Unauthorised Withdrawal from My Neteller Account

[Haviton]

At this time, to ensure I receive unbiased comments, I will not nake the casino but this happened to me over the week.

At the weekend, I opened a casino account. Deposited via Neteller and received my bonus.

I withdrew a profit of 800. 3 days later, they paid me 200 (Dep) and 800.

The next day, and this is my gripe, they, without my consent, withdrew the 800 back from my neteller account. I was away until the weekend and had no email or anything from them. I wrote to them and they said that the payment was cancelled, please note the word CANCELLED.

I then phoned Neteller Security and spoke with them. They said it was not cancelled but was a Authorised Withdrawal that had come through with my Secure ID as well. They gave me a transaction number and everything about the transaction.

They have now asked me for ID. This is not the issue as it is no problem.

I am grossly concerend about this for a number of reasons.

The casino seem to feel they can charge my Neteller without my authorisation. If it was a credit card, I would demand a charge back, but apparrently Neteller do not.

The casino have stored my secure ID. This also causes concern regarding rogue members of staff/rogue casinos.

I look forward all comments

 

[elscrabinda]

Very worrying indeed. In your situation I'd send them a very angry email detailing why this is completely unacceptable and explaining that you will shortly be reporting them to whoever their regulator is.

You have no choice of course but to comply with their ID request and presumably you will get your money but the idea that casinos are able to do this scares me.

 

[Vesuvio]

I had the same thing happen at a reputable on-line casino recently. They'd accidentally paid me twice, so I couldn't have too many objections to them claiming it back (!), but I was suprised that they took money from my account without asking or informing me. I suspect they don't take Neteller transactions as seriously as they would transactions that might get them into trouble with banks or credit card companies.

With all the rogue operators out there it's probably best not to keep too much money in Neteller.

 

[Tdoggy]

Very Bad

I have heard horror stories about this happening to people. Money in neteller is not as safe as you may think. If casinos have your account info which they will if you make a deposit with them they can just take out money from your neteller account. This seems very unfair. Once again casinos having to much power comes into play.

 

[elscrabinda]

Cancelling a payment is one thing although its only polite to tell the person that ou're doing it. The case that Haviton describes is much more dangerous. I've played at some crappy casinos and to think that they are able to charge my neteller whenever they like is more than a bit scary

 

[Ivy29]

Neteller--yikes!

I totally believe this could happen. They can just pretend like its a normal transaction to "fix" their mistakes.

Money never lays around my Neteller account long enough to be in danger because it either gets deposited somewhere or stuck in the ATM card account so I can run down to the ATM and pull it out of there. There is a fee to transfer it to your ATM card and fees of course to yank the money out at the ATM machine, but still, pretty good system. I would think it would be impossible for them to get into the money in your ATM card account. Also, if you decide you want some of it back, its free to transfer it back into your regular Neteller account part. I think they start socking you with fees after 30 days of inactivity, too, but that's never been an issue for me (give me the cash please!).

 

[universexf6]

Same thing happened to me too at a Casino. In my case, an operator
of the casino took the money from my Neteller account in his operational
confusion and I had to prove it happened witnout my authorization to the casino until I received the righteful withdrawal back to me. In this case, Neteller maintains as being the complete outsider, and I really don't like it.

 

[Bruce]

At this time, to ensure I receive unbiased comments, I will not nake the casino but this happened to me over the week.

At the weekend, I opened a casino account. Deposited via Neteller and received my bonus.

I withdrew a profit of 800. 3 days later, they paid me 200 (Dep) and 800.

The next day, and this is my gripe, they, without my consent, withdrew the 800 back from my neteller account. I was away until the weekend and had no email or anything from them. I wrote to them and they said that the payment was cancelled, please note the word CANCELLED.

I then phoned Neteller Security and spoke with them. They said it was not cancelled but was a Authorised Withdrawal that had come through with my Secure ID as well. They gave me a transaction number and everything about the transaction.

They have now asked me for ID. This is not the issue as it is no problem.

I am grossly concerend about this for a number of reasons.

The casino seem to feel they can charge my Neteller without my authorisation. If it was a credit card, I would demand a charge back, but apparrently Neteller do not.

The casino have stored my secure ID. This also causes concern regarding rogue members of staff/rogue casinos.

I look forward all comments

Please share with us who is the casino in question...

 

[Haviton]

Bruce. I hope you understand why at this stage I do not want to disclose the name. I am looking for unbiased opinion that wasnt influenced by the casinos name like, Ive played there and never had a problem or yes, I blew 500 in no time their crap.

I will post it later in the week though as I am working away until Friday though

 

[GrandMaster]

It would be nice if someone from Neteller explained exactly what sort of a protocol is used to make a Neteller deposit at a casino. The way it ought to work, but clearly does not, is that all the necessary information is encrypted locally and sent to Neteller, where it is decrypted, verified and the money tranferred to the casino. The casino should not have access to any confidential information. Webdollar used by most Boss Media casinos opens up a new browser window with Neteller userid and secure ID in the URL, so anyone else using the computer could find it in the URL history. By reloading the page you can also make another deposit.

