SlotsMillion SOW (Extrodinarily In-Depth) Request

slotter999

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Oct 22, 2013
Location
UK
I always thought we germans are the biggest bureaucrats and the world champions of making things as complicated and undworldly as possible.

But after reading all the stuff about the ukgc in the last years i get the feeling you brits want to take that title. But wait until some politicans come up with the idea to make a GGC. We will take that title back :p

It's the casinos interpretation of those rules and not necessarily the rules themselves. Basically casinos were found in some extreme cases to be taking hundreds of thousands of pounds from people who had actually stolen / embezzled the money.

This is what triggered this. They are not interested in people depositing 1K a month.

@zonalkman - would it be too personal to ask what sums triggered this set of events?
 

zonalkman

Full Member
webby
CAG
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Mar 9, 2018
Location
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It's the casinos interpretation of those rules and not necessarily the rules themselves. Basically casinos were found in some extreme cases to be taking hundreds of thousands of pounds from people who had actually stolen / embezzled the money.

This is what triggered this. They are not interested in people depositing 1K a month.

@zonalkman - would it be too personal to ask what sums triggered this set of events?

My gameplay didn't change in the slighest. I spend, on average, about £1,000/week - which I budget for, and can afford to lose (of course winning is nice :) ) - but there was nothing out of the ordinary. It was just a few £100 deposits, as normal. The customer service rep I spoke to earlier did mention today is the first day they've started doing it, so who knows whether it'll roll out to the majority of players or not
 

colinsunderland

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View attachment 90336

In case you were wondering what SM accept

What a load of rubbish, that looks like they have copied and pasted the list from videoslots ridiculous list of acceptable proof.

@Charlotte where paypal payments go to has nothing to do with you, and from what the OP states in the first post, then you are going well over the top in your requests. I can get a mortgage with less information than you want.

I have money in my account from my mams estate, she died 7 years ago, do you really think I have the probate documents now? I also have money in my account from a house sale over 10 years ago, I don't have any proof of that, will you pay for people's solicitors appointments and letters that you are requesting?

Are these source of wealth requests being requested under the anti money laundering laws or responsible gaming rules?
 

goatwack

Get dunked, big buns!
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
The rules are so vague that these requests could be for either Responsible Gambling or Anti Money Laundering. In fact it seems no one knows for sure anymore and they've merged into the same thing :rolleyes:
 

slotter999

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Oct 22, 2013
Location
UK
They still have to pay you, just when is the question, with RG it should be straight away and close your account if you don't give them the details.

What they are meant to do and what will actually happen are very different things. I would say it's highly likely sooner or later we hear of a case of winnings being withheld for SOW reasons. And once it starts they'll keep coming. Can I get all wise and say...."mark my words"....:mad:
 

zonalkman

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Except that is specifically not allowed ;) which is why its always a good idea to ask the reason why its being requested.

The message I get when I log into my account, is:

" In order to comply with Anti Money-Laundering directives, we have to verify the source of the funds you used to deposit on our casino. This is a standard procedure, during which your account will be paused (no deposit or gaming allowed) until you provide the required proof of source of funds."
 

goatwack

Get dunked, big buns!
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
Except that is specifically not allowed ;) which is why its always a good idea to ask the reason why its being requested.
Well....

It'd be even worse if they gave the reason. Providing proof of income sorry 'Source of Wealth' could be used as a pretext for either checking if I can afford to gamble based on my finances, or used to detect anything fishy in regards to activities in my bank account.

Problem with singling out either reason for a request would entail that I have a secret gambling problem that they can moderate, or that I'm using their casino to wash money. It's all a little bit accusatory :cool:
 

colinsunderland

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Location
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The message I get when I log into my account, is:

" In order to comply with Anti Money-Laundering directives, we have to verify the source of the funds you used to deposit on our casino. This is a standard procedure, during which your account will be paused (no deposit or gaming allowed) until you provide the required proof of source of funds."

In which case they MUST have classed you as being at a high risk of being involved in criminal activity :(
They aren't allowed to blanket request these from people.
 

zonalkman

Full Member
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In which case they MUST have classed you as being at a high risk of being involved in criminal activity :(
They aren't allowed to blanket request these from people.

