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Use of bots

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by SteveCut, Oct 28, 2008.

    Oct 28, 2008
  1. SteveCut

    SteveCut Senior Member

    Occupation:
    None
    Location:
    EU
    I was just browsing the PAB results and noticed that a number of casinos had refused payouts due to alleged use of bots. I also noticed that casinomeister seems to accept this action. What I don't understand is what is the casinos' objection to bot play? As all the games are rigged in the casinos' favour I'd have thought the use of bots would just increase their earnings. Or am I missing something? Or am I missing something that would be better left unanswered :)
    Steve
     
  2. Oct 28, 2008
  3. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    Hi Steve - welcome to the forum! :thumbsup:

    You are 'missing' a few things there:-
    1. The house edge of the game is just that - the games are not 'rigged'. (Improper use of that word)
    2. No doubt all the PAB's you are talking about refer to playing with a bonus.
    3. There are certain bonus strategies which involve one big bet at the start, and then 'grinding out' 100's of hands at minimum stakes. This is incredibly boring & time consuming, so some players use these bots to play for them. This strategy makes many bonuses +EV for the player, and is certainly not playing in the 'spirit of the bonus' and is therefore deemed by most casinos as 'bonus abuse'.
    Basically I do agree with the casinos, but I just wish they would use their T&C's and the software at their disposal to make any 'abuse' they don't like impossible, and put an end to 80% of player complaints.

    I hope that helps!

    KK
     
    1 person likes this.
  4. Oct 28, 2008
  5. SteveCut

    SteveCut Senior Member

    Occupation:
    None
    Location:
    EU
    Thanks KK. BTW I realise they're not "rigged". Lazy writing on my part.
     
  6. Oct 29, 2008
  7. SierraDawn

    SierraDawn Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Retired.. Just housewifey now :)
    Location:
    Colorado
    Bots??
    Guess, I am more out of the loop here on gambling than I thought :eek:
     
  8. Oct 29, 2008
  9. jetset

    jetset Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Senior Partner, InfoPowa News Service
    Location:
    Earth
    I don't think you can draw an inference from a specific PAB decision when it comes to the Casinomeister's policy on bots.

    Individual findings often turn on whether the player has complied with the T&Cs on the gambling site for which he or she has signed up, although operators trying to push ridiculously unfair clauses such as the FU or the 'bonus abuser' abominations will often find themselves under pressure and have been known to relent.
     
  10. Oct 29, 2008
  11. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    I've argued the fact that all bots can do is make you lose you money faster. People who fall for purchasing "bots" are suckers - and one thing that most bot sellers won't tell you is that when casinos detect bot play (which they will) they will confiscate your winnings and kick you to the curb.

    But losing your money faster is not what casinos are concerned about - it's something entirely different - the bottom line is that they want real people interacting with their casino - not a bunch of bots.

    Imagine opening your own casino, you're waiting for players to arrive, and in swarm an army of Vortrans bellying up to the Black jack tables and playing at warp-speed. You'd probably say "get the f*** outta here!! Give me some real customers!"

    Same thing goes with online casinos - they don't want people using software to play the games.

    The bottom line for me is - if the casino specifically states in their terms and conditions that bot play is forbidden, then players should not use bots. There have been a couple of casinos that have been targeted by bot players, and this is probably what you are referring to in the PAB section

    Don't use bots - they won't do you any good. They are easy to detect, and it's a sucker item like touted roulette systems. Stupid crap to throw your money at.
     
    4 people like this.
  12. Oct 29, 2008
  13. lots0

    lots0 Banned User - troll posts - flaming

    Occupation:
    I do nothing productive
    Location:
    Hell on Earth
    You have to remember that the "bot" is only as smart as the person programming it... And most of these guys programming casino gambling Bots aren't that smart.

    I look at the people selling casino gambling bots the same way I look at the people that will tell you how to make a Million dollars for twenty bucks...

    If their Bots really worked and made money... Why in the hell would they sell it? It would be like selling the goose that lays golden eggs for twenty bucks...
     
    1 person likes this.
  14. Oct 29, 2008
  15. spearmaster

    spearmaster RIP Ted

    Occupation:
    Devil's Advocate
    Location:
    Heaven
    Bots have an advantage in that they do not make mistakes (assuming they've been properly programmed with the correct strategy from the start). Thus, casinos will make less money when a bot is in play.

    Bots cannot, however, defeat the house edge of casino games - thus in the long run they are a losing proposition - EXCEPT when a bonus is given for play, whether this be a deposit bonus or comps (which usually don't reverse a house edge but they certainly make the house edge even less).

    Bots can remove the tedious aspect of playing any game - especially slots, where I personally am too lazy to press the button continuously until I hit a feature round.

    Bots do NOT make you money. They simply automate the process of winning (or more likely, losing) money. So there is no basis for someone promoting a bot which makes you money.

    You DO have a better chance of getting ahead with a bot, because it doesn't make strategy mistakes - of course this only applies in games where the player has some control over what to do. Bots simply ensure that the casino has the game's built-in edge, and no more.

    Now - if I were to run a casino:

    1. I would allow bot play except when a bonus is in play.
    2. I would be very happy to have a bunch of bots playing at my casino, except when a bonus is in play.
    3. The faster a bot plays, the happier I am, except when a bonus is in play.

