Your Input Please The ordeal of online gambling, Casumo.

[Slottery]

what u accept Queen of Uk to open casino lol

Not about me accepting something or not, was just wondering statement about 99% of mafia as haven't been able to find any information nearby that so therefore asked some source for that but did only receive many year old article about Malta providing passports for investors

 

[GameRoom]

Not about me accepting something or not, was just wondering statement about 99% of mafia as haven't been able to find any information nearby that so therefore asked some source for that but did only receive many year old article about Malta providing passports for investors

what makes u proof they not? or you saying them not without proof? that what I believe coz I was on malta many times a lot of news on google so on? if you have proof they not than proof it

 

[colinsunderland]

what makes u proof they not? or you saying them not without proof? that what I believe coz I was on malta many times a lot of news on google so on? if you have proof they not than proof it

Its almost impossible to prove a negative. You stated 99%, so you show some evidence? Or are you saying Videoslots, Casumo, L&L, LegoVegas etc are all owned by mobsters?

 

[Slottery]

what makes u proof they not? or you saying them not without proof? that what I believe coz I was on malta many times a lot of news on google so on? if you have proof they not than proof it

That's quite of impossible to proof that some people are not part of mafia, i have no proof of it.

You stated that 99% of Maltese casinos are connected with mafia so you for sure have proof of that these all people who are listed to be owners of these casinos are connected to mafia, would be just interested to know these all people connections.

So basically what you said was BS and based that you have been in Malta and was able to google lot of news

 

[GameRoom]

That's quite of impossible to proof that some people are not part of mafia, i have no proof of it.

You stated that 99% of Maltese casinos are connected with mafia so you for sure have proof of that these all people who are listed to be owners of these casinos are connected to mafia, would be just interested to know these all people connections.

So basically what you said was BS and based that you have been in Malta and was able to google lot of news

so who do you accept a country like Russia in the last 20 years they have over 2000 self-made bilioners before that they had none? all from corruption and organized crime, Cypres made deal with russa if they invest they get citizenship, Cypres economy and tax haven boom in a very short period, malta did same deal in 2016 than malt economy boom in 2016 over 300 casinos got to register on malta with only half million of population, based on media 99% of loundering money when to malta, you can call it as you wish BS,if u dont agree don't need to replay, just stop and think way no one invest on Gibraltar or Islan of man? way malta? way malta had no casinos even 50 casinos online before 2016? but after a deal for free citizenship with Russia to give access to European market 330 casinos open

 

[colinsunderland]

so who do you accept a country like Russia in the last 20 years they have over 2000 self-made bilioners before that they had none? all from corruption and organized crime, Cypres made deal with russa if they invest they get citizenship, Cypres economy and tax haven boom in a very short period, malta did same deal in 2016 than malt economy boom in 2016 over 300 casinos got to register on malta with only half million of population, based on media 99% of loundering money when to malta, you can call it as you wish BS,if u dont agree don't need to replay, just stop and think way no one invest on Gibraltar or Islan of man? way malta? way malta had no casinos even 50 casinos online before 2016? but after a deal for free citizenship with Russia to give access to European market 330 casinos open

Rubbish, you don't know what you are talking about. From the MGA 2015 report

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The number of remote gaming licences has grown significantly over the years reaching a total number of 490 at the end of 2015.

With regard to remote gaming, the total number of licences reached 490 held by 269 companies as at the end of 2015. The main increases were registered in Class 4 and Class 1 categories, which grew by 17% and 8% respectively, when compared to 2014.

So again, which casinos are operated by organised crime groups? Just name say 10 of them?

 

[dunover]

Back on topic, the latest is my account has been locked/suspended 'for security reasons'. Must be all that smack I sold 3 years ago that came with no paper trail and funded those older deposits.

Guilty until I prove myself innocent, which I can't be assed with. I don't want to be a member of a casino that approves 2 SoW's, an affordability check then moves the goalposts a few weeks later to go back 3 years. Sheer incompetence and illogicality. This is probably due to the fine they got, so tidying up old loose ends. Who knows. Who cares.

That's me done with MGA sites.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Back on topic, the latest is my account has been locked/suspended 'for security reasons'. Must be all that smack I sold 3 years ago that came with no paper trail and funded those older deposits.

Guilty until I prove myself innocent, which I can't be assed with. I don't want to be a member of a casino that approves 2 SoW's, an affordability check then moves the goalposts a few weeks later to go back 3 years. Sheer incompetence and illogicality. This is probably due to the fine they got, so tidying up old loose ends. Who knows. Who cares.

That's me done with MGA sites.

