The CAP Solution

[dominique]

I have started the first of a series of threads for discussion by CAP members at CAP here:

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I am keeping these discussions confined to narrow subject matters and plan to cover quite a number of items over time.

For now, I want to know what our membership would like to see regarding the general certification process, and I want to collect constructive input there.

CAP admin is open to change, taking membership concerns into consideration. I have a feeling this will be a long discussion.

 

[rowmare]

I think that one solution is for Lou and Warren to sell CAP.

Sell it to somebody or some company with a good reputation.

 

[luckydabberbingo]

I have reached the point where I don't care anymore .

 

[mojo]

I have reached the point where I don't care anymore .

I said that too.

Michael Corleone: "Just when I thought I was out...they pull me back in"

Godfather Part III

 

[DiamondGeezer]

I said that too.

Michael Corleone: "Just when I thought I was out...they pull me back in"

Godfather Part III

I always thought that line was invented by a poster on here! I think it was a lady called Babs who used to use it about RTG Slots if I recall.

Have used it a few times too and gave her credit for it . Thanks for putting me right!

 

[lots0]

I have started the first of a series of threads for discussion by CAP members at CAP here:

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

I am keeping these discussions confined to narrow subject matters and plan to cover quite a number of items over time.

For now, I want to know what our membership would like to see regarding the general certification process, and I want to collect constructive input there.

CAP admin is open to change, taking membership concerns into consideration. I have a feeling this will be a long discussion.

Sense I can't post at CAP Dom, I'll give you my opinion here.

(1) Any site that claims to be an "Affiliate Advocate" should not take money/payments from the casinos for any type of certification or seal.

(2) Certified Casinos, should meet requirements that are at least in part set by and/or agreed to by the membership.

(3) All casino certifications should be as open and as public as possible.
**

Come on Dom, you don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out what needs to be done to bring CAP up to some basic "ethical" business standards. All you have to do is look at how other Advocate type organizations handle their certification (CM would be a good place to start).

Of course, if CAP wants to continue to make a profit from the casinos for certification to affiliates, I don't think there is a way in the world that could ever be considered ethical or above board, if they continue to call themselves an advocate type site.

P.S. That goes for the GWPA/APCW as well.

 

[jas2587]

I have started the first of a series of threads for discussion by CAP members at CAP here:

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

I am keeping these discussions confined to narrow subject matters and plan to cover quite a number of items over time.

For now, I want to know what our membership would like to see regarding the general certification process, and I want to collect constructive input there.

CAP admin is open to change, taking membership concerns into consideration. I have a feeling this will be a long discussion.

isn't funny Lou comes back from London an all discussion's have stopped no one is even posting in this thread that he said what are you doin Dom who said you could do this?

odd

Cindy

 

[jinnia]

isn't funny Lou comes back from London an all discussion's have stopped no one is even posting in this thread that he said what are you doin Dom who said you could do this?

odd

Cindy

jas, it isn't 'odd', that's the normal way of thangs there!

 

[The Dude]

...(1) Any site that claims to be an "Affiliate Advocate" should not take money/payments from the casinos for any type of certification or seal...

I don't think CAP, or the GPWA, APCW for that matter, have claimed to be advocates - in other words a spokesperson for the affiliates. In fact, whenever this has been brought up, it has been shot down as "this is what we don't do"...

But yeah, there is a BIG problem when they make claims to having a listing criteria, when there isn't any. Are they trying to act as an affiliate "guardian" with these seals? How often have they been pulled for rogue-like antics?

888.com comes to mind, and then recently Cardspike...

 

[Webzcas]

CardSpike took 4 months but that is well documented.

Another one that got booted is Gambling Wages, but they were welcomed back in 2005. I guess they met the criteria for 'Certification' again and as I type this are still listed on CAP.

If anyone isn't aware of what casinos Gambling Wages Affiliate Program represents here is a run down.

Cirrus Casino
Cool Cat Casino
Club Player Casino
Palace of Chance

Well Cap allows communication with Affiliate Programs doesn't it? Here is one such dialogue with GW - Isn't the Prof helpful, when an affiliate alleges that the only reason GW are certified is because they paid CAP. BTW this particular affiliate had not been paid for 2 months when he made that post. It's an interesting read.

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IMO Gambling Wages alone being on CAP's site blows out of water the claim of a ' Rigorous and Distinguished Process' when it comes to certifying programs. Webmasters who promote GW may need certifying but not the other way round

 

[dominique]

isn't funny Lou comes back from London an all discussion's have stopped no one is even posting in this thread that he said what are you doin Dom who said you could do this?

odd

Cindy

I was working with Warren during Lou's absence but when Lou returned he did not like it.

I have taken a hiatus since.

 

[Sassy1]

I was working with Warren during Lou's absence but when Lou returned he did not like it.

I have taken a hiatus since.

I don't blame you one bit and I admire the fact that you had good intentions and gave it your best shot!

Maybe it was fate and you can use your valuable time and energy for those that appreciate it, or for your own endeavors!

 

[Webzcas]

Yep agree with that. Dom you can hold your head up high.

Meanwhile google is doing it's thing

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[The Dude]

...Meanwhile google is doing it's thing

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Ahhh! You beat out my rogue page!

Can't have that now, can we?! Guess I should be updating it

 

[Webzcas]

You're still ahead on google.com but I am coming up fast

Incidentally I need to update my rogue page to include Grand Prive. Will try and do this, this afternoon.

