003
Location
Avenel, New Jersey
Hi,

as I read that this group is in the rogue section, I have aquestion:

Do they just sometimes NOT pay or do they never pay ?

Do they just take the money and nothing ever comes out of it again, or is it just the BIG winnings they dont pay ?

Is there someone here who ever got a successful cash out ?

THX

poser

You play at Virtual and you WILL get....
Expired Image
 

cynthial

Boo
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Location
Albuquerque
:lolup:
See, if you even mention that name all sorts of stuff starts crawling out from under the rocks. It must have an odor of sorts.

Hi there mrracetrack and lanidar. :p
 

phynqster

Dormant account
Joined
Jul 15, 2004
Location
los angeles, ca
I know when I was there and I am pretty sure even now all legitimate wins are paid, albeit sometimes very very very slow. If it a regular that they know will redeposit most of the withdrawal they pay that person quick. If it is a first time player that is looking to only cash out and not looking to "just gamble away there money" than that person will drop to the bottom of the pay list and be given every excuse in the book on why the payment is delayed, hoping you go ahead and play the money and lose it.
Remember this is only for the withdrawals the casinos deem legitimate. If a T is not crossed or an I not dotted, than all hell breaks loose. But for just an entertainment value of playing cards or watching reels spin, and talking to a friendly customer service staff, than these casinos are great, but if you are looking to win money than read the rogue section.
 

lojo

Banned User - repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Location
USA
Did you see where palcae of chance denied winnings to someone simply because they communicated with Bryan about it? (that's what they said anyway, but they had already denied it before she PaB) so she may still have a chance at getting the money if she... what? does a magical dance? It's crazymaking.
 

lanidar

Dormant account
Joined
Sep 5, 2003
Location
Avenel, New Jersey
I know when I was there and I am pretty sure even now all legitimate wins are paid, albeit sometimes very very very slow. If it a regular that they know will redeposit most of the withdrawal they pay that person quick. If it is a first time player that is looking to only cash out and not looking to "just gamble away there money" than that person will drop to the bottom of the pay list and be given every excuse in the book on why the payment is delayed, hoping you go ahead and play the money and lose it.
Remember this is only for the withdrawals the casinos deem legitimate. If a T is not crossed or an I not dotted, than all hell breaks loose. But for just an entertainment value of playing cards or watching reels spin, and talking to a friendly customer service staff, than these casinos are great, but if you are looking to win money than read the rogue section.

I know that you and I have had our "run in's" in the past but, I appreciate your candor and honesty here. :thumbsup:
 

bernynhel

Dormant account
PABnoaccred
PABnononaccred
Joined
Jan 30, 2006
Location
Los Angeles
Anytime you come across a casino you don't know and are considering, in addition to checking here at CM, just Google it! If there's anything negative about it in any measurable quantity, it'll be right there in the top 10 results. Never fails. Came back to add this after Googling Virtual Group : Virtual Group? :laugh:
 
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BBKPoker

halfway to busto
PABrogue3
Joined
Dec 5, 2005
Location
Edinburgh, Seattle, Vancouver BC, Auckland
I got paid by them on three different properties. Two, I basically bitched, moaned and complained on a daily basis for six weeks or so until they paid me (probably to shut me up).

Then, I saw a really nice bonus offer on a third property, and I read in CM's newsletter that they were trying to clean up their act and they wanted to be on probation and they were willing to respond to people's complaints on here, so I decided to give them another go.

Needless to say, it took me four weeks of complaining, pming the rep on here every other day, and eventually a PAB to get paid.

I'll certainly never play at the Virtual Group ever again.................

and neither should you.
 

poser

Experienced Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2007
Location
Hamburg
THX for the answers. As it was just 15 Euros I deposited and the winning is max possible, I think I have bad chances to get paid.
 

lanidar

Dormant account
Joined
Sep 5, 2003
Location
Avenel, New Jersey
:lolup:
See, if you even mention that name all sorts of stuff starts crawling out from under the rocks. It must have an odor of sorts.

Hi there mrracetrack and lanidar. :p
LANIDARSKELATON.jpeg


TRACK.jpeg


TRACK...
HEY TRACK....
WHO THE HELL STOLE OUR ROCK!!!

