Vegas VIP Online

dominique

Dormant account
Joined
Jul 5, 2003
Location
The Boonies
Has anyone heard of this one?

Vegasviponline.com, open to US. Unusual setup, familiair slot game names but the images are different.
 

bb28

Dormant Account
Joined
Nov 18, 2006
Location
US
Never heard of it, but check out this page. Link Removed ( Old/Invalid)

They claim to be selling ad space with the casino chips you buy. :D It also mentions something about sweepstakes.

Sounds pretty dodgy don't you think?
 

jetset

RIP Brian
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
Not enough upfront info for me to feel comfortable.

I wonder whether they're associated with CasinoVal - they have the same games from Amusi Gaming.
 

takethemoney

Banned User - Chargebacks at Slotastic
Joined
Apr 14, 2004
Location
Washington
Not enough upfront info for me to feel comfortable.

I wonder whether they're associated with CasinoVal - they have the same games from Amusi Gaming.

I feel the same way. I would love, however, to see some of my familiar games become available to me in the USA. I'd love to be able to play Cleopatra II, as an example. I have kicked ass on this game in land casinos, several times winning a couple grand on an 80c bet. I generally love games that increase the multiplier with retriggers.
 

dominique

Dormant account
Joined
Jul 5, 2003
Location
The Boonies
I have been expecting casinos to appear serving the US that use a way to circumvent being legally classified as a gambling place.

If you buy classified ads instead of depositing to play, you are not gambling but purchasing something. Lots of other types of companies offer games on their sites where you can win something. So they based a casino on that concept...

Not sure what withdrawal methods are, but affiliates can get paid by paypal.

I have no idea if this place is any good, I'll be looking into it.

I think this may be a forerunner of a wave of new casinos serving the US.

I think each will have to be evaluated on it's own merits, the operators will be quite diverse in this genre also. We may even find that they are operated by entities we already know... the US is wide open now and the law is more ambiguous than ever. Some operators are bound to try to jump in.

This appears to be a safer way for them to do so... and avoid falling under UIGEA.


PS. I found them because they are advertising on facebook...
 

bb28

Dormant Account
Joined
Nov 18, 2006
Location
US
I suspect they are targeting a loophole in the law that allowed many states to have sweepstakes cafes, (which most have been closed down now.) These places allowed customers to buy credits via a phone card or purchasing internet time and then spend them in "slot machines" or "video poker machines". One of many issues is that these machines did not have a random number generator, hence the sweepstakes effect. I live in NC and saw a surge of them pop up a year or so ago but now they have been closed down.

It has been said they were targeting the people who could least afford to play and those who set up the businesses were exploiting people and loopholes in the law.

I also have to wonder about a place that sells ad space and calls it gambling. :confused:
 

bb28

Dormant Account
Joined
Nov 18, 2006
Location
US
Unrelated, but I'm against the surge of gambling games that are popping up on facebook in preparation for if and when laws are passed. Facebook is full of underage users.
 

dominique

Dormant account
Joined
Jul 5, 2003
Location
The Boonies
Well, I have been playing in free mode and so far it looks to be random to me.

If there are going to be any places online in the US at this time that are not affected by UIGEA and can use US banks in a normal way to accept deposits and make payouts, they will have to add some sort of non gambling item to sell.

They have to be able to say: "We are in the business of selling XYZ. In order to get customers to spend time on our site and buy lots of XYZ we provide some amusements and ways to win some money."

They did advertise on Facebook - as they are not a "real" gambling outfit. Actual gambling is disallowed on FB, although FB has expressed that they will offer gambling eventually. The casino games available there now do not offer any "winnings" at all. You get free time to play them, and you can buy additional time. But at no time will you win anything.

So far I found that the affiliate program is owned by Kingsbury Services Ltd. The casino may or may not be owned by the same. The contract is subject to the laws of Gibraltar, and any action must be brought in Cyprus.

Still digging.

In Poker you have ClubWPT that has been facing the US for some time now. It doesn't operate as a merchant (selling someting) but as a club (membership fees). It seems to be doing allright.

My bet is that we will see a lot more places like this. We just need to do due diligence....
 

Simmo!

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
England
I've seen these games somewhere before. It isn't IGT/Wagerworks but they have ripped ideas from them and Aristocrat...."Runnin' Wild" is Wolf Run, "101 Lions" might be of interest to Aristocrat...LOL. Domain is owned by "Kingsbury Services" whoever they are.
 

bb28

Dormant Account
Joined
Nov 18, 2006
Location
US
Well, I have been playing in free mode and so far it looks to be random to me.

