# Virtual Casino Cipher work-up

#### cipher

##### Banned member - being a jerk
First off there are certain techniques that I've employed in the Virtual Casino session work-up as attached hereto. Let me say this, I've had the benefit of better than six years now in compiling Cipher strands and interpreting trend analysis and there are certain techniques that I feel comfortable in using.

Under no circumstances do I recommend to anyone that they venture into such techniques without a thorough understanding of trend analysis. The screen shots of the techniques employed herein are meant for illustrative purposes only.

If you'll look at hand #67 as well as hand #92 you'll see that both of those hands are hands that could not have normally been won by the player. By paying attention to the values as they were recorded I was able to "steal" both hands #67 and #92 which made for a profitable session rather than a losing session. Have a good one.

Holy cow, Cipher! :notworthy

Your "juevos" must be the size of grapefruits!

Just kidding, awesome to see such good hits though I'll stick to my flat-betting myself. Good one!

If only I could perform such steals myself!

cipher said:
If you'll look at hand #67 as well as hand #92 you'll see that both of those hands are hands that could not have normally been won by the player.

Those are certainly some spectacular strategy deviations (splitting 5s against a 6 and doubling down on a 7), and in this particular instance you're correct - basic strategy would have lost both hands. In order to make the above statement "could not have normally been won by the player" you would have to have either "known" that a 10 was the hole card in 67, to be followed by a 7 off the top of the deck, and that the order of cards in 92 would be 2, 3 and 4, with a 6 in the hole - consigning the player to low hands and dealer 19 and 21 - or have "known" the specific order of wins and losses ("trends"). But in the latter case, you would simply play optimal strategy and let the "trend" take care of itself - so you must be alluding to predicting the actual card values.

Feel free to clarify any of the above.

i truly believe this, you cant play basic stragdy to long oon any online casino but stanley and con and maybe oasis

i believe some software detect your playing pattern and adjust to it

bethug said:
i truly believe this, you cant play basic stragdy to long oon any online casino but stanley and con and maybe oasis

i believe some software detect your playing pattern and adjust to it

Bethug, You go straight to the head of the class my friend. It's my opinion that every system out there starts out random until it's figured out your game play and what particular strategy you are using. Good job Bethug!!

caruso said:
Those are certainly some spectacular strategy deviations (splitting 5s against a 6 and doubling down on a 7), and in this particular instance you're correct - basic strategy would have lost both hands. In order to make the above statement "could not have normally been won by the player" you would have to have either "known" that a 10 was the hole card in 67, to be followed by a 7 off the top of the deck, and that the order of cards in 92 would be 2, 3 and 4, with a 6 in the hole - consigning the player to low hands and dealer 19 and 21 - or have "known" the specific order of wins and losses ("trends"). But in the latter case, you would simply play optimal strategy and let the "trend" take care of itself - so you must be alluding to predicting the actual card values.

Feel free to clarify any of the above.

If you look at the separations screen shot that I've provided, you can clearly see the "dumping" and "seeding" of prime valued cards for the situations of both of those hands. It's not rocket science but you've got to be able to see it as it's happening. Have a good one.

This is very interesting and scary at same time. It's a liitle bite too "intelligent" for me, but I sure like to know more. Cipher, bethug, are you going to Vegas together next month? I would like to meet you guys, so you can explain to me

Have a great weekend!!!

caruso said:
Those are certainly some spectacular strategy deviations (splitting 5s against a 6 and doubling down on a 7), and in this particular instance you're correct - basic strategy would have lost both hands. In order to make the above statement "could not have normally been won by the player" you would have to have either "known" that a 10 was the hole card in 67, to be followed by a 7 off the top of the deck, and that the order of cards in 92 would be 2, 3 and 4, with a 6 in the hole - consigning the player to low hands and dealer 19 and 21 - or have "known" the specific order of wins and losses ("trends"). But in the latter case, you would simply play optimal strategy and let the "trend" take care of itself - so you must be alluding to predicting the actual card values.

Feel free to clarify any of the above.

The 10 wasn't the hole card in 67, the 4 is! Or you mean the next card coming out of the deck was a 10 (which isn't called the hole card technically)? If you start using the wrong terminology, it confuses other readers who are trying to understand what you are saying.

