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Verification documents

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by davos11, Jun 5, 2014.

    Jun 5, 2014
  1. davos11

    davos11 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    self employed
    Location:
    uk
    Before i go off on my rant i just wanted to make it clear that this obviously doesn't stand for all casinos but rather the vast majority i have come across :) ,

    It seems recently that for me personally the fun has been stripped from gambling , It seems like an uphill battle not to be manipulated or mislead by casinos , Either with purposefully confusing terms and conditions , Really slow payouts including the " sitting in the pending ( available for reversal section for 48 hours ) before even being looked at by any accounting department , Verification docs that have been accepted before being rejected after waiting near 2 days for a reply only to have the new ones rejected again ...... The list goes on .

    I know you guys will simply say , stick to the approved list , which i do alot of the time , but i do get bored or have a losing streak and would like to try a few new places and take up there offers

    I played at a site which i wont name yesterday and i had problems with a bonus which lead to a 30 min discussion on chat , I decided not to waste any more time and asked them to close my account , It then took another 45 minutes ,Including being put through to the manager and being offered all sorts of offers not to close the account , And after the 17th ( i shit you not ) time of asking , they closed my account , I check my emails the next day only to see a message from them saying they have credited my account with a bonus ( i was supposed to be taken off the mailing list ) .

    So i guess my question is do you guys now think that the industry or a very large portion of it is set up this way ,The odds are stacked against us anyway and over a life time we are all losers , Are there business meetings about how to improve customer satisfaction or improve games etc .. Or is it to make life harder for anyone who does get lucky and win , The reversal function set up to test the nerves of anyone who did have the luck and was responsible enough to make a withdrawal .

    Is documentation really needed ? If i go into a betting shop or a casino / arcade i don't need any of this , And casinos will happily take all your money without needing your passport , card or utility bill , It's only when it comes to them paying you that it is so vital ,Is it due to an international law ?
    Perhaps it is needed but in my eyes its now used as a delaying tactic ,It could be checked and verified in 10 minutes by any live help agent .

    Sorry for the rant it just seems like i'm spending more time on live help then enjoying games and when i do get to play the games its like walking through a snake pit having to make sure you only play certain games, not have your stake to high ,making sure your not playing somewhere were that i.p has been used before ( which sucks if you travel alot like i do )

    I'm a lowroller and bonuses are great so i always look for one to boost my bankroll and that's why i don't play accredited as much as i should but after these past few weeks that will be changing and i hope my experiences will change due to that

    Can any of you guys reccomend a few sites of the accredited list for Microgaming or Netent that gives decent membership bonuses ? , like your monthly match bonus etc ..?

    thanks
     
    2 people like this.
  2. Jun 5, 2014
  3. rockycatt

    rockycatt meistercatt CAG MM

    Occupation:
    carpenter
    Location:
    Boston
  4. Jun 5, 2014
  5. Freeman

    Freeman Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    .
    Location:
    Sweden
    You need to chill buddy, casinos are in the business to make money. Read that line again and realise there's no conspiracy against you. No one is altering the games, no one is monitoring your playtime and no one want you no harm. The gambling idustry is far more regulated then one would think, in fact most of them are tighter than your local bank. Just take a deep breath, do your lesson, and go back a better gambler. No need to feel bad like you do at this point and stop expecting casinos to compensate your losses. Imagine you were a big, sexy casino manager, would you give out free money to the extend loosing your business? Don't think so my friend <3
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2014
  6. Jun 5, 2014
  7. weesie

    weesie Ueber Meister

    Occupation:
    retired
    Location:
    Old bag lady with a laptop
    I have always had to show my ID when entering the riverboat here.
     
  8. Jun 5, 2014
  9. Nate

    Nate Ueber Meister CAG webmeister

    Occupation:
    Monster
    Location:
    Cyberspace
    If you do not have an account at these casinos already, its time to get 1.

    1. Guts
    2. Redbet
    3. 32Red
    4. Mr. Green

    For Microgaming, 32Red is the best with regular bonuses. NetEnt Casinos are usually a bit tight on bonuses in general, however, Redbet and Guts have regular Free Spin promos and sometimes daily offers.

    There are other great outfits out there, but Loyalty seems to be an issue with most of them to be honest. The Casino i mentioned probably will give you the best player experience and the most bang for your buck. If you feel that you are not treated well - A friendly rep is just a PM away.

    Good Luck!

    Nate
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. Jun 5, 2014
  11. davos11

    davos11 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    self employed
    Location:
    uk
    "You need to chill buddy, casinos are in the business to make money. Read that line again and realise there's no conspiracy against you. No one is altering the games, no one is monitoring your playtime and no one want you no harm."

