Terms and Condition Changes - Brightshare (I Sense Something)

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Casinomeister

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Actually, I'm still awaiting word from Roxy Palace to find out exactly what is going on. As you know, I've been pretty much strung out with a number of projects and can only accomplish one thing at a time. And during the past week or so I've been mulling over this.

It's true that Casinomeister is and always has been more player focused than affiliate focused. The bottom line is that I will not tell affiliates how to run their business - I can give them guidance and recommendations, but affiliates need to be able to make those decisions on their own. I provide a platform for affiliates to share their views to enable informed and rational decisions. This is one of the main purposes of a forum such as this.

The accred section lists casinos for the players' benefit - Roxy Palace and Brightshare are still listed there because I have not one unresolved or pearshaped player complaint. And most everyone here would have to agree that both of these casino groups have an outstanding record when it comes to their player relations.

How many affiliates are aware that Casinomeister includes an Affiliate Section where I recommend affiliate programs? It's been there for years:
http://www.casinomeister.com/affiliate.php

Both Roxy Affiliates and Brightshare were removed from this last week.

Webzcas and a number of affiliates would like to see me rogue these two programs - but I'll make a move when the time comes. Like I mentioned already, I'm waiting word from Roxy Affiliates.

And it's entirely unfair to give Webzcas any stick for being a moderator here - in fact that's downright self-serving and juvenile. Webzcas is not here parroting my decisions and policies. He is permitted to express his own views even when they don't concur 100% with mine.
 

Dave

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Actually, I'm still awaiting word from Roxy Palace to find out exactly what is going on.
The non-sugarcoated version is that they are closing 10-year old accounts because they don't want to pay the residual income anymore. (In case they don't put it in as many words.) :D

The accred section lists casinos for the players' benefit - Roxy Palace and Brightshare are still listed there because I have not one unresolved or pearshaped player complaint. And most everyone here would have to agree that both of these casino groups have an outstanding record when it comes to their player relations.
That may be true, but so did Grand Prive, for the most part.... Yet, "If they are willing to do this with their business partners, how do you think they plan on treating their players?" (http://www.casinomeister.com/rogue/grandprive.php -- still a good read.) :thumbsup:


On http://www.casinomeister.com/affiliate.php, can I suggest you add a link to AGD? I see links to CAP and GPWA, but none to AGD.

Some of the recommended affiliate programs at CAP and GPWA have a history of treating players poorly. However, at AGD, if an affiliate program has casinos that are listed as rogue here at Casinomeister, it is impossible for the affiliate program to become certified at AGD. We believe affiliates should not promote rogue casinos, and we also believe that if a company is unfair with players, they will be unfair with affiliates as well. (And vice versa, of course.)

Also, when I hover over "CAP" and "GPWA" on the forum, I see the full name pop up; it would be cool if you could add AGD (Affiliate Guard Dog) to wherever that magic is coming from.

I'll make a move when the time comes. Like I mentioned already, I'm waiting word from Roxy Affiliates.
Fair enough; I hope they don't drag it out too much longer. :)
 

Casinomeister

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The non-sugarcoated version is that they are closing 10-year old accounts because they don't want to pay the residual income anymore. (In case they don't put it in as many words.) :D
I've been told today that Maggie is back in, so I'm anticipating that we will be hearing from her soon. Hopefully all of this will be addressed and that there will be an agreeable fair outcome for everyone involved.

That may be true, but so did Grand Prive, for the most part.... Yet, "If they are willing to do this with their business partners, how do you think they plan on treating their players?" (http://www.casinomeister.com/rogue/grandprive.php -- still a good read.) :thumbsup:
GP was a really messed up group that was already in and out of the rogue pit. But yes, I stand by my words.

On http://www.casinomeister.com/affiliate.php, can I suggest you add a link to AGD? I see links to CAP and GPWA, but none to AGD.
On the "to do" list.

Some of the recommended affiliate programs at CAP and GPWA have a history of treating players poorly. However, at AGD, if an affiliate program has casinos that are listed as rogue here at Casinomeister, it is impossible for the affiliate program to become certified at AGD. We believe affiliates should not promote rogue casinos, and we also believe that if a company is unfair with players, they will be unfair with affiliates as well. (And vice versa, of course.)
Point taken. Noted and appreciated.
Also, when I hover over "CAP" and "GPWA" on the forum, I see the full name pop up; it would be cool if you could add AGD (Affiliate Guard Dog) to wherever that magic is coming from.
Done. :D
 

bonustreak

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Nice job!!! I am sure Roxy will not be making any changes & thanks for going out of your way to attend to these issues I know your very busy at the moment!
 

Webzcas

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As it is the start of another week and as Roxy have so far failed to address this thread, something at least Brightshare have done, although IMO confirming predatory changes to terms moving forward, I am bumping this thread.
 

Webzcas

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This thread was started on 1st May. Despite both the Roxy and Roxy Affiliates forum accounts here having both read this thread, still a wall of silence.

They also have not responded to my email sent at the end of April. If anyone is working with Roxy Affiliates still, I would seriously reconsider. As it is obvious, they cannot even be bothered to have a dialogue with their partners.

Furthermore, just this morning, I am hearing more reports of affiliate accounts being shut down by Roxy Affiliates.

At this rate, Roxy Affiliates are going to be soon rivaling Wagershare as having one of the worst Microgaming Affiliate programs going and that in itself would be some achievement.
 

Dave

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Where the heck is Maggie?

Maggie, can you explain why you are breaching your own T&Cs and stealing affiliate commissions? We need answers.
 

