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Videoslots demanding notarized translation of utility bill

Discussion in 'Casino Complaints - Non-Bonus Issues' started by LinkinFart, Feb 7, 2015.

    Feb 7, 2015
  1. LinkinFart

    LinkinFart Banned User : multi-account fraudster

    Occupation:
    not anymore
    Location:
    Croatia
    One curiosity which will deter me from playing at this place ever again. In order to get your utility bill verified, bill must be in english or player has to provide them with notarized translation of it. Reason being that their Security deparmtent cant see if document is less than 3 months old. On the utility bill I submitted to them it is clearly shown that it is for period '12/2014' and that it should be paid before '15/01/2015'.

    Of course, player cant translate document himself and they refuse to use Google translator, although 7 year old could figure out what only 2 dates shown on document mean.

    Yes of course I am doing that, NOT.

    I was offerd one more option, to send bank statement showing my transactions so they could verify dates on transaction logs. Of course, not sending that one too.
     
  2. Feb 7, 2015
  3. syntynyt

    syntynyt kuollut

    Location:
    ~
    thread's title is null if you can send a bank statement to get verified. why not?
     
    1 person likes this.
  4. Feb 7, 2015
  5. coxwel

    coxwel Senior Member PABnononaccred MM

    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    germany
    Hmm.. I find this quite fair, they do not force you to get sth translated, instead you can send a bank statement. pretty common practise and no big deal. So you wanna get paid?:rolleyes:
     
    3 people like this.
  6. Feb 7, 2015
  7. psychogene

    psychogene Senior Member

    Occupation:
    This and That
    Location:
    Australia
    I usually just send a bank statement instead of utility bill and that is a sufficient replacement when asked by online casinos for utility bill or for most other non casino accounts thats require address ID. Bank statement with your name and address and transactions with Video Slots should be enough verification for that form of ID required. You can blank out all the transactions that aren't Video Slots to protect your privacy and that should be enough.
     
    2 people like this.
  8. Feb 7, 2015
  9. Harry_BKK

    Harry_BKK Senior Member CAG mm1

    Occupation:
    job is OK
    Location:
    Balcony
    Had the same issue. My bills, statements etc. are obviously all in Thai language. Only my broadband bill shows my name in normal characters so i uploaded that one, was declined and asked for a notarized translation.

    Although the house number, unit number and postcode are corresponding to the address i registered at the casino and my passport shows as residence Bangkok they still declined. Same here, they could just use Google translator to have the street name and city translated. But typical English, expect that everybody speaks English and sends in all docs in English :lolup:

    FYI, the same utility bill was accepted at Lucky247, Betsafe and Guts. So some of the casinos go the extra mile while others like Videoslots and Betsson are not and ask for the translation.

    Getting a notarized translation here in Thailand is half a nightmare and takes 2-3 weeks, so i opted not to play at Videoslots & Betsson. I might get it done one day when i am too bored and got plenty of time on hand.
     
  10. Feb 7, 2015
  11. LinkinFart

    LinkinFart Banned User : multi-account fraudster

    Occupation:
    not anymore
    Location:
    Croatia
    Because they want me to send bank statement which shows all the transactions, not just my name and address, so they could verify dates of transactions. If they can accept those dates, they can accept the date on utility bill as well. But they want my transaction logs, which they wont get. I told them I will notify my bank about this request.

    And no, this issue has happened before I even got to the part where I was withdrawing money.

    They never mentioned that, they asked for ALL transactions. Also, I was told on previous attempt, roughly few weeks ago, when I just sent them utility bill I had on file which was older than 3 months that that bill will be verified if I could just send them more recent one. They got exactly the same utility bill which was less than a month old and now they are saying it is unacceptable. I dont need that kind of BS from anyone, particularly not from the business I am about to spend money at. If others can accept bank statements, utility bills that are not translated into English, all they need is the date, my name and address.