In #67, cipher split a pair of 10's versus dealer's 10. Then doubled down
on 12 vs 10 and let stand the other 17.

In #92, cipher split a pair of 5's versus dealer's 6 and then doubled down on 9 vs 6 and 7 vs 6.

Note that cipher did some other deviations from basic strategy that did not work out, for example #89: 15 vs 4; #82: 10 vs A (it was only a \$2 bet), #66: 12 vs 4.

Then there are other deviations that did, for example #64: split 7's vs 10; #24: doubled on 9 vs 8.

cipher said:
If you look at the separations screen shot that I've provided, you can clearly see the "dumping" and "seeding" of prime valued cards for the situations of both of those hands. It's not rocket science but you've got to be able to see it as it's happening. Have a good one.

Prime valued cards? You have got to explain that, I see 2, 4 beside the 5, 7. In any case how is that helping you to win? Or when you see a bunch of small prime cards, dealer is going to be hit by a 10 and therefore busting? Are you sort of counting cards?

Cipher , welcome back.

you play real mode or fun mode ?

I heard many forums had ban VISUAL casino in the blacklist

How soon is their payout speed? any DOCs required ?

Thanks , have a good one.

sw2003 said:
Prime valued cards? You have got to explain that, I see 2, 4 beside the 5, 7. In any case how is that helping you to win? Or when you see a bunch of small prime cards, dealer is going to be hit by a 10 and therefore busting? Are you sort of counting cards?

With internet blackjack I generally find when there are a great many similarly valued cards you can generally classify that happening as a "dump" and I've seen it time and time again where that type of thing plays havoc with the continuity of a session. Have a good one.

cynowoo said:
Cipher , welcome back.

you play real mode or fun mode ?

I heard many forums had ban VISUAL casino in the blacklist

How soon is their payout speed? any DOCs required ?

Thanks , have a good one.

Hi Cynowoo, I'm assuming that you're talking about Virtual casino and not Visual casino. I'll be the first to admit that Virtual has had some pretty tough times in the past. But having said that, I'm pretty impressed with some of the things that are finally coming about there at Virtual as a result of Ted being there.

I originally set my account up there years ago and I did at one time have a serious run in with the management at that time on a \$10,000.00 blackjack win that they had refused to pay. That incident was pretty well covered here and at the prescription. The long a short of it was they ultimately paid.

As for what their requirements are now I would make absolutely certain that you read and understand totally what their current requirements are and if you have any question don't hesitate to call Ted at Virtual for clarification. Have a good one.

sw2003 said:
The 10 wasn't the hole card in 67, the 4 is! Or you mean the next card coming out of the deck was a 10 (which isn't called the hole card technically)? If you start using the wrong terminology, it confuses other readers who are trying to understand what you are saying.

No, it's you who don't understand the terminology - or RTG gameplay. The "hole card" is the down card. In 67, the 4 is the up card, and the 10 is the hole card. The hole card lies underneath the upcard, to the left, and is always the leftmost card of the dealer hand with RTG. It is NOT the second card from the left. He split 10s against 4, not 10.

Load up an RTG and take look at it in play mode, you'll soon get the idea.

Last edited:
bethug said:
i truly believe this, you cant play basic stragdy to long oon any online casino but stanley and con and maybe oasis

i believe some software detect your playing pattern and adjust to it

I think if the software is rigged and wants to take you down there is no need to detect s.o. playing pattern. It simply lets you bust or has some "lucky hands" for the dealer. Whether you follow basic strategy, hood 3000 system or whatever.

WB Cipher You're going to have to teach me trend spotting over a beer next month!

spearmaster said:
WB Cipher You're going to have to teach me trend spotting over a beer next month!

Spear, I don't know how successful you will be with the beer in your hand, but "I'll give it a a go old boy." Have a good one.

caruso said:
No, it's you who don't understand the terminology - or RTG gameplay. The "hole card" is the down card. In 67, the 4 is the up card, and the 10 is the hole card. The hole card lies underneath the upcard, to the left, and is always the leftmost card of the dealer hand with RTG. It is NOT the second card from the left. He split 10s against 4, not 10.

Load up an RTG and take look at it in play mode, you'll soon get the idea.

So the order of the cards of the hands in the actual record in the html file isn't according to the order of appearance? That sucks!