At this point I feel it would be easier for some of these MGA casinos to just pull completely out of the UK market to save on all the acrimony.

It's funny how these MGA casinos seem to kick up all this fuss yet UK facing casinos just get on with it, apply common sense and use the easiest methods of verification.

More and more of the UK casinos are acquiring Play n Go now which means it's no great loss to me if these MGA clip joints disappear from our shores.

 

[Playford7]

At this point I feel it would be easier for some of these MGA casinos to just pull completely out of the UK market to save on all the acrimony.

It's funny how these MGA casinos seem to kick up all this fuss yet UK facing casinos just get on with it, apply common sense and use the easiest methods of verification.

More and more of the UK casinos are acquiring Play n Go now which means it's no great loss to me if these MGA clip joints disappear from our shores.

Totally agree.
Never found the fascination with the Maltese mafia lot of casinos. Even the best of them turn rogue at some point.
Never had a single issue with any big uk bookies, thousands and thousands over the years deposited and withdrew.
Yes the MGA lot offer good bonuses (or used to) however they where littered with terms that meant cashouts where almost impossible.
Not overly fussed about the likes of play and go and there dodgy choose your own RTP, happy with netent and micro gaming tbh nowadays, BTG are crap and same for blueprint and the fobty designed megaways.
Give me a solid site with a good sports book and DOA and we are good to go.

 

[Kroffe]

At this point I feel it would be easier for some of these MGA casinos to just pull completely out of the UK market to save on all the acrimony.

It's funny how these MGA casinos seem to kick up all this fuss yet UK facing casinos just get on with it, apply common sense and use the easiest methods of verification.

More and more of the UK casinos are acquiring Play n Go now which means it's no great loss to me if these MGA clip joints disappear from our shores.

Might be different for people living in the Uk, but for me, William hill is the only site ive not managed to verify my account on.
Somehow documents that were good enough for every other casino in existence did not work when used on WH.
Got the old "send a selfie holding paper a´+b etc"
And even when i tried being a good boy jumping thru all the hoops they kept finding errors.
"That paper has to be printed in color"
"your thumb covers a word on picture 37-a"

And maybe the best one, "That does not look like you" (it was me)

And all while this was going on, withdrawals were locked.
Want to guess if deposits were locked?

And their support is by faaaaar the worst i have ever had to deal with. (And ive talked with support on a bunch of sites)

Slow to answer. Rude. Giving wrong answers ie not knowing their stuff.
One person okaying a document only for the next person to deny it.

Ended up not being able to verify and closed my account.
Atleast they sent my withdrawal before they locked withdrawals for me.
I was under the impression the withdrawal would be sent first after i had managed to verify my account, wich was the only reason i went along with their crazy demands in the first place.

1.5/10 Honeyjars.

 

[mack341]

Might be different for people living in the Uk, but for me, William hill is the only site ive not managed to verify my account on.
Somehow documents that were good enough for every other casino in existence did not work when used on WH.
Got the old "send a selfie holding paper a´+b etc"
And even when i tried being a good boy jumping thru all the hoops they kept finding errors.
"That paper has to be printed in color"
"your thumb covers a word on picture 37-a"

And maybe the best one, "That does not look like you" (it was me)

And all while this was going on, withdrawals were locked.
Want to guess if deposits were locked?

And their support is by faaaaar the worst i have ever had to deal with. (And ive talked with support on a bunch of sites)

Slow to answer. Rude. Giving wrong answers ie not knowing their stuff.
One person okaying a document only for the next person to deny it.

Ended up not being able to verify and closed my account.
Atleast they sent my withdrawal before they locked withdrawals for me.
I was under the impression the withdrawal would be sent first after i had managed to verify my account, wich was the only reason i went along with their crazy demands in the first place.

1.5/10 Honeyjars.

Yes Will Hill are good as long as you never have to contact their customer support team, if you do you'll wish you were in another galaxy, far far away! Also verification, it could be easier for us brits as they can use the electoral roll and credit agencies, not sure they're plumbed in so well in sweden to do automated checks.

I bet you had your eye on their DOA/2 slots!.... they've got no Hoff or bride game yet though

 

[Kroffe]

Yes Will Hill are good as long as you never have to contact their customer support team, if you do you'll wish you were in another galaxy, far far away! Also verification, it could be easier for us brits as they can use the electoral roll and credit agencies, not sure they're plumbed in so well in sweden to do automated checks.

I bet you had your eye on their DOA/2 slots!.... they've got no Hoff or bride game yet though

This was some time ago, before the Swedish license.
I think they have aquired one, but have not bothered to visit the site again.

They actually had pretty nice bonuses once in a while, both no-deposit ones, and for depositors.

