Twin Spin Rage

[slotter999]

I don't think Netent or MG or others have changed or the RTP has been altered.

In my view the main reason for very poor sessions is the total number of players. This has exploded in the past years together with the number of new casinos.

I agree with this statement. I further suspect a lot of RTP accuracy for netents is achieved through players playing minimum bet.

It's a shame netent don't make the stats publicly available for each machine to validate this but I guess that information could be commercially sensitive. For what it's worth I collect publicly available spin data on netent and over 100's of thousands of spins the RTP is never really far out and from what I can tell you have about a 1 in 3 chance of finishing up over 100 spins.

I did read the other day that netent are processing something like 6 billion transactions per quarter so how useful the data I have is I don't really know.

Re: comments about dead / chasing freespins I tell you games like JATB are something like a 1 in 167 chance of hitting. When you know the numbers you realise that it's quite long odds and any wonder we hit them at all.

I think on netents its wise to follow dunovers advice and walk after 50 and never chase (I think it was something along those lines ). If I took that advice many netent car crashes would have been avoided.

Good luck all.

 

[scarletmuse]

Hi all, by far I do not have nearly as much experience/know-how as many contributors here but I have eagerly been reading this thread for everyone's input and feedback as it is quite interesting!


i just wanted to add a little insight from my own experiences that I never thought too much about really, just steer away from those slots most days

I have to say Harry is on point mentioning the Slots Battle Phenomena (I have thought in the past when I have noticed it, maybe I had imagined it this whole time... I kept pondering well, there must be a trick or strategy to winning these Battles surely cos that dude finishing on like 112,000 pts and here's me with 976 measly coins like oh thanks for coming)

Its not a long-term observation for me and without applying any sort of stat or in-depth observation over time, I definitiely agree, the VS Battle Slots somehow awesome payouts/spins/features you can trigger in a Freeroll at 10/20c spins is pretty ridic. I have done it myself-Go Bananas, Wonky Wabbits and South Park are a few I can remember because of this exact phenomena!! I had never played any of them prior to the Battle and blown away with the all the happenings and coin bursts and so forth I would give them a shot in real play.... Only with the exception of Go Bananas where my first attempts did hit a couple of decent wins around $20-40 from memory, those Battle points could never be repeated with real funds LOL

On the Netent topic-I used to play loads of Netent games when I began playing at the start of my VS/Gut journeys... they seemed to hit FS or cute little bonus features all the time for me. Always fun and interesting bonus/free games kept my early slotting exciting cos I always got decent return for a 20/60c bet so it was great and entertaining! Netent but they are withiut fail one of the better providers-that always work nicely on mobile too. Dracula, JATB, King of Slots, Even Stickers and Dazzle Me had a few of my first little wins when I started slotting. Now, it's like do I? don't I? and if I do go in and play forget it! Nothing. Nothing. Nothing.

Twin Spin I have only even managed to win big when playing with a big bonus and WR where I have been a bit more reckless with the bet sizes than I would normally do. When I go back when on the realsie money, nope nothing.

And gosh... This one is enigmatic as yet for me... Can I be shown the light on this one as it baffles me! So... Please, DOA?! Can somebody enlighten me to the secret of this so muchly beloved slot? Maybe I am unlucky, maybe I am doing it wrong I dunno, but the more I see it on CM the more I think ooh i will have a go next time on the laptop and then its like loss, loss, little wins never covering my bets... Things spin but nothing happens arghhh!! So i have only dabbled sporadically, ranging between 9c and 90c spins, maybe I don't have the patience for this apparently magnificent game

 

[Harry_BKK]

Hi all, by far I do not have nearly as much experience/know-how as many contributors here but I have eagerly been reading this thread for everyone's input and feedback as it is quite interesting!


i just wanted to add a little insight from my own experiences that I never thought too much about really, just steer away from those slots most days

I have to say Harry is on point mentioning the Slots Battle Phenomena (I have thought in the past when I have noticed it, maybe I had imagined it this whole time... I kept pondering well, there must be a trick or strategy to winning these Battles surely cos that dude finishing on like 112,000 pts and here's me with 976 measly coins like oh thanks for coming)

Its not a long-term observation for me and without applying any sort of stat or in-depth observation over time, I definitiely agree, the VS Battle Slots somehow awesome payouts/spins/features you can trigger in a Freeroll at 10/20c spins is pretty ridic. I have done it myself-Go Bananas, Wonky Wabbits and South Park are a few I can remember because of this exact phenomena!! I had never played any of them prior to the Battle and blown away with the all the happenings and coin bursts and so forth I would give them a shot in real play.... Only with the exception of Go Bananas where my first attempts did hit a couple of decent wins around $20-40 from memory, those Battle points could never be repeated with real funds LOL

On the Netent topic-I used to play loads of Netent games when I began playing at the start of my VS/Gut journeys... they seemed to hit FS or cute little bonus features all the time for me. Always fun and interesting bonus/free games kept my early slotting exciting cos I always got decent return for a 20/60c bet so it was great and entertaining! Netent but they are withiut fail one of the better providers-that always work nicely on mobile too. Dracula, JATB, King of Slots, Even Stickers and Dazzle Me had a few of my first little wins when I started slotting. Now, it's like do I? don't I? and if I do go in and play forget it! Nothing. Nothing. Nothing.

