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The Captain of The River Belle's Statement

Discussion in 'Online Casino Archive through Dec 2001' started by The Captain, Dec 23, 1999.

  1. The Captain

    The Captain Guest

    Hi to all the forum members

    Apologies for the delay in responding to the queries that arose out of our last posting to the forum. Apologies also that the last posting did not seem to clarify the questions on forum members' minds. This was certainly not the intention of the posting, and hopefully what follows will set the record straight.

    Accordingly, herewith the facts:

    1. The company that owns The River Belle does *not* own any other online casinos.

    2. Technical and related support for The River Belle is handled by an outsourcing company that also handles such support for other online businesses, including other online casinos. This is in common with the approach taken by many other online casinos - for example, probably the majority of Microgaming, Cryptologic, Bossmedia and Starnet licensees all have their technical support outsourced to a variety of outsourcing firms independent from the casino companies that hold the licenses.

    3. The River Belle has grown exponentially over the past few months, and the outsourcing company that it contracts with has struggled to keep up. As a result, service levels have of late been less than satisfactory, largely because a large number of new support agents have been appointed on the support desk with the minimum amount of training and inadequate quality control. The results of this are clearly seen in the contradictory and incorrect responses sometimes (thankfully infrequently) given to players (including members of this forum) when they call or email for help.

    Appropriately strong-worded discussions have been held with the outsourcing company in general and thus in turn with the specific employees concerned. Given the threat of losing The River Belle as a client, they have presented The River Belle with a better formulated plan to set things straight, including beefing up their training and quality control procedures, to the point where quality control will take place in real time rather than after the fact (as is currently the case).

    The River Belle recognizes very firmly that superior customer service, fast payouts, security, honesty and integrity are what players are looking for. The River Belle has over the past 2 years built a solid reputation of delivering on all of these factors, and it is obviously upsetting for all concerned when misunderstandings of this nature occur. As unfortunate as it is, with any fast growing business there will always be customers who receive less than satisfactory service as a result of growing pains, but we obviously hope to minimize this as far as possible.

    Naturally, we feel it is only fair to point out that the vast majority of players at The River Belle are very happy with their experiences at the casino. The River Belle has grown in popularity to the point where it is one of the largest, most credible and most trusted casinos on the internet, and it would not have such a loyal clientele if overall it was not delivering on the factors listed above.

    Millions of Dollars of payouts are processed timeously and without a hitch every month, and big jackpots continue to be won and paid out. For example, the first ever Cash Splash jackpot ($82,789) was won at The River Belle, and the winner was paid at a public ceremony in front of the rest of the online gaming industry and numerous representatives of US and world press. Subsequent winners have been paid with less pomp and ceremony, but paid they have been, usually promptly and always reliably. Thanks to the e-cash facilities of Proc Cyber Services, winners in the USA generally receive their funds by bank transfer in 3 days or less, while players elsewhere in the world receive their checks by FedEx (at no charge for VIP players), generally in under a week regardless of where they are.

    Ultimately, we hope that the members of the forum will agree to bear with us while the outsourcing company sorts things out on its end. In the meantime, The River Belle is committed to doing its best to provide the best gaming experience possible on the internet. Given the postings by the forum members over the past few weeks, we expect that our response will be greeted with some scepticism, but we believe that with time our honesty and integrity will be proven by the ongoing loyalty of our existing and new players.

    Best regards,
    The Captain
    The River Belle
     
  2. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    Dear Captain

    I have been attempting to contact Charl Baard from PRO CYBER for over a week now and I have been lied to and lied to he doesnt even take telephone calls the reason I am contacting him is I want a full refund of ALL my buy-ins less cashin due to
    1. PRO CYBER telling another company namely CYBER FINANCE ALL my credit card details as well as all my account details of casino accounts that use pro cyber THAT INCLUDES YOUR CASINO thats right CYBER FINANCE who PRO CYBER state they dont know knew all my details of the account I have with you lucky nugget gaming club and yellow taxi and PRO CYBER in breach of the UK DATA Protection ACT illegally passed my details on
    2 Microgaming software is flawed the roulette for example does not play correctly (there is no doubthis)
    3 I have been banned from playing at the four casinos mentioned including yours due to me being the victim of this massive breach of trust by your ecash company

    You say you threaten them with closing the account with them and using another company, they would I'm sure be upset andd if they were corrupt ALL your player private details could then be used by this upset company illegally

    Captain hang your head in shame your ecash company is both ignorant and acts illegally sort out my refunds from your casino or do what Charl Baard does ............. nothing


    you want to get your house in order no body wants to play at the Riverbelle, why should they when your ecash company lie BLATENTLY and Illegally pass on Highly confidential information
     
  3. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    just sent him an email lets see how long it takes to answer

    when its your turn to lose the dealer will do whatever it takes to win

    remember Microgaming said DO NOT believe what the support staff say

    so Captain why should we believe you
     
  4. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    Proc Cyber Services
    Delivering the future today!