:D :D :D
 

cynthial

Boo
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Location
Albuquerque
Track looks like a GIRL there. Just what I suspected all along. :p
And you Lanidar, you should get to the nearest emergency room. I think you may need a check-up. :eek:
 

poser

Experienced Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2007
Location
Hamburg
SOLVED - GOT PAID

Hi,

finally, they paid me my win.

It was the MAX cashout, and I only deposited the min possible.

It was 19 days from requesting a pay ou to having my money in C2P.

After all, its not delayed very much, as their T+Cs says: 10 days until processing. And then 5 says until its finalized.

Was I lucky ?? Dont know ??

But I think they cut in their own flesh with those slow payments, because theit was virtually NO reason for me to reverse the pay out, as I had MAX winnings.

poser
 

acepedro45

Dormant account
Joined
May 19, 2006
Location
Arlington, VA
See, if you even mention that name all sorts of stuff starts crawling out from under the rocks. It must have an odor of sorts.

The funniest thing about the Virtual Group is that they just don't get it. They could clean up their act and make lots of money, or they could keep trying to screw people and limp along as the worst casino on the internet.
 

kyleb

Dormant account
Cool Cat Casino

I've played on Cool Cat Casino as a regular and lost quite a bit of money, but got lucky a few times on some very nice 200% bonuses when Victoria was still the manager. She always paid me $2500/week on time, and in some cases, paid me INSTANTLY. That was amazing, especially because it was after the UIEGA laws, so I knew that it would be difficult for her to pay out to my Click2Pay account.

She always offered me great bonuses when she could, and when there weren't any bonuses to offer, she gave me insurance and quick cashouts when I requested them (of course with the maximum being $2500 per week, but that is more than fair).

Unfortunately, she is now gone, and the management team that took over is really quite bad. It's a shame - one of the casinos in that group was actually very reputable and had great customer service with a manager who was active on the forums here and over email/livechat is now rogue.

I really like RTG software, too. Ah, the glory days. :rolleyes:
 

lojo

Banned User - repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Location
USA
It just doesn't make any sense; I think they could rebuild their business model and bury their bad track record in the past if they chose to.

Even at 45x or whatever they feel like the day you try to cash out, 500% and 600% bonuses WILL get played through often enough and they will have to pay (or not, whatever).

And if they replaced certain managers responses of, ' I'm too busy too look right now, there are other customers in front of you'. WITH A FREAKIN WINDOW IN THE CASHIER THAT SHOWED YOUR WR they'd have time to answer a customer's question instead of blowing you off.

Shorten the 'approval time'. Stop playing games with withdrawals, etc.
Any high school aged homemaker knows you can't delay paying your bills thinking they will be easier to pay later... it catches up and compounds and next month you're right where you were before you took a holiday from paying your debts - only worse.

Do those things and more and sooner or later the house edge will pay the bills and please the player community.

I'm of the mind that they got over-extended and the slow pay, no pay is the result of that and bumbles created by it, but that's just me, with very limited knowledge.

From communicating with GM's in other casinos 'on the mend' I understand it is extremely difficult to root out certain thinking and practices that build up over time, it can run deep. I actually had a casino manager once tell me, "they might call me a crook for denying bonus abusers their winnings, but I'd rather be called a crook than a chump." I can see his point, absolutely, but...

I think as long as the promotions in this industry are run by way of bonuses, the Virtual Group will probably continue to run they way they do today... how could they possibly change without changing their business model, and if the other 500 casinos out there can't come up with a better way to promote and retain their clients, how can the Virtual Group?
 

phynqster

Dormant account
Joined
Jul 15, 2004
Location
los angeles, ca
From communicating with GM's in other casinos 'on the mend' I understand it is extremely difficult to root out certain thinking and practices that build up over time, it can run deep. I actually had a casino manager once tell me, "they might call me a crook for denying bonus abusers their winnings, but I'd rather be called a crook than a chump." I can see his point, absolutely, but...
You almost hit it on the head with this, but it actually pertains to all casinos and for that matter business. This is a business for the casino; it is a hobby for the player. When you start talking profits and losses, and reporting to board of directors and such things change. How does what a casino might due, compare to a car company who knows a car is defective but realize it will be more expensive to fix the problem, than pay the lawsuits from the "squeaky wheels". Think about what life in general would be like if there was little if any regulation on business? I think that everyone who "pitches one bitch" or makes one disparaging remark about the casino or the industry, should also post their congressmen or one of many different grass root organizations on forming a regulatory agency for internet gambling, if people would do this than we would see a change, until than it is just good profit and loss business for the casinos.
 