 

[casinojack]

sad

As a business person, coming form the sportsbook side, we have paid forums for advertising. We open our doors to these forums "mods" coming by, seeing what we do, and looking at players accounts when disputes arise. We have a greed form the to be arbitrators.

Trying to see where I am spending my advertising money this year, is hard. I haven't even launched our casino dedicated sites, and already im being pulled into some of this.

Would be ok for them to just agree, "Hey we here to make money". I'm ok with that. I think affiliates would be also. Let me tell you what we do now, and again, i'm noob aff manager for casino, but based on sportsbook.

One of the forums sells affiliate management software. We rent it monthly, and this is good for everyone. Why ?

Well, software is hosted by this particular forum to keep me honest. I cant "skim" players, or mess around with the stats. They are what they are. The forum makes money to sell me this SW,and affiliates know I'm on the Up and UP

Also, we have an open door policy. you in Costa Rica? Never sent me a player ? Np, come over for the tour.

What about forum complaints ? Lets us face it, noone perfect, but both parties agree to the forum settling it. If the Aff Program does not, bye bye. Simple, Things end, people make money.

Anyways, no more fist fights in London unless I can place odds ;-)

Seriously though, WE need to get back to making money..

 

[greek39]

WE need to get back to making money..

How? When big portions of our industry lacks trust, integrity, transparency, code of ethics etc...

I feel CAP lacks all the above and them some so do others. The roguish behavior gives doubt spawning an higher risk on no return for hard labor.

Strangely enough I spent three years in the trenches trying too bust into this market. No earnings until I felt the urge to hide everything. Only then did things turn around for me.

JMO

greek39

 

[GaryWatson]

How? When big portions of our industry lacks trust, integrity, transparency, code of ethics etc...
greek39

True, if CAP dies, we dont need a vaccum. CAP has its place. It is a money making machine, It has done lots for many affiliates. What we dont need is a rush for an opening.

CAP deals with its own issues. We can chose to obey or not.

My solution is not a CAP solution. I would blacklist them for real reasons like they have blacklisted others for their own motives. We cannot compromise. It might be the same story in 3 years time but not without demorilizing half of the decent people left.

 

[jas2587]

Why can't some one else become the "boss' of the affiliates "boss" might not be the right word but clearly (Lou + warren) are upsetting every one an not doing what they are Paid to do

From what I have read if I had the cash an paid it I could be on top of the list an not have to do a darn thing cept write a check then I am a site to go to
shame I dont have a site
I have always said I am a player I gamble I spend MY cash to play I dont take no bonus unless forced on me

Bryan Simmo Max Spearmeister an Webzcas if I am out of line I am sorry but this is MO

I think I am leaving some 1 out a Moderator an for that I am sorry

Cindy

 

[GaryWatson]

Why can't some one else become the "boss' of the affiliates "boss" might not be the right word but clearly (Lou + warren) are upsetting every one an not doing what they are Paid to do

Cindy, there are a lot of good leaders out there. Boss probably isnt the word, they are generally referred to as mentors, and their job is to guide affiliates. They get paid by performance. If the affiliate does well, so do they.

CAP probably started as mentor to many affiliates but somewhere along the line their motives seem to have changed. Now there seems to be a clash of interests. They no longer seem to support those they are supposed the shepherd and it looks as though they are working with the operators, not a bad thing in itself, but recent actions seem to indicate they are bullying their underlings (and possibly some operators).

 

[lots0]

The solution seems to be working its self out.

Webmasters and Casinos that care about Honesty, Integrity and how our business is perceived by the public are voting with their feet and leaving CAP...

Webmasters across the web are blacklisting CAP on their websites and the results are just now starting to show up in the search results (and CAP's pet blackhat SEO can't do a damn thing about it )

In a very short period of time new webmasters that are looking to become affiliates will be become aware of CAP's standing (or lack thereof) in the Industry, before they get caught up in the shady bullshit that goes on at CAP.

The end is nigh...

 

[casinojack]

Seems Like

We need someone to protect affiliates AND players alike. My sportsbook uses a forum to do this, and we pay to be inspected (that's right, ONSITE inspections) and Ill admit they don't always go my way, BUT I respect the desicons of the mods their, they are truely impartial.

This might be good, to agree to "arbitration", keep everyone level.

PS, to be upfront, I like this too. When we want to stop a player due to chargebacks, fraud etc. I don't blacklist the player on forums, of course, but you would be surprised what players do.

Any rate, CAP, hope you guys get back on track. Was a lot of positive things for a LONG time, sorry it went this way. CM MODS, keep it up

 

[lots0]

...Any rate, CAP, hope you guys get back on track. Was a lot of positive things for a LONG time, sorry it went this way. CM MODS, keep it up

I got to disagree with you.
CAP was NEVER positive for the industry, Lou and Warren just kept most of the nasty smelly CAP dirt hidden till recently.

Best solution... For CasinoAffilaitePrograms.com to fade away into nothingness.

 

[The Dude]

Well, it looks like this thread has run its course. If there are no more "solutions" to CAP, then I guess we should put this issue to rest and close the thread.

Any objections?

 

[maxlevine]

Well, it looks like this thread has run its course. If there are no more "solutions" to CAP, then I guess we should put this issue to rest and close the thread.

Any objections?

Before you close this thread, I have a suggestion.

Considering the loss of trust in the affiliate industry caused by this commotion, why don't you create a new forum in Webmaster's Corner where webmasters and affiliate managers could get together and exch... hold it... ok, never mind.