Twin Spin I have only even managed to win big when playing with a big bonus and WR where I have been a bit more reckless with the bet sizes than I would normally do. When I go back when on the realsie money, nope nothing.

And gosh... This one is enigmatic as yet for me... Can I be shown the light on this one as it baffles me! So... Please, DOA?! Can somebody enlighten me to the secret of this so muchly beloved slot? Maybe I am unlucky, maybe I am doing it wrong I dunno, but the more I see it on CM the more I think ooh i will have a go next time on the laptop and then its like loss, loss, little wins never covering my bets... Things spin but nothing happens arghhh!! So i have only dabbled sporadically, ranging between 9c and 90c spins, maybe I don't have the patience for this apparently magnificent game

Fact is we don't and probably will never know how the algorithms work for these slots. NT/MG/WMS etc. will surely not publish them.

My logical thinking made me pay attention and secondly, more importantly the mathematical probability for 1 player to have 8 bonus rounds + other features (nutnut's example) or several big wins, each well exceeding 100x bet within 100 spins (my example on Twin Spin), events that normally happen on average once every few 100 spins is maybe not in the region of hitting 6 numbers in the lottery, but surely so small that i find it hard to believe it is down to the players luck.

Just do the maths on the bonus rounds which have usually a 1:150-160 chance to hit, meaning on average you have one in that number of spins. That's 0.66 - 0.63% just to hit it, to get then repeatedly payouts higher than 100x bet adds another level. Hence the mathematical probability to hit them 8x / 100 spins and multiple big payouts in most of those rounds is just so astronomically small. That RNG to favor one or at most a few player/s so heavily just seems strange.

And i see them only happening when the battles on VS are very busy, e.g. the evening ones or during the freebie promo VS did now twice. Hmm, as i said, just makes me wonder sometimes

Now to your DOA part

This slot is one of the most boring slots every invented yet at the same time the most exciting one, simply for those 2 big events that can happen, WL or 5 x scatter. You are guaranteed to lose your deposits if you do not hit at least the 5 extra spins during your session, the question is only how long will your deposits last which depends on how often you get 5OAK's of symbols or bonus rounds with a few scattered wilds.

The secret is that DOA requires patience, patience, patience, the stamina to go through hours/days/weeks of sheer boredom, plenty of funds (if you play it on medium bets) and ultimately the simple, or rather not so simple luck to be playing at the right time.

E.g i hit 2 x 5 scatters within 1 hour last week and nothing since, not even once the 5 extra spins, let alone a complete WL; and i do play thousands of spins pretty much every day. Usually running on 1000 Autospins while i do other work related stuff.

 

[asm]

I guess I was lucky with my DOA, as I probably hit my wildline within 2000 spins in the entire machine. I've probably buried as much in it in the months after without hitting the wild line, but I've gotten many x500 - x1000 hits on it without the line or 5 scatters.

But Harry is right, it's the most boring and exciting game there is! The base game is a borefest but just wait till you get 4 wilds in a row with 6 spins to go to get the 5th. Personally I don't understand why it seems that Twinspin and Starburst are popular. Starburst is the worst offender when it comes to these two. At least getting a 243 symbol hit in twinspin makes up for it, I don't think I've ever even gone near 100x, and if you see 3 bars in reel 1 in starburst, it's time to stop the reels and go again because it's a dead spin.

 

[Harry_BKK]

I guess I was lucky with my DOA, as I probably hit my wildline within 2000 spins in the entire machine. I've probably buried as much in it in the months after without hitting the wild line, but I've gotten many x500 - x1000 hits on it without the line or 5 scatters.

But Harry is right, it's the most boring and exciting game there is! The base game is a borefest but just wait till you get 4 wilds in a row with 6 spins to go to get the 5th. Personally I don't understand why it seems that Twinspin and Starburst are popular. Starburst is the worst offender when it comes to these two. At least getting a 243 symbol hit in twinspin makes up for it, I don't think I've ever even gone near 100x, and if you see 3 bars in reel 1 in starburst, it's time to stop the reels and go again because it's a dead spin.

LOL, you were lucky. .....I went nearly 6 months and wasted some 20K before hitting the first 5x scatter and another 2 weeks after that to hit my first WL. Had to learn it the hard way that doing my normal bet sizes as on other 9-line slots (1.80 - 4.50) my deposits would be happily swallowed by DOA without even a sniff at a WL. ....from there it took me then a further 3 months to recover it all and put me some 10K ahead overall, thanks to a 20K hit at Redbet and 9.6K at Bet-At, which is going in and back out ever since. After 18 month of playing it heavily (average is appr. 3800 spins/day) i am currently still a few K ahead.

TBH i do not think Starburst to be the most popular slot. Twin Spin to be in the TOP10 i can see, yes.

The popularity is measured on the total spins/month on any particular slot. If we now think how often FS are given on Starburst, probably millions of spins every month. That alone makes it already popular because so many players are seeing and playing on it every day. I am sure that the majority will stay on Starburst after they finished the FS to give it a few more spins, hence adding again a significant number to the monthly tally.

 

[slotter999]

Just do the maths on the bonus rounds which have usually a 1:150-160 chance to hit.

This figure can actually vary quite a bit depending the machine. For example Steamtower is 1 - 84 chance of hitting free spins where as Drive is 1 - 200 so there is quite a bit variance there to consider. I don't have the figures to hand for average return for free spins on either of these machines but this is also quite important when considering how much value there is in chasing these things.