How can you tell if something "looks random"?

If there are going to be any places online in the US at this time that are not affected by UIGEA and can use US banks in a normal way to accept deposits and make payouts, they will have to add some sort of non gambling item to sell.

They have to be able to say: "We are in the business of selling XYZ. In order to get customers to spend time on our site and buy lots of XYZ we provide some amusements and ways to win some money."

They did advertise on Facebook - as they are not a "real" gambling outfit. Actual gambling is disallowed on FB, although FB has expressed that they will offer gambling eventually. The casino games available there now do not offer any "winnings" at all. You get free time to play them, and you can buy additional time. But at no time will you win anything.

I realize that FB can't offer real gambling now, but they are setting the stage and personally I don't think it's a good thing. Why......because I would expect at least 25% of the demographic is under-aged. That is a whole lot of kids that will be exposed to adult vices. FB isn't allowed to advertise cigs or alcohol right? Why, because those are adult vices.

So far I found that the affiliate program is owned by Kingsbury Services Ltd. The casino may or may not be owned by the same. The contract is subject to the laws of Gibraltar, and any action must be brought in Cyprus.

Still digging.

In Poker you have ClubWPT that has been facing the US for some time now. It doesn't operate as a merchant (selling someting) but as a club (membership fees). It seems to be doing allright.

ClubWPT is a different animal, as they aren't selling adspace so you can gamble and they aren't calling it sweepstakes either. It's a club that has prizes, which in my view is a whole lot of different.

My bet is that we will see a lot more places like this. We just need to do due diligence....

Due diligence, absolutely. To me the information is vague and suspicious and it looks like a ploy that could be used to take advantage. At least when we in the US sign up with an RTG, we pretty much know what we are getting into. We are clear we are GAMBLING.
 

bb28

Dormant Account
Joined
Nov 18, 2006
Location
US
The casino is running on the software made by Amuzi gaming . Casinoval is also running on the same software.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.


,Coenie

Your link to the software is the least amount of information I think I've ever read on any site.

The info given is next to nothing.
 

jetset

RIP Brian
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
300 Shields looks like a NextGen rip-off, too.

This lack of disclosure and suspiciously tenuous business model does not look promising to me.
 

maxd

PAB (Complaints) Manager
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Location
Saltirelandia
The contract is subject to the laws of Gibraltar, and any action must be brought in Cyprus.

That's an alarm bell right there, IMO. Gibraltar licensing is basically "off hook" at the moment and Cyprus is a big, black hole as far as gaming (and the law) is concerned. Some of the worst shops in the business are running out of Cyprus these days and the Cyprus licensing connections snake off into some very dark places. Seeing "Cyprus" on any casino-related operation is a big red flag AFAIC.

A while back I was sniffing down the trail of some Cyprus outfits I suspected of being bent and one of the things I did was try to verify their business addresses. Google Maps showed the addresses to be out in the middle of nowhere. When I confronted them with this they said "Oh, no problem, just an old Google satellite image". Fair enough I guessed, could be true.

As it happened I knew a guy from Cyprus in my previous work life so I got in touch with him, asked him to toodle on out to said address next time he was home and take some snaps for me. About 9 months later he sent me some fresh shots of the place: nothing but a dirt road and rocks as far as the eye could see. He said there were lots of lizards the day he was there, not much else. Guess that Google image wasn't so "out of date" after all. :rolleyes:

My guy also mentioned that shell addresses like this are pretty par for the course in Cyprus. Apparently for $20 (or whatever) you can set up a redirect at the local post office for whatever address you want -- real or otherwise -- to be dumped into your rented letterbox there at the post office. The end result being that there are a lot more businesses listed as having offices in Cyprus than actual real estate exists, something like 3-or-4:1 according to some reports.

Further to this I've heard about lawyers who work out of Cyprus carrying around big briefcases full of Cyprus business portfolios: the only thing real about those businesses is the papers in the briefcase, everything else is smoke and mirrors. They'll even offer to sell you a pre-packaged "businesses" if that's what you're looking for, you pay your money and shazam! you're located in Cyprus (in lawyer man's briefcase that is). "KYC" can also mean "Know Your Casino".
 
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maxd

PAB (Complaints) Manager
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Location
Saltirelandia
... Gibraltar licensing is basically "off hook" at the moment ....

Apparently no longer true. See Link Outdated / Removed.

And FWIW I don't see Vegas VIP Online listed anywhere there (yes, I looked at each of the license holders "brand" lists).