    If they think its reasonable to ask people to pay for translation of utility bill and that people will actually do it? Maybe there are suckers that will go through that or people waiting for big withdrawal. Myself, who didnt even ask for withdrawal to go around and indulge their insane request is just beyond any reason.

    Even Betsson didnt asked me this, although I did my verification some time ago, maybe they changed that.

    And whats worse is that support agents were Timo and Tami which are I believe Finnish names, or at least Scandinavian.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2015
  12. Feb 7, 2015
  13. BananaCognac

    BananaCognac Full Member

    Occupation:
    Public servant
    Location:
    Melbourne
    I'm having similar issues at the moment - the online casino for some reason won't accept my latest copy of my mobile phone bill as proof of address. I have used my mobile bill as a form of verification at many online casinos which have been accepted. Has anyone heard of an online casino not accepting a mobile phone bill as a form of verification?

    I don't want to name the casino as I just pm'd the rep and I'm now waiting for a reply.
     
  14. Feb 7, 2015
  15. Tirilej

    Tirilej On a Break

    Occupation:
    Breathing
    Location:
    Sweden
    This is clear to me at least. They have no interest of other transactions.
    Just go and ask them if what they need is the transactions with them, blank out the other, and you are good to go.

    It's easy to always compare what other casinos ask for, but each one have their own rules. If we want to play somewhere we either follow what rules they have or we go somewhere else.

    @ BananaCognac (love the name btw):)
    Many many casinos have that rule. Use another bill instead. It rarily matter what it is for. I usually take a medical bill and have no problem with that.
     
    1 person likes this.
  16. Feb 7, 2015
  17. GrandMaster

    GrandMaster Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Mathematician by day, online gambler by night.
    Location:
    UK
    It is fairly common for mobile phone bills not to be accepted as proof of address.
     
  18. Feb 7, 2015
  19. coxwel

    coxwel Senior Member PABnononaccred MM

    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    germany
    I always use my mobile phone bill as proof of adress. I get this online as pdf, and this was never rejected by any casino at all.

    Also it´s reasonable that not only because casino x accepts your documents, that casino y has do it the same way. Reputable casinos have to do these checks, and they have to follow certain criteria. Sure this pi**es off the player sometimes, but in the end it´s for your own protection if a casino holds a certain level of security.

    Anyway, like already posted, it should be fine to blank out every transaction which has nothing to do with them (videoslots). Why not just send them the required docs instead of complaining, in the end it´s either you do it like they request it or better find another place to play. Sure the request for notarized docs is a bit over the top, but this includes also certain measures. In some countries it is way more easy to get doctored documents than in others. So i understand if a utility bill like from germany, is different than from thailand for example.
    The point is, I understand your frustration, but in the end either you follow their procedures or they will not verify you, no matter how much one is complainig about it.
     
  20. Feb 7, 2015
  21. LinkinFart

    LinkinFart Banned User : multi-account fraudster

    Occupation:
    not anymore
    Location:
    Croatia
    Coxwell you are missing the point, I forgot to mention in OP but mentioned it in my 2nd post, that support said my utility bill will be accepted if I send them same one that is not older than 3 months. This all happened when I made my first deposit and went on to verify my account while playing.
    What is even sicker, I got promised this during telephone conversation with live support which called me EXCLUSIVELY to tell me that if I upload this new document my account will be approved. The call came even though I was checking email during playtime which was more than obvious in my chat with Timo, every conversation was initiated by me very shortly after I received email that my address was not verified. Now that one is not accepted too. Also, they will get bank statement which is also in Croatian and whos to say they wont say they want translated document again.

    Can you tell me why should I even bother with them after I was told one thing that didnt come through and they are asking for something which way out of ordinary. Its not like they have anything exclusive, same slots as anyone with that combination, same tournaments/races, same bonuses, only with a twist. Twist being we take your account security so serious that you have to get notarized translation of your utility bill just to get dates checked.