But as you say, the support was a joke.
Just had me sitting at the computer like:

 

[mack341]

Some of these casinos seem to get paranoid, I remember once quipping to the will hill support that I wish my luck would improve, the lady said nothing to me, but when I attempted to log back in my account was frozen.

My joke was seen as potential evidence of a gambling problem, even though I'd only lost £10 doing 30p spins, they sorted it out quick enough but it made me think they're a queer bunch [old meaning] and could cause needless problems if given half a chance.

In my mad way I thought you could just join the uk website one as your english is as good if not better than many of us natives

 

[Harry_BKK]

so who do you accept a country like Russia in the last 20 years they have over 2000 self-made bilioners before that they had none? all from corruption and organized crime, Cypres made deal with russa if they invest they get citizenship, Cypres economy and tax haven boom in a very short period, malta did same deal in 2016 than malt economy boom in 2016 over 300 casinos got to register on malta with only half million of population, based on media 99% of loundering money when to malta, you can call it as you wish BS,if u dont agree don't need to replay, just stop and think way no one invest on Gibraltar or Islan of man? way malta? way malta had no casinos even 50 casinos online before 2016? but after a deal for free citizenship with Russia to give access to European market 330 casinos open

It is true that some part of iGaming is controlled by Ukrainians (Vulkan/Vulcan), Russians and Georgians (BetConstruct) - won't say any more names - which are connected to dubious circles. The impression is reinforced by the fact that most aggregators offering fake games (Novo, NetEnt, PnG etc) do come from Georgia and Russia.

However, the real mafia tends to stay away from businesses where a clear "paper" or digital trail (which online casinos automatically have) makes it difficult to launder the illegal proceeds. Hence, they focus more on land-based gambling houses, e.g. the vast majority of Spielotheken in Germany is controlled by Ukrainians, some reports say over 90%. You've got 1000s of those spread throughout the country and walking in with illegal cash into one and "lose" it is much easier than laundering it through an online casino.

Where the mafia is setting up an online casino (mostly in former Eastern Bloc countries) it is for one reason only and that is to have a legit appearance. They might even run it perfectly legal and ethical, just to keep the facade intact. VulkanBet Germany is a perfect example.

The vast majority of online casinos registered in Malta are run by Swedes. Why Malta? At the time when the online gaming frenzy took off, it needed an environment with little regulation and low taxes. Hence, Malta was discovered to be on the map of this planet. The Swedes especially liked it because of the weather. Why Swedes? They are gambling-crazy, just like the Finns and Norwegians.

A good part of the MGA operators is listed on the Stockholm Stock Exchange - LeoVegas, NetEnt, etc. I have been reading business reports and watching report presentations for years, but to this day have yet to find even a hint of "mafia" being involved in those companies.

 

[mack341]

It is true that some part of iGaming is controlled by Ukrainians (Vulkan/Vulcan), Russians and Georgians (BetConstruct) - won't say any more names - which are connected to dubious circles. The impression is reinforced by the fact that most aggregators offering fake games (Novo, NetEnt, PnG etc) do come from Georgia and Russia.

However, the real mafia tends to stay away from businesses where a clear "paper" or digital trail (which online casinos automatically have) makes it difficult to launder the illegal proceeds. Hence, they focus more on land-based gambling houses, e.g. the vast majority of Spielotheken in Germany is controlled by Ukrainians, some reports say over 90%. You've got 1000s of those spread throughout the country and walking in with illegal cash into one and "lose" it is much easier than laundering it through an online casino.

Where the mafia is setting up an online casino (mostly in former Eastern Bloc countries) it for one reason only and that is to have a legit appearance. They might even run it perfectly legal and ethical, just to keep the facade intact. VulkanBet Germany is a perfect example.

The vast majority of online casinos registered in Malta are run by Swedes. Why Malta? At the time when the online gaming frenzy took off, it needed an environment with little regulation and low taxes. Hence, Malta was discovered to be on the map of this planet. The Swedes especially liked it because of the weather. Why Swedes? They are gambling-crazy, just like the Finns and Norwegians.

A good part of the MGA operators is listed on the Stockholm Stock Exchange - LeoVegas, NetEnt, etc. I have been reading business reports and watching report presentations for years, but to this day have yet to find even a hint of "mafia" being involved in those companies.

Harry do you have a rough idea how many MGA licensed casinos are out there, a ball park figure?

I don't think those big companies would have any mafia links either

Edit: remember also malta was part of the british empire till the 1960s, so the english language is imbedded there, the laws and systems to some degree, which would attract foreign investors and businesses.

 

[Harry_BKK]

Harry do you have a rough idea how many MGA licensed casinos are out there, a ball park figure?

