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Total Poker / webdollar can they do this?

Discussion in 'Poker Complaints' started by 120sam, Jun 26, 2007.

    Jun 26, 2007
  1. 120sam

    120sam Banned User

    Location:
    Germany
    I recently opened a Total Poker account. I and a friend of mine wanted to play a game using their software, and we played a heads up tournament. I won and tried to withdraw my winnings, and received the following:



    I have absolutely no idea why webdollar should adopt this position. I can only suspect that our geographical proximity raised some kind of flag. There is nothing in their rules that says they object to friends playing each other using their software, so how was I to know? We played a heads up tournament, no other players were involved.

    As far as I am concerned webdollar are not an authority figure, and the fact that they have "deemed" something does not give them the right to judge and impose punishment. They are a private business to whom I have entrusted my money, and they claim to be entitled to steal / withhold my funds for six months for breach of some rule they never made me aware of. They haven't made clear what their problem is, so of course I can't respond to it.

    I have around $1000 balance in my Total Poker account, and a pending withdrawal of around $1000, so they are basically saying they are hanging on to around $2000 of mine for 6 months, and haven't said they'll return it to me after that. What is the purpose / justification of this six-month period? Did they just pluck the figure of six months out of their air for anyone "deemed" to trangress their (flawed) "security system"?

    Feedback very welcome, because I don't have a clue what's going on here. I really don't care if they don't want my custom (I'll never play there again anyway after this), but stealing my money? Are they not accountable?
     
  2. Jun 27, 2007
  3. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    Are you the only person using your computer? If it's a shared computer and these people also have accounts, then there might be a problem.
     
  4. Jun 27, 2007
  5. 120sam

    120sam Banned User

    Location:
    Germany
    I am the only person using my computer. I played from my computer in my house, my friend played from his computer in his house. Webdollar should be able to prove this by checking ISPs and whatever else they check to see that they were different computers.

    I have asked webdollar to confirm that they do at least guarantee to pay my money after 6 months, and I am waiting for a reply. I have no idea what the problem is, because webdollar won't discuss it. I really don't like their use of the word "fraud", or the fact that they won't define it.
     
  6. Jun 27, 2007
  7. 120sam

    120sam Banned User

    Location:
    Germany
    This is totally unacceptable. Does anyone have any contacts with webdollar? They don't appear to have a rep here.
     
  8. Jun 28, 2007
  9. fatshaft

    fatshaft Full Member

    Location:
    Isle of Man
    So how many hands did you "play" in this sit'n'go to win?

    Have either of you played any other games ever?

    If not then your actions are highly suspicious, and no wonder your account is locked.
     
  10. Jun 28, 2007
  11. The Ronin

    The Ronin Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Semi-pro poker player.
    Location:
    Back East
    This is from their main page. Perhaps they are claiming you or your friend used an unauthorized deposit method, such as a new or stolen credit card to fund a web-dollar account. If so, they should say so.

    Perhaps they are claiming your friend chip dumped to you, in an effort to launder illegal funds. Again, they should say so.

    Perhaps, buried deep in the user agreement you signed when you opened your web dollar account, there is a clause that stipulates you authorize them to hold onto funds they deem fraudulent, for a period of six months, and at the end of six months, they will decide if they should keep your money, or pay it to you, minus any interest accrued ;) once again, if that is the case, they should email you a copy of that clause, and prove to you that they are acting appropriately.

    So far, from what you have displayed, they invoked something, for some reason that is vague, and borderline criminal. If you violated a specific policy, you should at least be told what it is you violated, and given some sort of arbitration or appeal process you can begin.

    Unless you are failing to display the entire list of facts, it would appear on the surface, that web dollar has some explaining to do!

    A few facts need to be stated IMHO:

    Did you use an unauthorized or new method to fund your web dollar account?

    Did your friend use an unauthorized or new method to fund their web dollar account?

    Was their a series of peer transfers that were used to fund your account, then used to fund a poker account, with the intention, knowingly or otherwise, to "launder" those funds?

    How long have you had your web dollar account, and your poker account?

    How long has your friend had his web dollar account and his poker account?