    Here is a quote from todays conversation which mentions bank statement:
    '09:24 Tami T: The document was rejected by our Security Department, since it was Croatian. Our Security Department could not locate the date of issue.
    09:27 Tami T: This is something our Security Department can not read since the document is in Croatian.
    09:29 Tami T: They can not identify what each date is, since it is not possible for us to understand Croatian.
    09:35 Tami T: Well, you can upload a bank statement also which states the required details. In that case it is much easier to see that the document is under 3 months old, since the transaction on your bank account can't be in the future.
    '


    They cant understand document which shows my name, receivers name, period for which this bill is issued and date by which it has to be paid. Either they are stupid or just effing with me, because dates are as presented in my OP one is '12/2014' which for anyone with half a brain represents period and the other is '15.01.2015' which clearly represents date until I must pay the bill.

    About this utility bill. This is combined Gas, Water, Garbage and Maintenance bill clearly showing amounts and services separately. As per EU advisement and regulation, these services should be billed only by services delivered, meaning you cannot pay for estimated future consumption or get those bills in advance.

    They dont have to know that and I dont have to play at their casino, which I obviously wont and they are already aware of that. As a matter of fact, now I dont want to do that because of the principle.
     
  22. Feb 7, 2015
  23. LinkinFart

    LinkinFart Banned User : multi-account fraudster

    Occupation:
    not anymore
    Location:
    Croatia
    Just to make sure you did notice that this mobile phone bill has nothing to do with my case or videoslots for that matter. BananaCognac "hijacked" this thread.
     
  24. Feb 7, 2015
  25. Tirilej

    Tirilej On a Break

    Occupation:
    Breathing
    Location:
    Sweden
    Ok, so the only thing you wanted with this thread was to tell us how horrible they are who don't accept your documents.
    You didn't want anyone to respond or having their own opinions...because that is how you are sounding now.
    That's ok. You don't have to play there so sorry for responding...and trying to help BananaCognac too.

    Have you even talked to their rep here, Lucas?
     
    2 people like this.
  26. Feb 7, 2015
  27. coxwel

    coxwel Senior Member PABnononaccred MM

    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    germany
    What I´m basically trying to tell you is that it´s only a waste of time to complain and insist on principles, or go into details of your document which you think has to be accepted otherwise they would be stupid?

    To make this easy, they do not and will not accept the document you provided. So either get them another one which suits their demands or just go play somewhere else, if all offer the same to you? Why all this effort if they offer you the same as the casinos you are fine with, like you said?

    I think people here now gave you proper advice and if you have your principles over casino procedures why do you even started this thread? No offense I see that these things can be frustrating and sometimes hard to understand or accept, but no matter what your principles are no casino cares about it. They have their own, and if you accept their t&c´s you should follow them. Otherwise you will always end up in situations like this.
     
    2 people like this.
  28. Feb 7, 2015
  29. Jasminebed

    Jasminebed Closer to 100 than Birth

    Occupation:
    Not in workforce
    Location:
    Ontario
    If the OP has no pending withdrawal, I would just close my account and move on if I was him.

    It is good that he brought this to the attention of CM however so players that might find themselves in a similar position will know.

    Official translation services are NOT cheap. I think is was $75 for my father's death certificate a decade ago.
     
    4 people like this.
  30. Feb 7, 2015
  31. Harry_BKK

    Harry_BKK Senior Member CAG mm1

    Occupation:
    job is OK
    Location:
    Balcony
    Why would that be different? Can you please ellaborate?
     
  32. Feb 7, 2015
  33. coxwel

    coxwel Senior Member PABnononaccred MM

    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    germany
    There are countries where i can get notarized or "real" documents for money due to corruption etc. Not sure about Thailand, but I have relatives in South America, and there i can even get you a real! drivers license with any details on it without even doing any tests, if you pay enough you can get any document. So I would consider for example any german government issued document more solid than f.e. one from mexico.