    You have not addressed any of my issues and instead made some new ones up that i guess i'm supposed to have said at some point like "Altering games" and "monitoring playtime" . And then going onto say i'm angry due to losing ...... , I have actually won and i'm struggling to receive my winnings due to my verification docs being turned down 4 times in a row even though they have been accepted elsewhere

    Dude you have just fabricated a whole conversation .....

    And also i do not think there is a personal conspiracy against me , I mean come on ..... , My point as always is about morals , Business or not , I'm a business owner myself and i wouldn't treat my customers badly just to pocket a few extra bucks ,That in my eyes is just bad business

    My point is being a long time gamer ,I have noticed the industry change alot , Verification docs , Reversal periods , Casino bonuses and free spins , They are all in the guise of great features for players all dressed up in glitter and bows but the reality of it is all these features are made to delay withdrawals or cancel winnings all together for the smallest infringement

    Sure stick to the accredited and you cant go far wrong ,100% , but that accredited list probably makes up for less than 0.1% of all gaming sites online and that's why i say the industry is set up like this .
     
    3 people like this.
  12. Jun 5, 2014
  13. davos11

    davos11 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    self employed
    Location:
    uk
    Nate ,

    thanks a bunch for the recommendations , I'm a member of all of them already and 3 of them are my regulars and yeah i know what you mean about bonuses , I like to get a bit of bang for my buck and get a least a little while playing with my small deposit but i guess i have 2 options , No promos but fair and honest treatment and a good quick service or a bonus and alot of stress

    Maybe i should roll all my session into one at the weekend so i'm playing with more than usuall instead of the bonus , hopefully get some more playtime out of it and if i win then there wont be any problems ,

    tx
     
    1 person likes this.
  14. Jun 5, 2014
  15. Freeman

    Freeman Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    .
    Location:
    Sweden
    Obviously if I misunderstood, I take it all back and apologise. It's just that your rant had a bad taste of a loosing streak and a youngster, we get those a lot. If you read you'r post again from my point of view you'l find my respond wasn't so retarded after all and if you feel violated... sorry :thumbsup:
    Edit: You'r reply to me was far much more informative than the original, no wonder it went wrong. I cant read your mind you know...
     
  16. Jun 5, 2014
  17. dunover

    dunover Unofficial T&C's Editor CAG PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABinit mm3 webmeister

    Occupation:
    International Money Launderer
    Location:
    the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
    Aside from the KYC issue, your issues all seem to stem from, and relate to, not reading the T&C's thoroughly.
    When you take freepsins/bonuses/NDB's etc. this is a must. They aren't there to 'trap' you but have specific anti-AP conditions usually. As for the 48-hour reversal period this would be in those terms. Nate gave you 4 good sites, I would add Bet-at and CasinoLuck and Videoslots which are all as quick, if not quicker for cashouts. Vera John too.
     
    1 person likes this.
  18. Jun 5, 2014
  19. Freeman

    Freeman Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    .
    Location:
    Sweden
    Just read your post again, I'm just that kind of guy, and still see no wrong in my reply. In fact you should take the cooling down remark very seriously, cus I can tell by your attitude you'r heading into trouble. Please understand I have other things to do, and it's in no way personal.
     
  20. Jun 5, 2014
  21. davos11

    davos11 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    self employed
    Location:
    uk
    Freeman dude , Seriously , I'm open to both suggestion and criticism but all of your points made in your reply had no correlation with what i said i'm my original post
    "No one is altering the games, no one is monitoring your playtime and no one want you no harm."

    At any point did i mention anything about casinos monitoring my game play ,or altering games or even wanting to do me harm

    You know nothing or me personally ,my age , experience , how much i spend and even if i am winning or losing yet you made the assumption i was the negative in all of these , What does that say about you ?

    You can tell by my attitude that i am heading into trouble ??..... Based on your previous track record of guessing all of the above points completely wrong it shouldn't surprise you that you have got this wrong to ......

    And the fact is we know the vast majority of casinos are "out to get us" , If you think otherwise then i'm afraid its you who may be lacking in experience , That is the whole reason for this site , Its why there is a rogue casino list . The fact the there is only 100 odd accredited casinos out of the thousands and thousands out there says it all .....



    Dunover , Thanks for the input , I do read the terms and i don't actually have any issues that are affecting me , I just think there highly convoluted ,

    For instance there was a new multi platform casino just opened up , It had different wagering requirements for every single slot ,No joke , Every single slot had a different percentage , It was a 30x B+D but then you had to take into account the game wagers , Near all netent games where 40% contribution which if only playing them would make it a 100XB+D , And these terms were practically hidden , Due to having some experience and patience i managed to find it before depositing but any new guys would not ..... And this is my whole point .