I see that Vegas VIP Online is somehow closely tied to Vegas VIP Sweepstakes which came up on the PAB radar recently. So far they have not responded to the PAB.
 
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cvbeck

Newbie member
Joined
Jul 18, 2011
Location
dallas
A little depth on the matter

First of all, Vegas VIP Online and Vegas VIP Sweepstakes are the same organization (evidenced by the same support number and same copy write).
I've actually played quite a bit here and done ok - never withdrawn (I'm a problem gambler), but i have won some of their sweepstakes.

They even have ways to win real money with mini-tournament like challenges (first 10 people who get 50 free spins on a free play slot and take a picture win $50). Pretty clever actually.

I had a long chat with a CSR (my emails went unanswered). I meant to start a thread on this awhile back, but never did.
I approached it from a "what would CM want to know" perspective.

Like I said, its a little long, but fairly thorough (they badly need a lawyer and a grammar checker for their site and T&Cs)


A: Is the welcome bonus a ‘sticky’ bonus or a cashable one? Are all bonuses cashable?
Here: (link) it says, “6. If the player wants to cash in the bonus amounts credited to their Bonus Account, the player must wager 25 times before this is possible.” and 7. “When the player completes the play-through requirements, the funds are automatically transferred from the player's Bonus Account to the Real Money Account.:”
- I read this as it is a cashable bonus, meaning when I meet playthrough, the entire bonus becomes cash and is fully withdrawable. Is that correct?

when you deposit, you get the bonus, the bonus might be cashable after playing it 25 times

This one is pretty meaningful B: When can I cash out? This is a little tricky you say “5. Players can cash in money from their Real Money Balance at any time, but the Bonus Balance will be reset to zero automatically; and 10. The player will lose the money in the Bonus Account (it will be reset to zero) if a withdrawal is made and the Bonus Account still has a balance” So if I deposit $50 and get a $50 bonus and on my first spin I win $1000 I can immediately stop and cash out; I’ll only lose the $50 bonus, correct?
The Terms go on to say though, “13. If you withdraw before having reached the minimum wagering requirements, your bonus and winning will be void.” I understand that you’ll lose the bonus, as clarified in 5 and 10, but I think that losing the winnings is contradiction to number 5 since it states you can cash in at any time. Can you shed some light on the intent here?

you if you dont meet the requiremets on playing the bonus 25 when you already deposited,. your bonus will reset 0
you could take it all except for the bonus

We ran through a few scenarios regarding item 13. "If you withdraw before having reached the minimum wagering requirements, your bonus and winning will be void.”

David
it's correct
if you dont wannna lose the bonu when you want tyo withdraw, you have to wager it 25 times


So I asked him again (since I've never seen a policy as generous as this), "I mean I deposit $50 and get a $50 bonus and on my first spin I win $1000 I can immediately stop and cash out; I’ll only lose the $50 bonus, correct?"

David
you can take $1000 and lose the bonus after requesting the withdrawal some clients dont care about losing the bonus,m other yes


This one surprised me, as I assumed the contrary
C: Lotteries: i won one of the lotteries. I played it and lost, but could i have just withdrawn it without playing?

David
if your ticket won, you can withdraw it, no problem, or you can play it. There are no restrictions when you won the lucky draws


Now for the obvious but sad part

D: and finally(!): I don’t see anything regarding Fair Gaming, Random Number Generator Verification, eCogra certification, etc. Is this in process? Has the software been certified by a group like TST? Where are you licensed out of?

David
no, just our terms and conditions that you see on our site


For the TL;DR crowd: Bonuses are generous and cashable :lolup:; you don't have to meet playthrough to withdrawal :lolup:; they aren't certified for crap :eek2:.

Hope this is helpful.
 

butterflyboogie

Senior Member
MM
Joined
Jun 4, 2008
Location
Casino Oblivion
Facebook

I was reading in earlier posts here that FB doesn't allow casino's to advertise...then now does Inetbet do it? I "liked" them and their posts come on my wall every week.
 

KasinoKing

WebMeister & Slotaholic..
webmeister
PABnonaccred
CAG
MM
Joined
Aug 25, 2004
Location
Bexhill on sea, England
I was reading in earlier posts here that FB doesn't allow casino's to advertise...then now does Inetbet do it? I "liked" them and their posts come on my wall every week.
I don't use FB much - but do you mean messages on your wall, or adverts down the right-hand side?
Casinos most definitely CAN advertise on there - but it costs a small fortune.
Being in the UK, I always have loads of casino ads down the right of my FB page - but I would assume you don't get those in the USA?

KK
 

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