Webzcas

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Where the heck is Maggie?

Maggie, can you explain why you are breaching your own T&Cs and stealing affiliate commissions? We need answers.
No idea Dave. But both the Roxy and RoxyAffiliates forum accounts here on CM have visited this thread, in the case of Roxy, several times.

27 days later and no response. As for Brightshare, other than their glib mass post on all forums, nothing other than talk to the hand or email your AM, they too are not addressing the concerns affiliates have.

The changes Brightshare have made to their original T & C's rolled out on the 1st May are not good enough and I don't know how any webmaster can be happy with them.

Not good enough. Both programs are rogue as anything IMO. Both programs are also following Wagershare in not discussing any issues in the forums.
 

Casinomeister

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Yes, I believe Maggie will be making a statement soon concerning all of this. I've been in touch with her this week - and possibly my being overwhelmed with work at the moment delayed things a bit since she was waiting for my feedback. Sorry. Hopefully they will be prepared deal with this first thing come Monday.
 

Dave

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I don't understand why this is taking so long. Monday has come and gone in the UK, and we still have no progress.

Simply put: Roxy Affiliates needs to reopen all of the accounts they have closed, or they need to negotiate a buyout with each affiliate who they no longer want to make monthly payments to.
 

Casinomeister

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Just to let you know, I'm the hold up. Maggie wrote me today about their statement and I haven't had the chance to get back to her yet. If you guys want to rag on anyone, it should be me. :p
 

Webzcas

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Statement made by Roxy Affiliates over on the GPWA yesterday. They still haven't even bothered to post in this thread, hence I am copying and pasting it here:

Firstly Roxy Affiliates would like to offer an apology to all affiliates and parties involved, for the delay in posting an official response on the forum.

In light of the recent postings, we have carefully reviewed the comments and input we received from our partners, and based on this, we would like to make a general statement which we hope will serve as a just and fair approach to the concerns raised by some affiliates reading or posting in this forum. As you will see in the conclusion of this statement, we are actively reviewing and reopening accounts as more fully explained below.

Roxy Affiliates is a well-established programme with over 10 years’ experience, operating as a trusted and fair partner with many affiliates in various markets. We are eCogra certified, having undergone an extensive audit of our programme, and we take pride in the relationships that we have fostered over the years and we are devoted to maintaining these partnerships.

The online gaming industry has undergone massive changes in the past couple of years, with most of Europe heading towards regulation, meaning additional costs are incurred by operators, not only in terms of gaming tax, but also overheads and costs applicable to acquiring licences in markets we wish to pursue. As a result, more and more markets now operate with very different margins, which subsequently have had an effect on affiliates as well as operators.

We have invested over one million Euro in securing licences in two regulated markets, Italy and Denmark, meaning we are taking a long term view in these markets which we will continue to operate in indefinitely. This is a great opportunity for affiliates to secure long term revenue streams.

That said, the changes in the industry have forced us to make some key changes in terms of how we operate.

One key change involved updating our terms and conditions which took place in Oct 2012, and we would like to stress that these new terms have not been applied retroactively to any affiliate who has not agreed to the new terms.
Another more recent development has been the closure of some affiliate accounts, which we understand is, and has been the main cause of concern to affiliates.

We would like to clarify our reasoning for closing some of these accounts, and the terms applied in these instances:

• Accounts sold to third party operators – clause 7.3 clearly states you cannot transfer the ownership of an affiliate account

Inactive accounts - clause 1.1 and 4.1 state that affiliates “…are responsible for promoting the merchant..” and “..are responsible for directing customers to the site..”. Clause 10.1 refers to the fact that the agreement “…will be continuous unless either party terminates the agreement”.

The above mentioned clauses were applied to a variety of affiliates who had stopped promoting our brands, and who had failed to bring in any new players in the space of the past 12-18 months.

We highly value our long-standing reputation amongst the affiliate community and our relationship with reputable organisations such as GPWA, AGD and Casinomeister.
As such, the Roxy Affiliates Management team would like to apologise for any upset caused and would like to reassure affiliates that we are actively reviewing and reopening accounts based on your feedback.

We have made the decision to reopen affiliate accounts marked as closed due to inactivity as long as the accounts have not been abandoned or sold. We consider an account abandoned only if our repeated attempts to communicate with the affiliate have failed. If we are able to reconnect with an affiliate whose account was thought to have been abandoned, then we will also reopen the account.

Please contact your dedicated account manager, should you wish to discuss this in more detail or for further clarification.
I have boldened a couple of parts of the above statement which I would like to address as an affiliate and a partner of Roxy Affiliates for some 8 + years.

  • eCOGRA should not be dishing out 'Affiliate Trust' seals to Affiliate Programs. It is worthless and means nothing. If anything eCOGRA should have backed out of the affiliate side after the Grand Prive audit fiasco.
  • Affiliate accounts do not cost anything to maintain, FULL STOP! If an affiliate has an active historical player base that is still earning Roxy money, then the affiliate should be paid. Closing their accounts means Roxy Affiliates are cutting their costs, by not having to pay the affiliate, meaning in layman terms that Roxy are actually 'stealing' monies from the affiliate that referred those players
  • Lastly, the lovely FU Quota clause. A tactic many programs such as Wagershare implement at management discretion. This is bullshit I am afraid and your program deserves to be avoided by all affiliates. Especially those that only do this on a part time basis and do not have the player throughput the larger affiliates have.
 

Casinomeister

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They posted in a new thread because this thread was focused on Brightshare in the beginning. Roxy should have their own thread to keep things on track.
 

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