lojo

Banned User - repetitive violations of <a href="ht
Joined
Jan 18, 2007
Location
USA
I hear ya, phynqster. When i had a specialty woods business our QC was so tight that we could take the allowable reject number and mix it in purposely. That might sound shitty, but for some reason i could never negotiate a higher price for a 'perfect load', so to stay competitive that 'slack' was sometimes my only profit margin. I couldn't change the industry by being a tail wagging the dog, and the customers were so used to having a mix of lower grade product that it was industry standard.

I don't really see the online gambling business ever being completely driven by market forces. Why the hell is there not htree or four MG's, RTG's, etc. competing for our business? Nooooo, we not only have dozens (?) of Microgaming casinos, we have white labels coming now... all selling the same product in a different package - the only difference is the Operator.

Could market forces make Virtual's name be gold, or slowly choke them off? I don't know. But I've never met a business I couldn't improve; and the first step is to listen to the customer, then the lost customer, then the potential customer.
++++++++++++++

I guess i am for regulation, but I hope it is grass-roots driven, and not what we in the States will probably get; a package prepared by the corporate big boys designed to eliminate the possibility of entrepreneurs and independants. They'll have some ridiculous liability requirements (instead of a collective insurance pool) and other things to make it impossible unless you are backed by billions. Bummer.

+++++++++++++
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
It just doesn't make any sense; I think they could rebuild their business model and bury their bad track record in the past if they chose to.
...I think as long as the promotions in this industry are run by way of bonuses, the Virtual Group will probably continue to run they way they do today... how could they possibly change without changing their business model, and if the other 500 casinos out there can't come up with a better way to promote and retain their clients, how can the Virtual Group?
I've met with them and have seen this business model. That was last October and it seemed that they were on the right track, so I gave them another chance.

It was relatively a good plan, but even with one's best plan laid - failure comes when it remains just a plan. It was just a stack of papers; that's about it. There are still players not being paid their winnings by agreed upon schedules, other players are being jerked around by manipulative "management" techniques (sorry, manager is not in right now, will you please go away?), and they still have this roguelike bumbling aura about them. Get a load of the 911 promos they had last month :rolleyes:
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
I've met with them and have seen this business model. That was last October and it seemed that they were on the right track, so I gave them another chance.

It was relatively a good plan, but even with one's best plan laid - failure comes when it remains just a plan. It was just a stack of papers; that's about it. There are still players not being paid their winnings by agreed upon schedules, other players are being jerked around by manipulative "management" techniques (sorry, manager is not in right now, will you please go away?), and they still have this roguelike bumbling aura about them. Get a load of the 911 promos they had last month :rolleyes:

They say that they want to reform but dont even bother to try. I may only be guessing but they could be trying to get their act together last October only to see their customer base whittled away by the loss of US customers. They cannot brave the cold and arent in for the long haul. Maybe its time to say that they have had enough of probations and that they are permanently rogued.

You are right Bryan. The 911 promos were disgusting and I consider this an understatement.
 

kyleb

Dormant account
They say that they want to reform but dont even bother to try. I may only be guessing but they could be trying to get their act together last October only to see their customer base whittled away by the loss of US customers. They cannot brave the cold and arent in for the long haul. Maybe its time to say that they have had enough of probations and that they are permanently rogued.

You are right Bryan. The 911 promos were disgusting and I consider this an understatement.

This is unfortunately true with the departure of Victoria. Last October was when the bonuses were great, and even at the beginning of this year (Jan-March) things were fine despite NETeller being gone.

The truth is, though, that the Virtual Group isn't the only one to go bad. Look at former reputable places like most MG casinos now - Fortune Lounge, Casino Rewards, Mini Vegas / Vegas Affiliates, and Jackpot Factory. All of them are stealing winnings AFTER the fact as well - a classic RTG tactic.
 
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