    I mean some of you guys are practically lawyers you know everything about this stuff but you are the vast minority , The vast vast minority .

    Alot of the time when i'm complaining its not due to me being at a personal loss its because i see something wrong happening and think it should not be , Generally if you have found your way to this site then you can hold your own a bit at least but who's sticking up for the little guys ?

    I WILL be taking your guys advice on board and i will only play accredited from now on as its safer and there for more enjoyable it just peeves me that nobody seems to be policing these casinos , They are practically untouchable and its just hard to swallow such an injustice sometimes



    As per my original message i sent another message complaining ( my 4th message ) in response to my 2nd lot of docs being rejected , I told it was the best i could do with this camera and unless i bought a new one i was stuck ,And that these docs had been fine for all other casinos ..., I got a message back saying that they had been accepted and i should expect my payment soon , I'm obviously pleased but to me they were either fine to start off with or they're still not good enough as they were obviously rejected twice , I just don't get it .
     
  22. Jun 5, 2014
  23. airwave

    airwave Dormant account webby

    Occupation:
    I complain a lot
    Location:
    Undisclosed
    I don't like seeing this at all. This type of marketing opens the door for a casino to prey on those who have a true addiction. Once you have asked to be excluded from the property, you should be excluded, no questions asked, and you definitely shouldn't be enticed to come back with further bonus offers. This is shady.

    As for your question about verification documents, please keep in mind that casinos really do encounter credit card fraud, with people using stolen card numbers, or where people will cash out winnings and then dispute the charge, or dispute after losing. It just makes good business sense for them to get documentation to protect themselves. I believe you said something about documents that were previously accepted now being considered insufficient. That would raise a huge red flag to me that they are probably just stalling you. Has the situation changed since your initial post?
     
    1 person likes this.
  24. Jun 5, 2014
  25. davos11

    davos11 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    self employed
    Location:
    uk
    Hi Airwave ,

    Thanks for the input and info ,

    Yes they have now accepted my docs although i wont be to excited until the funds are in my bank , I just told them they were the best i could do with the camera i had as i had took plenty and picked out the best , This was after they rejected my first lot which i have been using all of this year ,

    For some reason what they rejected they have now said are fine which i find odd but still hopefully that's that now , I don't think casinos like this are rogue i just think alot of them are morally wrong and a bit manipulative ,either through delaying tactics or not allowing someone to close there account or continuing to send promos to a closed account to temp them back in .

    My problem with providing documentation is simply that they would happily take £1000s off you in losses but if you withdraw even £50 then you need to prove who you are , So it doesn't matter who you are or if your a fraudster if your losing but another story if your winning ,Would it not be in the interest of both parties to provide docs before depositing is allowed , Surely that way it would cut out all fraud attempts ? you can have someones card or stolen information but unless you have there passport you cant deposit so this blows all fraud out the window for everyone ,There would be no motivation for fraudsters to steal accounts for the use of gambling .

    This is why i ask the question ,As they could make it safe for everyone ,player and casino but choose to only look after themselves at the cost of the player
    If your sending proof of i.d / credit etc why not do it at the start ?
     
  26. Jun 5, 2014
  27. Freeman

    Freeman Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    .
    Location:
    Sweden
    Dude, seriously chill. Don't get why you work yourself up to that level. I answared in a polite way, helping you the best I could given the info, and you bash me? In the future, make a note you'l take only the advices that suites you at that particilar time and state of mind. Ok:)
     
  28. Jun 5, 2014
  29. spintee

    spintee Meister Member webby mm2

    Occupation:
    gambler :)
    Location:
    Northants
    The only person who seems to be getting worked up is you, I totally agree with the 1st post, I myself today had to get onto a casinos case today after I withdraw Sunday and still reversible, After the live chat they said they do not no why its took this long and they have now processed it? They was wishing for me to reverse as I had done on the Friday and Saturday,
    Back to the original post you seem to replied with a load of nonsense that had nothing to do with it, Than you went on to guess he was on a losing streak & a young kid, Even if this was the case than surely you should have more respect than that, Than again was rude and said you had other things to do but yet come back to post,

    You did this yestoday also, People come on here for a friendly chat and help, Not to be looked down on and bullied,

    Please no one take this personaly
     
    3 people like this.
  30. Jun 5, 2014
  31. dunover

    dunover Unofficial T&C's Editor CAG PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABinit mm3 webmeister

    Occupation:
    International Money Launderer
    Location:
    the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
    Again, the TERMS AND CONDITIONS! That's one of the first, if not THE first thing I establish when opening any casino account. I know how bad it feels having a good win then getting peed about when it comes to reversal periods and sharking incentives to reverse. Valid moan, but check terms and/or with CS BEFORE playing.
     