    These questions may seem intrusive, and somewhat silly, but I think you will find more help, if you are open and honest with the members here. Thus far your story seems one sided and vague. Granted web dollars side doesn't appear much better. At least one side should lay it all on the line, so everyone can at least make an educated opinion on what happened, and perhaps someone can offer assistance. :thumbsup:
     
  12. Jun 28, 2007
  13. 120sam

    120sam Banned User

    Location:
    Germany
    I used my neteller account I've had for over 3 years.

    He will have used Neteller or Click2Pay.

    Not sure what this question means. I don't do any peer to peer transfers with my neteller account, and I have never transfered funds to this friend by any online payment method.

    I opened the poker account at the end of May. I was redirected to Total Poker when I tried to open a poker account at a webdollar casino where I've had an account for much longer.

    I don't know, I think his poker account was fairly new, I don't know which casino it was from. I haven't had a chance to speak to him since this happened. I'm not sure what funds he still has in his account, if any, but he hasn't been in touch in a panic or anything so he probably isn't affected.

    As to the other poster's question, it was a fairly normal lengh tournament game. I can't remember the details (I've played a lot of other tournements since then) but I do remember the blinds went up a few times.
     
  14. Jul 3, 2007
  15. Centre-Wise

    Centre-Wise Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Casino Rep
    Location:
    Sydney
    HI,

    You said you played a games of heads up and then tried to withdrawal?

    How quick was the headsup game, was there any aspect that could have been mistaken as team play, cheating, colluding, fraud or any other word you care to describe it as.

    They would not have sent you that email without something further, perhaps a IP match? Serial Match?

    My advise would be to request to speak to management or fraud directly so they can give you some sort of idea how your play was deemed fraudulent.

    Please be aware if you won the game on a questionable hand, or used the tournament to transfer funds between yourself and your friend this can be enough for an investigation to be carried out, which usualy results in an email such as the one posted.

    Hope i could help, but without further info we dont have much to go on.
     
  16. Jul 3, 2007
  17. winbig

    winbig Keep winning this amount. webby PABnononaccred

    Occupation:
    Bum
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    How much more info do you need?

     
  18. Jul 3, 2007
  19. WAYLANDER

    WAYLANDER Experienced Member webmeister

    Occupation:
    Garden buildings installer S/E / Poker
    Location:
    uk
    Interesting

    I find this thread interesting and something i have often wondered about

    All my views in this post are assuming there are no money laundering issues/fraud

    What exactly is wrong with two friends playing a heads up tournament/cash game?
    What harm can come out of it ? .... there is no one else involved so collusion and cheating dont come into the equation.
    What makes a " questionable hand " , when i am playing in home games you should hear/see all the crap that we come out with! i dont think its even against the rules in proffesional poker to show one or even both cards to your opponent in a heads up situation before they have even made their decision.
    The card room still get their fee/rake
    Some card rooms let you transfer money from person to person anyway.. Party Poker being one ( havent checked this today, but i know they did ) so if the biggest poker room on the planet think its ok it cant be too bad anyway.
    What makes a friend? i have met loads of players online that i regularly chat too and play against, who i will talk to about all sorts of things whilst playing poker..... am i now not allowed to play heads up with them ?
    I just cant see the harm

    WAYLANDER
     
  20. Jul 5, 2007
  21. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    But maybe you mistakenly opened more than one account on your computer. There are ways that this is detected. What do you think?
     
  22. Jun 2, 2009
  23. Deborschti

    Deborschti Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Customer service rep
    Location:
    South of Spain
    Chipdumping

    Hi,

    It seems they suspect you of chip dumping.
    Let's say you have a few grand of dirty money to launder, you could simply lose them to a friend, he would get clean poker winnings.
    If it would be that easy sure the mafia :gunmen: would love poker.

    So probably they think you laundered or tried to launder money by dumping chips to someone else.

    Try to demonstrate the contrary to them.

    Good luck.

    Deborschti
     
  24. Jun 2, 2009
  25. vegetagirl2008

    vegetagirl2008 Mafia Wars Level 472

    Occupation:
    No Job Here..
    Location:
    Brooklyn, New York, United States
    This thread is 2 years old. Please check the dates before posting..
     
    2 people like this.

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