    Our TOLL FREE telephone numbers are:
    1 800 146 569 - (Australia)
    1 888 515 8518 - (Canada)
    0 800 328 7748 - (United Kingdom)
    1 888 326 2602 - (USA)


    Delivering the future today another lie

    OY GAMING CLUB why you get all gobby when I phone you up in my quest to get through to Charl Baard from PRO CYBER???

    AND PRO CYBER why wont Charl Baard reply I have been phoning him for a week now ??

    Hey Captain why have riverbelle not answered my email

    remember the name PRO CYBER LINKED TO GAMING CLUB AND RIVERBELLE
     
  5. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    The River Belle recognizes very firmly that superior customer service, fast payouts, security, honesty and integrity are what players are looking for.


    If you recognise the fact why dont do act upon it?????
     
  6. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    YAWN YAWN YAWN


    Thank you for your comments .

    Unfortunately there is nothing that we can do for you at this point , you will have to wait for a response from Proc - Cyber Services which will come once they have completed their investigation . Please do understand that this type procedure is not completed over night as the information has to be researched and obtained from various other institutions .

    Please feel free to contact us with any further queries you might have our
    help desk is standing by 24hrs a day and 7 days week to meet our players
    needs.

    Kind regards
    Gary
    E&O.E


    Wait for a response ha thats a laugh

    from various other institutions arrrrrr
    that answers one question doesn't it
     
  7. dave_r

    dave_r Dormant account

    I quote the Pitboss of Caribbean Cyber, a Microgaming licensee that runs the same software as River Belle. The Pitboss attempts to explain standard deviation of the blackjack game, but in doing so, puts his foot in his mouth:

    The Cash Splash software, as well as all our other software, was written by Microgaming Systems. They alone know the algorithms for the software. They are responsible for the odds. They do not differentiate from one player to another. If you are having a string of bad luck, somebody else is having an equal string of good luck, but nobody ever complains about getting too many blackjack hands dealt to them.

    The distribution of the hands is such that the midpoint of a normal curve would represent players who get back $96 for every $100 they bet. Players who lie one point to the right get back $97 for every $100 they bet and players one point to the left get back $95 for every $100 they bet. At some distance further to the right of center, players get $105 for every $100 they bet and players equally far to the left of center get back $87 for every $100 that they bet. This is what mathematically fair means.

    The algorithm does not seem to have any card sense, which is what you are complaining about. If it is your turn to lose, the dealer will get whatever it takes to win. If it is your turn to win, you will win, provided you play reasonably(you won't win if you draw a face card to a 19 point hand).

    Please remember, even though you are not playing against other players, your wins and losses are mathematically determined by the fortunes of other players who are playing against the algorithm. Logically, each hand is dealt from a freshly shuffled deck and therefore always has the same odds of winning or losing. If you play the game poorly, you will lose, but playing the game expertly does not guarantee that you will win.

    If you are experiencing a run of bad luck, the best advice is to quit and come back later. You may move from the left hand side of the curve to the right hand side.

    The algorithm is mathematically fair. The algorithm does not look back at your history and decide whether or not you should receive bad cards because of previous good play. The algorithm is a faceless machine that treats each hand according to overall wins and losses without regard to identity or skill.

    We hope this helps you understand the overall fairness of the game. Please continue to enjoy playing at Caribbean Cyber Online Casino.

    Sincerely,

    Pitboss
     
  8. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    Why are all quieries reffered the a credit card processing merchant??????????

    Surely (presuming PROC CYBER do not have shares in these casinos) any valid queiry should be directed to the owner/licencee for their attention

    I think where you read credit card merchant you should install the word owner instead
     
  9. dave_r

    dave_r Dormant account

    ON MICROGAMING CASINOS BLACKJACK, IF IT IS YOUR TURN TO LOSE, THE DEALER WILL GET WHATEVER IT TAKES TO WIN.

    He clearly states:

    1) Even though you are not playing against other players, your wins and losses are mathematically determined by the fortunes of other players who are playing against the algorithm.

    My interpretation: The game is "tuned" to a 96% overall payout. No matter how good a player you are, or how expert your strategy, you cannot overcome these long term odds. In the short term, your luck is determined by the fate of other players. If, over a short period of time, the overall payout goes below 96%, the game allows you to win more often than normal, to compensate for the other players' ill luck. This may or may NOT give you 100% payback. However, if over a short period of time, the overall blackjack payouts go above 96%, a "take down" mode kicks in, and forces you to lose more often than normal, and the dealer will do whatever it takes to win. If necessary the dealer will get blackjack every other hand.

    2)The algorithm doesn't seem to have any card sense.

    My interpretation: Since your wins/losses are determined by the fortunes of other players, the final outcome of each hand is predetermined. Even if the cards are drawn randomly, the algorithm has decided ahead of time whether your hand will be a win, loss, blackjack, or push. The algorithm will do whatever it takes to make sure the cards allow for the predetermined result. For example if you draw a 5 card 21, but it has been predetermined that you will lose the hand,
    the algorithm will make sure the dealer gets a blackjack. And there's nothing you can do about it.

    3)If it is your turn to win, you will win, provided you play reasonably(you won't win if you draw a face card to a 19 point hand).