 

[Dirk Diggler]

I've noticed all RTG casinos store both your Neteller account ID and your Secure ID. If you store it as your preffered method you never need to input the details again - this is very dangerous IMO as it not only shows that they have all the info they need to deposit at any time, but if someone manages to access your account they can easily deposit via Neteller without needing any info.

BTW Haviton - have you complained to Neteller about this? I know the casino hasn't exactly stolen the money but still they should be made aware you never sanctioned the transaction.

 

[BCarlisle]

Yeah Haviton you should definitely tell neteller that you have money taken from your account without your intent. This thread certainly brings to light how unsecure neteller really is.

 

[Haviton]

Dirk
To be honest with you, in my opinion, they have stolen the money from me. It was in my account one day, they then fraudulently took it back from my acount by falsly giving Neteller the impression that I had OK'd the deal.

I have informed Neteller. I have informed them that I will pursue this via legal channels whether civil or criminal as it is relly p*ssing me off

 

[Tdoggy]

don't blame you

If I signed in my neteller account and some casino took my money I'd be heated also. Can't blame you for following this up. Probably would also. First time I ever heard a horror story about this I went into neteller and withdrew a lot of my money in there. Only keep a few hundred at a time in there these days. You never know. Can't believe these casinos are getting away with this.

 

[Aindreas_Daoc]

I really can't see any instance where anyone is allowed to use your Neteller without your consent.

This is indeed stealing. What is to prevent a shady operator to just empty your Neteller account?

One would think Neteller has some precautions or legal avenues for this, especially considering their supposed to be a regulated and publicly listed company. This is unacceptable and really shakes my confidence in Neteller.

 

[Stanford]

You need to tell

I hope one of the watchdogs can get some Neteller comment. This is very distressing. I would think a signed fraud affadavit would suffice to have them reverse the entry.

The casino needs to be named. This is one of those instances when all the facts should come out in the forum prior to submitting to the watchdogs. Players need to know who is doing this and if it is repeated by the same casino, it substantiates the fraud. That can't happen without information sharing.

Name the casino, alert Neteller to this thread and the Pitch a Bitch.

imho,
Stanford

 

[jetset]

Haviton, forgive me for coming into this discussion rather late, but have you actually contacted the casino concerned and spoken to someone in charge about this?

It is not unknown for emails to go astray, and it would in any case be useful to know what the casino's attitude is, whether there is any explanation for this on the face of it alarming occurrence and what they are doing about it?

 

[MrWolf]

It's outrageous that a casino can access a person's Neteller account and make an unauthorised withdrawal. I'll echo others' comments about concern over security, and that it's not worth keeping a large Neteller balance.

I am curious though Haviton the reason the casino's giving for voiding your winnings and, in my opinion, illegally accessing your Neteller account?

 

[Flavio4321]

Bryan, Jetset , or anybody whith contacts on neteller, I am interested in netellers opinion about this. You should contact and point them to this thread.

Another interesting question, what about instacash? do casinos have acces to your bank accounts too???

Flavio.

 

[paul02085]

This really worries me. Neteller better have a good explaination for this or they are gonna lose a lot of business. They need to come here and address this issue right away.

 

[Vesuvio]

It's outrageous that a casino can access a person's Neteller account and make an unauthorised withdrawal. I'll echo others' comments about concern over security, and that it's not worth keeping a large Neteller balance.

As far as I understand it the casino can't access anyone's Neteller account - they also need your password. What they do have is the account number and secure code so they can make debits from your account. There should be some system in place so that at the very least they have to inform a player before withdrawing money from his account. Ideally, though, the casino wouldn't have the secure code stored on their system - it'd be interesting to see what Neteller think about this.

 

[jetset]

Are you here, Haviton? I would be very interested in all sides of this story, which raises some important and very serious points.

Have you contacted the casino management and what did they have to say?

 

[chalupa]

After playing at a certain casino which I felt was shady -- no names mentioned (Slotland, cough, cough) , I was paranoid that the casino might in the future decide to help themselves to some of my money, particularly if I contested some credit card charges due to what I felt was fraudulent behavior on their part.

So I contacted Neteller about just this issue. Neteller assured me that it was "impossible" for a casino to make an unauthorized withdrawal from my account.

When I asked how it could be impossible if they had my secure ID, they ignored the question and issued me a new secure ID.

In other words... anyone with your Neteller account number and secure ID (which is potentially any casino you ever deposited at) could bleed your Neteller account dry.

Now, presumably, Neteller has SOME sort of appeals process so you would hopefully eventually get your money back, but at a minimum it would be a huge hassle.

So I think changing your secure ID now and then is a sensible precaution, particularly if you have less-than-fond memories of an experience at a casino where you've used Neteller.

If I were Haviton, I'd change my secure ID immediately.

 

[Tdoggy]

Thank You

I think I will go change my secure idea right now. Been Years since I have done that. Thanks for the important info. Scary how any casino with your info can just take as they please from your neteller account.

 

[mucullus]

It is amazing, on the client's side neteller has pretty paranoid security measures, but their policy with merchants seems to be quite laissez-faire.