The first card is actually the second card and the hole card is the first??
What sort of screwed up order is this?

cipher said:
First off there are certain techniques that I've employed in the Virtual Casino session work-up as attached hereto. Let me say this, I've had the benefit of better than six years now in compiling Cipher strands and interpreting trend analysis and there are certain techniques that I feel comfortable in using.

Under no circumstances do I recommend to anyone that they venture into such techniques without a thorough understanding of trend analysis. The screen shots of the techniques employed herein are meant for illustrative purposes only.

If you'll look at hand #67 as well as hand #92 you'll see that both of those hands are hands that could not have normally been won by the player. By paying attention to the values as they were recorded I was able to "steal" both hands #67 and #92 which made for a profitable session rather than a losing session. Have a good one.

BJ is my favourite game, this is very interesting. Are you saying you know what the cards are before they come out ? You must to do what you did in those cases otherwise why would you do what you did ? Can you share your secret with us , is this a well known technique that you are using ? I mean i occassionally do what you did above but out of boredom not skill .

Why would a rogue casino cheat this way? Why not just cheat by making sure the card that comes out will be a winner for the house? This stuff about seeding cascading down the line is silly. WHy go to that trouble and not just flat out cheat?

largeeyes said:
Why would a rogue casino cheat this way? Why not just cheat by making sure the card that comes out will be a winner for the house? This stuff about seeding cascading down the line is silly. WHy go to that trouble and not just flat out cheat?

In answering your question, let me ask you a question. At a brick and mortar casino, would you consider it "cheating" for a pit boss to change dealer on you say 3 or 4 times in 12 hands? You may not like that kind of action but I've had it happen and only because the "House" was getting severly clocked and they were going to try every "trick" in the book to compensate for the losses they were taking. Which is exactly what happened in this Virtual session.

The fact of the matter is this. There is no "pit boss" on the Internet so the only way the "House" has of making up for losses sustained is through the dumping and seeding of values, to bring about the same effect as would be intended by changing dealers multiple times in a short amount of time at a brick and mortar casino.

Believe it or not a random number generator can be programed to react to just about any set of circumstances you can throw at it. Have a good one.

cipher said:
In answering your question, let me ask you a question. At a brick and mortar casino, would you consider it "cheating" for a pit boss to change dealer on you say 3 or 4 times in 12 hands? You may not like that kind of action but I've had it happen and only because the "House" was getting severly clocked and they were going to try every "trick" in the book to compensate for the losses they were taking. Which is exactly what happened in this Virtual session.

The fact of the matter is this. There is no "pit boss" on the Internet so the only way the "House" has of making up for losses sustained is through the dumping and seeding of values, to bring about the same effect as would be intended by changing dealers multiple times in a short amount of time at a brick and mortar casino.

Believe it or not a random number generator can be programed to react to just about any set of circumstances you can throw at it. Have a good one.

So as per my previous post are you saying you know what the cards are before they are dealt ? I am not getting why you split those cards in this thread and what techniques are you using to determine those hands you posted ? Are they you own techniques or are they known published techniques ? I am really interested to know.

blackjack, i dont think he will go into details on a open forum.

bobbyblackjack said:
So as per my previous post are you saying you know what the cards are before they are dealt ? I am not getting why you split those cards in this thread and what techniques are you using to determine those hands you posted ? Are they you own techniques or are they known published techniques ? I am really interested to know.

Hi Bobby;

If you'll go to the first post in this thread and open the attachment that says "separations" you can clearly see what was happening has far as the "dumping" and seeding of "key" valued cards for those two hands.

This type of thing does not happen a lot and almost all of the time it occurs when you are substantially up in the session. The "technique" you speak of is more or less a variation of what one learns in counting cards. When the deck is rich in plus valued cards and you have a good ace count, it's time to make money. Have a good one.

Cipher;
I guess the question must be: Do you think that there is not a shuffle after every hand. Therefore if low cards are dealt (seeded?), then high cards must be forthcoming. The only alternative theory would be an unrandom generator or a program that makes a RNG play unrandom! At any rate some of us would like you to expound more in detail on your theories. If Bethug is correct and you do not wish to do so openly, then maybe one stored on file and dispatched via PM would satisfy our curiosity. Riding out another Hurricane, got nothing better to do!

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