Think slots are rigged? Read this first...

[Mr_Slot5]

HERE’S SNORKY!

Yeah ok from what we now know I will use the example that the purists have used many times.

The balls and the bag scenario (and no it’s not the one where the angle of the dangle is equal to the throb of the kno#) .

The example they use is there are ten balls in a bag 5 blue, 3 green, 2 red and one white.
They say the colour of the ball you pick is random. Yes of course it is (in as much as you can’t guarantee which colour you will pick) but if your life depended on it and you had to name the colour your going to pick you would guess blue obviously.

They say every outcome has to be available on every spin. What they don’t have to state is what the odds are on every spin. Now we know about reel sets being changed etc those odds could be changing dramatically on each spin.

This also leads me to think is this how slots are classed as random but this is a mask for compensated. What I mean is to keep rtp on track if the game pays a big win the next x amount of players get the duff reels until the pool builds up again and then the next set come into play. If nobody hits big and the pool hits the next threshold the next best set come into play and so on until the pot drops down again and the relevant reel sets come into play again.

For certain games especially the megaways this could be happening in the base game. On the more simple games where large base hits are not common perhaps only the bonus rounds are manipulated.

It may seem a bit out there but it would explain the undoubted hot and cold streaks and still be classed as random in providers eyes.

That's exactly how I understand it to work. By doing this you can essentially control where the RTP goes, whilst technically still producing 'random' results.

 

[Kroffe]

HERE’S SNORKY!

The example they use is there are ten balls in a bag 5 blue, 3 green, 2 red and one white.

Oh.. I see what you are doing...
Trying to make a fool out of Winnie are we?
5+3+2+1 is eleven, not ten.

Maybe you can fool the others, but i learned math this advanced when is was just a little shit.. And now i am a big Pooh, so good luck trying to fool me.

 

[snorky510238]

Oh.. I see what you are doing...
Trying to make a fool out of Winnie are we?
5+3+2+1 is eleven, not ten.

Maybe you can fool the others, but i learned math this advanced when is was just a little shit.. And now i am a big Pooh, so good luck trying to fool me.


View attachment 112750

Lol I was going to give a more in depth angle but ended up confusing myself with the explanation. Doesn’t take much.

 

[paul7388]

Oh.. I see what you are doing...
Trying to make a fool out of Winnie are we?
5+3+2+1 is eleven, not ten.

Maybe you can fool the others, but i learned math this advanced when is was just a little shit.. And now i am a big Pooh, so good luck trying to fool me.


View attachment 112750

You're smarter than the average bear.

 

[Kroffe]

You're smarter than the average bear.

View attachment 112761

I figured out it was more than ten because i ran out of fingers to count on when adding the numbers up.
Good thing i have feet.
10 fingers + 1 toe, equals 11.
Easy peasy!

 

[The Reel Story]

HERE’S SNORKY!

Yeah ok from what we now know I will use the example that the purists have used many times.

The balls and the bag scenario (and no it’s not the one where the angle of the dangle is equal to the throb of the kno#) .

The example they use is there are ten balls in a bag 5 blue, 3 green, 2 red and one white.
They say the colour of the ball you pick is random. Yes of course it is (in as much as you can’t guarantee which colour you will pick) but if your life depended on it and you had to name the colour your going to pick you would guess blue obviously.

This assumes you put the ball back after each 'try'. Otherwise it wouldn't be an accurate description

They say every outcome has to be available on every spin. What they don’t have to state is what the odds are on every spin. Now we know about reel sets being changed etc those odds could be changing dramatically on each spin.

This also leads me to think is this how slots are classed as random but this is a mask for compensated. What I mean is to keep rtp on track if the game pays a big win the next x amount of players get the duff reels until the pool builds up again and then the next set come into play. If nobody hits big and the pool hits the next threshold the next best set come into play and so on until the pot drops down again and the relevant reel sets come into play again.

For certain games especially the megaways this could be happening in the base game. On the more simple games where large base hits are not common perhaps only the bonus rounds are manipulated.

It may seem a bit out there but it would explain the undoubted hot and cold streaks and still be classed as random in providers eyes.

This would be illegal and is not something that happens (it would not be considered random. It would be controlled). Reel sets do change when a feature is changing. I.E, in DHV, when you go into the HV bonus round, you play on a different reel set (well, 3 of them technically) then each spin randomly chooses one of those 3 reel sets (and they are weighted differently, one is worse, one is average, one is better).

This is legal. And they could even give you the bad one more often, so say, 50% yo uget the bad one, 30% the average one and 20% the good one. Also legal. It's still random but weighted. What isn't happening is 'Oh, you got the good one last spin? now you get the bad one'.

This is the difference between Random and Control. Noone denies that the math models are in the favour of the Casino and for some reason, people seem to think that something can't be weighted in the casino's favour and also be random.