I don't think those big companies would have any mafia links either

Edit: remember also malta was part of the british empire till the 1960s, so the english language is imbedded there, the laws and systems to some degree, which would attract foreign investors and businesses.

Would say anywhere between 500 - 1000.

 

[mack341]

Right, a figure that large leaves scope, to my mind, for some mafia involvement. As over the years they've been attracted to the gambling industry/businesses like bees to honey, I think you're right though they would tend to be interested in the B&m side for laundering/racketeering...however some dodgy money transaction/ activity must've moved online for govts and regulators to be making such a to-do about it, their number one bete noire.

A bit like financial investors I can see the mafia wanting a mixed portfolio...

 

[Harry_BKK]

Right, a figure that large leaves scope, to my mind, for some mafia involvement. As over the years they've been attracted to the gambling industry/businesses like bees to honey, I think you're right though they would tend to be interested in the B&m side for laundering/racketeering...however some dodgy money transaction/ activity must've moved online for govts and regulators to be making such a to-do about it, their number one bete noire.

A bit like financial investors I can see the mafia wanting a mixed portfolio...

Yeah, sure money will always attract fraudsters.

However, the number of MGA operators is much lower as many have multiple brands under one licence. Many of them are publicly listed, which means they have to follow the laws and regulations of corporate governance and compliance. Very tough to infiltrate.

The more dubious jurisdiction is Cyprus where most Curacao "licensed establishments" are based.

 

[mack341]

Yes that is very true and no doubt as the uk and malta regulators have become stricter, the number of gambling firms based in cyprus and linked to curacao suddenly grows larger

 

[Guntis]

It is true that some part of iGaming is controlled by Ukrainians (Vulkan/Vulcan), Russians and Georgians (BetConstruct) - won't say any more names - which are connected to dubious circles. The impression is reinforced by the fact that most aggregators offering fake games (Novo, NetEnt, PnG etc) do come from Georgia and Russia.

However, the real mafia tends to stay away from businesses where a clear "paper" or digital trail (which online casinos automatically have) makes it difficult to launder the illegal proceeds. Hence, they focus more on land-based gambling houses, e.g. the vast majority of Spielotheken in Germany is controlled by Ukrainians, some reports say over 90%. You've got 1000s of those spread throughout the country and walking in with illegal cash into one and "lose" it is much easier than laundering it through an online casino.

Where the mafia is setting up an online casino (mostly in former Eastern Bloc countries) it is for one reason only and that is to have a legit appearance. They might even run it perfectly legal and ethical, just to keep the facade intact. VulkanBet Germany is a perfect example.

The vast majority of online casinos registered in Malta are run by Swedes. Why Malta? At the time when the online gaming frenzy took off, it needed an environment with little regulation and low taxes. Hence, Malta was discovered to be on the map of this planet. The Swedes especially liked it because of the weather. Why Swedes? They are gambling-crazy, just like the Finns and Norwegians.

A good part of the MGA operators is listed on the Stockholm Stock Exchange - LeoVegas, NetEnt, etc. I have been reading business reports and watching report presentations for years, but to this day have yet to find even a hint of "mafia" being involved in those companies.

There are really lots of Russians and Ukrainians in IGaming including tons of filthy rich affiliates. In Russia and Ukraine, people are super smart with search engine optimization, maths and coding. Popular SEO tools like Hrefs and Semrush is a good example and even better is

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which is originally from Moscow.

Vulkan is actually the name of many dodgy online casinos mainly targeting some of ex-soviet Union countries and Russia itself. There are a couple or few that trying to look legit but, as a rule, rest of them don't pay out winnings they only accept payments...

Hundreds of these on a daily basis getting taken down by Roskomandzor (Federal Service for Supervision of Communications, Informational Technology and Mass Media in Russia).
Actual sites, don't belong to one single owner — anyone digging deeper on Yandex can find places that sell a ready Vulcan casino for as little as $500 with 200 games on it.

Before 2009 when gambling was allowed in Russian there were popular amusement halls called Vulkan (Volcano) and as at that time people were sceptical to gambling online, somebody created a ripoff site to attract gamblers to play online and named it Vulkan...

The same is also Azino777. Beware!

 

[JohnSnow]

The MGA has no issue's giving licenses to operators from Russia or Ukraine when they follow the rules, they are not all scams however Russian and Ukrainian entrepreneurs are as Savage as they come, so I would say that these operaters under MGA are in the grey zone. They will do whatever they can within the rules to make the house advantage bigger.