    My interpretation: If it has been predetermined that you will win a hand, and you don't play reasonably (i.e. above example), the system makes an exception to the predetermined result and forces you to lose because of your stupidity.

    4) The algorithm is a faceless machine that treats each hand according to overall wins and losses without regard to identity or skill.

    My interpretation: The house has a 4% long term advantage over you no matter what. Regardless of skill level. This means expert play will not yeild you better odds.

    My comments: If you go to Atlantic City or Vegas to a land based casino, and play blackjack with perfect basic strategy, the house has less than a 1% advantage over the player. In fact with most casinos, this advantage is less than 1/2 of 1%. This clearly makes blackjack one of the best games around. However, on Microgaming casinos, the odds are almost as bad as double-0 roulette.

    5)We hope this helps you understand the overall fairness of the game.

    My comments: It has helped me understand. You are an honest guy who tells it like it is. Unfortunately, you work for a casino that wants players to think they are getting the same odds as Vegas, and unfortunately, they're not. Dean from Microgaming wants me to think you are wrong, and have no idea what your talking about, but he has not answered my questions about it, and has disappeared from this forum altogether, without a trace.

    IF IT IS YOUR TURN TO LOSE, THE DEALER WILL GET WHATEVER IT TAKES TO WIN.
     
  10. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    Armed with this info you should contact all microgaming casinos you have played at and demand a full refund but good luck if you contact PROC CYBER as they never reply
     
  11. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    Hit mobs BAN LIFTED

    I have just been informed it was all a misunderstanding and I am no longer banned from any casino

    I also just recieved thru email a happy holidays card from the gaming club


    THE WORLD HAS GONE MAD
     
  12. J Duncan

    J Duncan Guest

    I too am having my problems with Riverbelle & Proc Cyber Services. I cashed in over $3500. three weeks to a month ago. I have yet to see any of the money. I have heard the following excuses: We had a 10 day holiday
    We need documentation. (This was sent to them & was all complete with instructions two days earlier.)
    We sent it on the 6th.
    We sent it on the 13th.
    We sent it on the 20th.
    Your bank has it - they just haven't credited it to your account. (My bank shows no incoming wires.)
    I have been in almost daily contact with Riverbelle & Proc Cyber Services and they keep saying just give us one more day. Proc Cyber Services don't return phone calls, they don't even answer their phone sometimes during what they state their business hours are. They don't answer all of their e-mail and when they do answer it takes a couple of days. I have informed the Riverbelle that I will never come to their casino again, although I like their software the best and have had the most winnings there. I cannot deal with them (or Proc Cyber Services) taking a month to pay me my winnings. THEY DON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEM GETTING THE MONEY OUT OF YOUR ACCOUNT THEY JUST HAVE A PROBLEM GETTING IT BACK IN. SO LET THE BUYER BEWARE. I am new to internet gambling and this is very frightening to me - I am not a rich person and cannot afford to wait a month for my money.
     
  13. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    Hi can I suggest you contact PricewaterhouseCoopers the lady in charge of the microgaming account is called Hannelie her email address can be found in the other part of the forum I suggest this as they will I'm sure be able to contact R/B for you and tell them they are a last resort as R/B are ignoring you
    If this is what is happening
     
  14. JUDY

    JUDY Guest

    SPOKE WITH RIVERBELLE & PROC CYBER SERVICES AGAIN THIS MORNING. TODAYS EXCUSE IS IT WAS PUT IN THE WRONG ACCOUNT - THAT MY BANK HAS THE MONEY, BUT IT IS IN THE WRONG ACCOUNT. I CHECKED WITH MY BANK AND THE NUMBER PROC CYBER SERVICES GAVE ME IS NOT EVEN THEIR ACCOUNT #. (BEAR IN MIND, I FAXED THEM A COPY OF A VOIDED CHECK SO THEY WOULD HAVE ALL THE CORRECT NUMBERS.) NOW THEY SAY THEY CAN'T DO ANYTHING UNTIL TOMORROW. WHERE ON THIS SITE CAN I FIND PRICEWATERHOUSES E-MAIL ADDRESS? I AM REALLY FED UP AND FEEL AS THOUGH I HAVE BEEN RIPPED OFF. JUDY
     
  15. Steve

    Steve Guest

    Another happy microgaming customer for you Dean.
    Money put in the wrong account. UMM I have heard that somewhere before.

    DO NOT GIVE UP JUDY. YOU NEED TO BECOME THEIR BIGGEST PAIN IN THE ASS UNTIL YOU GET PAID.
     
  16. lasvegashitmob

    lasvegashitmob Dormant account

    This email is not visible to you.
     
  17. Judy

    Judy Guest

    Thank you LVHM. I will report my problem to hannelie. Judy
     
  18. Anonymous

    Anonymous Guest

    I must admit, I have tried over 23 different online casinos, and have come to a conclusion that "Pharaoh's Casino" is one of the nicest online casino ever... The graphics on the games are superb, compared to the others which are very basic and dull. One other thing is that their customer service is excellent. I get a response within 24 hours, unlike some others that won't even respond.

    I am very pleased with the services and will definitely continue on playing at their site...
     

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