My preferred analogy is a simple dice roll. On a 1-4, you pay me, on a 5-6, I pay you. It's random, but I win in the long term. I don't need to use weighted dice to achieve it. If you want to complicate it, 1-4 you pay me, 5 I pay you, 6 you hit a bonus round. On the bonus round I pull out a 20 sided dice and on a 1-10 you get paid and on 11-20 you get paid double. Each roll still has the same odds and even if I change the reel set (the dice) in the bonus, you still have the same odds. THose odds are weighted in my favour though.

What I'm not doing is using a 6 sided dice for roll 1, and then a 20 sided dice for roll 2, but still only paying you on a 5 or 6. That's illegal.

 

[shadow123]

A certain developer did a game where there were 3 modes of play,enhanced occurrance of jackpots, enhanced occurance of features and
normal mix of both.These were on machines in arcades which were classed as random. The game has been online for quite a while, if the same system is still used and the 3 modes have differrent rtp,s it would point to the possibility of compensated play if they so desired.

 

[Bloatgoat]

Ofcourse. And there was hacked software around that could alter and change the RTP on the fly.

It's happening in landbased too, that at day the slots are a bit more tight compared to the evening/night.

 

[The Reel Story]

A certain developer did a game where there were 3 modes of play,enhanced occurrance of jackpots, enhanced occurance of features and
normal mix of both.These were on machines in arcades which were classed as random. The game has been online for quite a while, if the same system is still used and the 3 modes have differrent rtp,s it would point to the possibility of compensated play if they so desired.

Nothing wrong with having different math models for a game as long as only one is in use at one time or the user is given the choice of which one to play. Each one would effectively be a different game. It'd arguably even be fine if the game randomly picked one of the 3 modes each spin. It certainly wouldn't be ok if one or another was being forced on to a user at any one time. I don't think this points to any kind of compensated gameplay at all.

Ofcourse. And there was hacked software around that could alter and change the RTP on the fly.

RTP is not something that can be changed on the fly. That's just not how it works.

It's happening in landbased too, that at day the slots are a bit more tight compared to the evening/night.

That's a myth that has been widely debunked and is not possible in any regulated market.

As always, I am only speaking about regulated markets. As has been said, the wild west is the wild west. You go there at your own risk.

 

[Bloatgoat]

It's bin posted on this forums. Illegal casino software where the game could be altered on the fly. There's a video of that somewhere, but i think it's deep down the archives. @trancemonkey can confirm that specific thread as well. I think it was a hacked set of novomatic games.

As for the landbased casino's, really, they can and do it. In regulated markets as well. Coming straight from the USA. Happening also in europe. If you've ever bin in a landbased and a proper one, you could tell that by coming more frequently it's best to come at evening or even night instead of day. It might not be a change of RTP but the slots are at day more tight then at night. You give me an straight answer to why this is and even confirmed by casino's in the USA lol.

Really if you dont know what you are talking about, it's best to not comment.

 

[paul7388]

Really if you dont know what you are talking about, it's best to not comment.

Sorry that sentence had me in stitches.

Was going to say what i am thinking but decided no point. Oh i love threads like this

 

[Bloatgoat]

The guy is denying any existance of hacked novomatic software. Well it is and it was shown on this forum specific. A video in where the RTP was just altered and bam completely manipulated.

 

[paul7388]

The guy is denying any existance of hacked novomatic software. Well it is and it was shown on this forum specific. A video in where the RTP was just altered and bam completely manipulated.

They were not hacked. They were also not online.

It was many years ago and they were just programmed badly so some people managed to work out the sequence and when the best chance of winning was.

But things have moved on a hell of a lot from those days.

 

[Bloatgoat]

You just googled that did'nt you ?

 

[goatwack]

I don't know what I'm talking about, so it's best I don't comment

 

[paul7388]

You just googled that did'nt you ?

No i just have a good memory for when trance tried to explain all this and you disagreed. And now TheReelStory is wasting his time as well lol.

 

[paul7388]

I don't know what I'm talking about, so it's best I don't comment

Never stopped you before

 

[goatwack]

Never stopped you before

See now you're making me comment you bastard

 

[Kroffe]

Did anyone call for a hacker?

 

[paul7388]

Did anyone call for a hacker?

View attachment 112774

That's not a hacker.

He is just looking for the mouse

 

[goatwack]

Did anyone call for a hacker?

View attachment 112774

Word on the street's that this cat works for Anonymouse

 

[paul7388]

Word on the street's that this cat works for Anonymouse

That was a Purrfect response

 

[Kroffe]

That's not a hacker.

He is just looking for the mouse

Well.. I got this other trick to alter things...It just might work on computers aswell.
But im not responsible if things go wrong, this is on you Paul.

 

[Kroffe]

That was a Purrfect response

Stop with the puns right meow!

 

[goatwack]

Stop with the puns right meow!

You forgot to say paw-lease