 

[colinsunderland]

Then to make matters worse, I log-in today to find the dreaded Red Exclamation Mark of Death on my username. Press the 'red' part of the verified list of documents which includes green-ticked for card, SoW etc. and get the ludicrous request of a selfie with me holding an 'undefined' again!

I've just got that too. Want a selfie of me holding my DL. Haven't asked for any SoW documents, but knowing they probably will, and the fact they say they are going to withold withdrawals, means thats me done there.

 

[Slottery]

That selfie+id sounds bit weird in this situation, if understanding (or assuming maybe better word) right,@colinsunderland @dunover you both have had account with them at least some time already?

Usually selfie request is done when casino suspect it's not you who's playing (quite obvious, not many other reasons for that, except you guys might be handsome enough in your ID pictures that they want other one as well ), it's quite late wake up if you have been playing some time already and if there's no any significant changes in behavior, why to ask it now?

@dunover is already SOW verified, and as can be read, they should know you better than most of others after all documents and explanation you had to already provide.

That selfie request itself is probably easiest part if there's SOW to follow, but once again, asking it in this point seems not have much logic behind but more "computer says, ask selfie" in some internal guidelines which often are just followed without thinking too many seconds. It's understandable and in many casino operation tasks works like when you accept documents there are clear guidelines, when approve withdrawals, same again but when you start to complete your EDD (enhanced due diligence) you would enhance your part little bit as well and take much more personalized approach than in accepting pictures of your credit card etc...

We all are so different, also in our source of incomes and current financial situation, it's not that black and white like standard KYC checks, based on what read and hear (also pointed out in this forum), it seems that at least some operators follow too much some certain line in guidelines, like some reps stated here, it's not ok to gamble with credits, sure it's not good to take credit for gambling but then again, take quite many years to play again after paying mortgage or not allowed to play with benefits, is it not ok to play when you automatically receive child benefit etc...?

Lost point once again, these selfie requests seem to be some new trend again, thought that these were past and gone years ago. Gives you some extra piece of verification but if in UK you already have passed electronic verificatin when you open account and then sent your ID+POA, what possibly more you get in most of cases?

 

[dunover]

That selfie+id sounds bit weird in this situation, if understanding (or assuming maybe better word) right,@colinsunderland @dunover you both have had account with them at least some time already?

Usually selfie request is done when casino suspect it's not you who's playing (quite obvious, not many other reasons for that, except you guys might be handsome enough in your ID pictures that they want other one as well ), it's quite late wake up if you have been playing some time already and if there's no any significant changes in behavior, why to ask it now?

@dunover is already SOW verified, and as can be read, they should know you better than most of others after all documents and explanation you had to already provide.

That selfie request itself is probably easiest part if there's SOW to follow, but once again, asking it in this point seems not have much logic behind but more "computer says, ask selfie" in some internal guidelines which often are just followed without thinking too many seconds. It's understandable and in many casino operation tasks works like when you accept documents there are clear guidelines, when approve withdrawals, same again but when you start to complete your EDD (enhanced due diligence) you would enhance your part little bit as well and take much more personalized approach than in accepting pictures of your credit card etc...

We all are so different, also in our source of incomes and current financial situation, it's not that black and white like standard KYC checks, based on what read and hear (also pointed out in this forum), it seems that at least some operators follow too much some certain line in guidelines, like some reps stated here, it's not ok to gamble with credits, sure it's not good to take credit for gambling but then again, take quite many years to play again after paying mortgage or not allowed to play with benefits, is it not ok to play when you automatically receive child benefit etc...?

Lost point once again, these selfie requests seem to be some new trend again, thought that these were past and gone years ago. Gives you some extra piece of verification but if in UK you already have passed electronic verificatin when you open account and then sent your ID+POA, what possibly more you get in most of cases?

This isn't computer generated crap in my case, but a manager personally asking for yet more stuff, but this time relating back to 3 years or more ago. The fact my account is now suspended suggests that they consider me suspicious and therefore until I bend over backwards yet again, they don't have (in their eyes) sufficient proof I could afford my deposits back then. So as it stands, 3 years ago they have taken money off a problem gambler who cannot show they could afford it. This is obviously bollocks, but that's the status of things right now. Maybe I should tell the UKGC lol....

 

[colinsunderland]

Notice my account doesn't actually ask for the selfie, it was live chat who said that, so adding requirements onto what they have already asked for. I had to go to live chat as when I tried to upload my license it kept telling me there was an error as it couldn't detect my camera. Well durrr, I'm on a desktop PC without a camera, and why would I need one to upload a photo from my hard drive. @CasumoLouis That was when they tagged on the selfie request. I'm well past enhanced KYC stage, which I passed long ago as you can see from the screenshots below