    My reasoning:

    * Bots don't give the player an edge, except when a bonus is in play.
    * Bots don't argue the toss or chit-chat or complain or beg for bonuses.
    * Bots don't take potty breaks or run to the fridge every few minutes.
    * Bots don't make off-topic posts in forums.
     
    3 people like this.
  16. Oct 29, 2008
  17. Pinababy69

    Pinababy69 RIP Lisa

    Occupation:
    Crusader
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario - Canada
    But then you'd have nothing to do Spear. :laugh:
     
  18. Oct 29, 2008
  19. Vortran007

    Vortran007 Casinomeister Robot - Security chief Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Forum security administrator
    Location:
    In front of the computer
    Greetings Spearmaster. What are you wearing for Halloween? Please let me know. Thank you.
     
    3 people like this.
  20. Oct 29, 2008
  21. spearmaster

    spearmaster RIP Ted

    Occupation:
    Devil's Advocate
    Location:
    Heaven
    Vortran!

    Who let you out of your box? Did the Meister forget to give you your daily dose of cod liver oil because he was too busy admiring his likeness at Intercasino?

    Anyhow, you're an exception because you're a mod... but then again, mods do go on vacation too...
     
  22. Oct 29, 2008
  23. Pinababy69

    Pinababy69 RIP Lisa

    Occupation:
    Crusader
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario - Canada
    This is what he told ME he was wearing. Vacations are okay as long as it's somewhere warm, and there are scantily clad cabana boys running around with cold, frothy drinks with little umbrellas in them. :laugh:
     
    1 person likes this.
  24. Oct 29, 2008
  25. GGW Laurie

    GGW Laurie Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Self Employed
    Location:
    In the Beautiful South !!
    thanks spearmaster for the info on the use of bots, you made it clearer for me to understandand, the humor also helped alot ,so much ,that i nominated your post:thumbsup:...........laurie
     
  26. Oct 30, 2008
  27. Glob

    Glob Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Hotel Night Auditor
    Location:
    Ohio, USA
    Hmm, I have a strategy that I am using, but I'm not using any bonus, or promotional monies. I hope the casino I"m using doesn't think I'm a bot. Granted, I DO go to bathroom breaks, the fridge, and only play about for about a half an hour a day :)
     
  28. Oct 30, 2008
  29. NewOrleans

    NewOrleans Banned User

    Occupation:
    gambling
    Location:
    Canada New Brunswick
    ...

    One should note that 99% of online casinos expect that you are playing for entertainment,a bot would break that rule since you are not playing for entertainment the bot is. This rule alone would put you in violation of the "playing for entertainment" set of rules.The other thing is that the bot usually has to "hack" it's way into the server which leaves a trace,the only way to use a bot undetected would be to have a real robot sitting at your computer doing the clicking for you.The only true advantage of a bot is it is immune to human error,unless you program it wrong of course,and also a bot has no feelings so it will not make a gut bet.And a bot won't get bored and get greedy. Other than that there is no real advantage with a bot anyway,and risking having all your winnings and deposit confiscated outweighs the benefits,bot users are stupid I guess and fall victim to the "make a fortune while you sleep" scams.Why not just use the expert feature and put 100 spins on auto...Using a bot for tables is insane,the only bot they offer is roulette bots anyway if they do have a blackjack bot programmed to use basic strategy this would only be useful to a blackjack newbie who doesn't know basic strategy.
     
  30. Oct 30, 2008
  31. lots0

    lots0 Banned User - troll posts - flaming

    Occupation:
    I do nothing productive
    Location:
    Hell on Earth
    In the past, most of the new poker rooms used bots to fill seats at the tables until they got enough real players to fill the tables...

    I used to seek out these new rooms that used bots.

    I LOVE playing against poker bots... :D
     
  32. Oct 30, 2008
  33. spearmaster

    spearmaster RIP Ted

    Occupation:
    Devil's Advocate
    Location:
    Heaven
    If you mean the "professional play" clauses they put in, you're right. Personally, I think those clauses should be banned.

    This is not true - in fact most, if not all bots, screenscrape the game window and then generate a mouse click in the correct places. Basically, they are interfacing with your software, not directly with the server.

    Vortran, correct me if I'm wrong ;)

    I don't think that bots are made for playing slots, other than the ones already built into the software. "Autoplay" is essentially a bot.

    You would be surprised how many people don't know basic strategy, or play it incorrectly. Then there are those who don't believe in strategy, but instead believe in luck or karma... then those who will never bust a hand... then those that split tens every chance they get... those that freak and insure every time they see a dealer Ace...
     
  34. Oct 30, 2008
  35. Westland Bowl

    Westland Bowl Tin Foil Hat Club Member CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    not applicable
    Location:
    America
    So "autoplay" is a bot? I've grinded down wagering requirements with slots and find the casinos' "autoplay" quite convenient. The casinos never complained about that when I've cashed out. They shouldn't anyway since it is part of their own software!
     
  36. Oct 31, 2008
  37. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Clearly, you have never frequented Casino Rewards;)
     
  38. Oct 31, 2008
  39. Westland Bowl

    Westland Bowl Tin Foil Hat Club Member CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    not applicable
    Location:
    America
    No, once they were rouged or taken off the accredited list here, I closed my accounts with them.
     

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