    It´s only speculation but iam sure that casinos or enterprises doing in fraud and risk management will also tell you that there a certain areas in the world where faked or doctored documents occur more often than in others. In Germany you would go directly to Jail or be persucated by even trying sth like that.
     
    1 person likes this.
  34. Feb 7, 2015
  35. Harry_BKK

    Harry_BKK Senior Member CAG mm1

    Occupation:
    job is OK
    Location:
    Balcony
    Money buys you a lot of things in a lot places. I lived in 7 countries so far in my life, Germany for a total of 17 years (i am German by the way) but Germany was certainly no less corrupt than quite a few other countries around the world - "Kofferwirtschaft, Vitamin B, Vetternwirtschaft" you name it as you like, it exists everywhere.

    Shall i give you some contacts in Germany where you can get passport, driving license etc. for a few thousand $?

    A utility is a utility bill, nothing more, nothing less.... for international casinos accepting players from all over the world to ask documentation in English is plain arrogant and an affront to other nationalities than English speaking ones. Why can Lucky247 read my Thai utility bill or have the two address lines maybe translated? Because they make an effort. Nowadays you can copy pretty much everything into Google translator and get a result, takes only a few seconds.

    That casinos do their due diligence i fully understand....to ask for notarized translations is well over the top.
     
  36. Feb 7, 2015
  37. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    The underlying issue here is that casinos seem to assume that English is some kind of world language that is used in all countries for official documentation. In fact, whilst many players can manage English to a reasonable degree as a second language, their documentation will always come in the official language of their own country. The CASINO should be the ones hiring official translators as a matter of their own security as if they hire the translator, they can be sure they are legit. Letting the player hire their own "official translator" is just asking for trouble as it opens up an exploit for the clever fraudster. Given that in this case security can't even read the DATE, which is already "in English", then security can have no idea that any translation provided by the player is a true one. All they have is a reliance on the official translator being legit, but when they phone to check, they may well not have any other staff other than the translator who speaks English.

    As for Google, it's crap, it would make nonsense out of any utility bill.


    It seems that this case is not JUST about the bill not being in English (because the date certainly is), but that the bill isn't entirely trusted as being authentic, so the official translation is not really about translating "'15/01/2015'" into English, but is to get an official translated and NOTARISED version of the bill.

    Given that this is all down to international KYC laws, we SHOULD be seeing a unified approach across the whole industry.

    This whole documentation thing is getting ridiculous, and in the end the industry will end up losing perfectly good players because of it.

    Maybe it's time to take a step back and redesign the KYC process from scratch, taking into account the latest technology, such as the approach used by the US regulated state casinos for determining with pretty good accuracy where a player actually is when logged in. The more accurately this can be determined, the less reliance there is on documentation provided by the player to show their address. This technology should also make multi accounting and "gnoming" much easier to spot.

    It seems that players are having these troubles partly because the casinos are doing KYC "on the cheap". This is a case in point, the KYC team at the casino does not have access to translation services, yet it works in an international marketplace.
     
    6 people like this.
  38. Feb 7, 2015
  39. Harry_BKK

    Harry_BKK Senior Member CAG mm1

    Occupation:
    job is OK
    Location:
    Balcony
    Well said :thumbsup:

    Also if you use Neteller, Skrill or Ecopayz for deposits your address has already been verified by those e-wallets. I remember when i registered with 32RED 3 years ago and asked what documents they need for verification i was told that none needed since I deposited with Neteller and Skrill. Only when i moved to a new country and changed my address they asked for proof.

    As for my issue: The house number, apartment number and postcode are exactly as on the address i registered with the casino, my passport has Bangkok as residence. So the only thing which needed to be checked&confirmed on the utility bill is the street name, which obviously is in Thai. Those two words can easily be translated online as my address is a well known street in Bangkok, so automatic online translators get it right...tried it myself, wasn't a problem.
     

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