    1 person likes this.
  32. Jun 5, 2014
  33. spintee

    spintee Meister Member webby mm2

    Occupation:
    gambler :)
    Location:
    Northants
    Its another ips aldernay site, you no the slot boss / castle jp ect, I knew it was not going to be an over night thing but surley 4 days and than have to go to help than said they do not no reason but they cash it out now?

    My feeling is that they was hoping that a reversal was in order, as I already done a few and lost a few 100 why doing it
     
    2 people like this.
  34. Jun 5, 2014
  35. Freeman

    Freeman Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    .
    Location:
    Sweden
    R u serious? Still sour about the registry thingy? You know I'm right, grow up for God's sake, or do you want us both to be banned? Enough with the BS kids, ok ;)
     
  36. Jun 5, 2014
  37. dunover

    dunover Unofficial T&C's Editor CAG PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABinit mm3 webmeister

    Occupation:
    International Money Launderer
    Location:
    the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
    Freeman, he never said all that! He was simply having a bitch-and-moan about the hassles you get overall. I don't think he asked for 'compensation' either! The things he mentioned indeed do happen quite often, and if he travels and plays from different IP's he will likely get more issues than us. I can only pick him up on one point which is quite obvious - the KYC not being applied in land bookmakers. If a guy with grey hair and a walking stick comes in what 'proof' do you need? Online, you simply don't know who's on the other end, hence the vigorous checks.
     
    3 people like this.
  38. Jun 5, 2014
  39. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    This is the messing around that has lead many to believe this whole KYC thing is just a delaying tactic. It actually stems from an international agreement designed to prevent criminals from moving their money around and laundering it in the process. Many casinos look rather amateurish when it comes to dealing with KYC. They often have you email the documents to CS (a big NO! in terms of security, emails are unencrypted, insecure, and can be intercepted. In addition, front line CS should not have access to such sensitive information, but they do because the emails they are forwarding to security are not encrypted). Once emailed, players are sometimes told the documents never arrived there, but the email didn't get bounced, so no one knows where they ended up, therefore this is also insecure because they may then fall into the wrong hands.
    Acceptance or rejection seems to have a random element. A specific document is either good or it isn't, it should not vary from day to day at the same casino.

    The 48 hour pending is not necessary, it's a tactic designed to make the casino more money. Same day payments have been forced on the banks after they dragged their feet over the archaic clearing practices that stemmed from the days when banking between branches and banks was done via the post. With electronic transfers, there is no need for the 3 day clearing cycle, but the banks kept it because for three days they could make money from whatever funds were sitting in this limbo because they COULD transfer it instantly onto the overnight money markets. The same goes for casinos, a withdrawal, once the player has had their documents verified, should go straight onto the current processing queue, and should be processed in the very next batch, which in most cases would mean same day payment, or at worst the following morning.

    A different WR for every single slot is them having a laugh. You would need a degree in maths to stick to those rules, yet you are supposed to be having fun. It should be all slots at the default of 100% of the stated WR, with the less profitable games weighted by category, such as a weight for all Blackjack, another for all Table Pokers, and another for all Video poker machines, etc for all the categories on offer.

    It looks like they don't want to give out these bonuses, but can't say so for fear of losing customers to those that do. Land casinos did not give out bonuses, they gave out things like free drinks, free meals, and even free rooms for their most profitable players. Online casinos offered bonuses instead, and this early business strategy has gone bad, but they are addicted and can't give it up. Players have also become addicted to evaluating competing online casinos on their bonus offerings, so casinos find it doubly hard to give up using them.

    There has to come a point where a major change in direction is needed because ever tightening KYC and ever more convoluted and obscure bonus rules will start to put players off, and push them back to what they did before the internet, which might be visiting Blackpool and gambling on the Golden mile, or visiting the nearest land casino.

    I used to travel the country playing the fruit machines until 2004, which is when I began the shift away from this and towards playing online. KYC wasn't a big problem, bonus terms were straight forward, and the standard for withdrawals was 24 hours pending with instant flushing on request so that payment was with the next batch, which meant later in the afternoon or the morning of the following day.

    One group went one better, after withdrawing from the casino, players could then log on to a bespoke banking page where they could process their own withdrawal to the eWallet Neteller. This was a pending time dependent on how fast I could type, followed by instant processing.

    Maybe the new UK regime next year will shake things up a little, though it may also mean that some casinos will close their doors to UK players rather than get the UK license or risk the wrath of our taxman by operating illegally as far as the UK is concerned.
     
    2 people like this.

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