I mean, I added a new card about a week ago, although it was verified, and had a withdrawal of 1k paid no probs - so not really sure what I did wrong. From what Charlotte, and the other live chat people said today though, it sounded like quite a few accounts were going through it too - although that could just be a stall tactic to delay processing the doc while the old bill prepare for the raid! :)

Jokes aside, Charlotte has said she's on the case, and it looks to be heading in a positive direction, so will update this tomorrow morning!
 

bebo67

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PABnonaccred
MM
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Jun 22, 2013
Location
Ontario Canada
So this morning (after a long night of playing, and losing no doubt :) ) I logged into my account to see a red banner, stating that - money laundering regulations etc etc - I needed to provide proof of where my income comes from etc.

I have complete faith in SlotsMillion - have played there for many months without any issues (and when there are problems they're dealt with incredibly quickly and professionaly) - but after today I seriously contemplate whether I'll be playing there again.

So, saw the SOW request - went straight onto Live Chat and explained, I work for myself - I'm self-employed, but haven't been for all that long, so I don't have years of tax returns, etc to show them. (I am also a sole trader so no chance of showing dividend payments, as I don't operate under a Limited Company.)

I explained that my income is generally paid into my bank account, and my PayPal. I'm essentially a freelancer - so the date of payments, or amount, is virtually impossible to predict. Once week I may recieve payment from one client, the next, it could be 4 or 5.

Explained all of this, and they were OK with it, said to send over a Bank Statement, and screengrabs of my PayPal stats (payments in, out etc.)

I was then informed the Bank statement wasn't accepted, because "it doesn't justify the money I spend". Not entirely sure what they mean here, but fair enough. Went back to chat, told them this was exactly WHY I got in touch before submitting anything, because I needed to explain that I'm not just getting a payslip each month.

So I then provided them 3 months worth of PayPal transactions (and this is already way more information than I feel comfortable to give out)

Well, one person from the finance department said PayPal docs are fine - another said they don't accept them, because "we don't accept it as a payment method at our site."

And long story short, I've spent just over 6 hours on live chat waiting for replies, getting contradictory guidance - and an hour or so ago it turns out the PayPal statement WAS accepted (but only as a method of showing my SOW.)

It was, again rejected, because:

"I just received an reply from the finance department ans ad we know you have withdrawals at Paypal account, we don't know where the withdrawals go and this information is required.

We also need to know what is the income for you (for example monthly), just to know if it matches with the account.

If you show your income of for example March and April and it matches, please provide us all details possible."


So, what the hell do they want from me? I've already shown them every single client who's paid me. Which is, already IMO far above what I should be obligated to share. Now, they presumably want to match every payment I recieved on PayPal, with every withdrawal I made from PayPal, to my bank account - and HOPE that my deposits at the casino match up?

I completely understand they are being cautious. I get that. But I wasn't even alerted of the SOW thing, it was by chance when I logged in - and they even asked me to show them contracts and conversations I've signed/had with clients, showing I have a regular income!

Is this me being OTT or is this frankly ridiclous, as I believe it is.

I have nothing but respect for the whole SlotsMillion team, and think they are such a stand-up casino, I play nowhere else - but this has made me lose so much faith in them, along with 6, almost 6 1/2 hours of non-stop chat, email, etc - to no resolve!
Contracts should NEVER be used as proof of anything outside of court. They have secondary names and signatures on them.
 

colinsunderland

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MM
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Location
uk
Contracts should NEVER be used as proof of anything outside of court. They have secondary names and signatures on them.

Completely agree, and this is something I have a major issue with under AML's. I wouldn't be happy if I found out a business I was dealing with, was passing details of my payments to some unrelated third party offshore casino without my permission. In fact I am sure it would be a breach of the contract. Thats the reason I've said I will not supply any casino with SOW requests. Especially being an affiliate, thats telling competitors how much business you are sending to other programs. One of the casinos I spoke to has it specifically in the contract that payment information must not be shared with third parties, when I pointed that out to them, they said they were having a meeting on what I have brought up and would come back to me in 2-3 days, that was around 4 months ago and I'm still waiting. I have told 3 outright they aren't getting it, so if they ask they can go and sing for it.
 

bebo67

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Jun 22, 2013
Location
Ontario Canada
Completely agree, and this is something I have a major issue with under AML's. I wouldn't be happy if I found out a business I was dealing with, was passing details of my payments to some unrelated third party offshore casino without my permission. In fact I am sure it would be a breach of the contract. Thats the reason I've said I will not supply any casino with SOW requests. Especially being an affiliate, thats telling competitors how much business you are sending to other programs. One of the casinos I spoke to has it specifically in the contract that payment information must not be shared with third parties, when I pointed that out to them, they said they were having a meeting on what I have brought up and would come back to me in 2-3 days, that was around 4 months ago and I'm still waiting. I have told 3 outright they aren't getting it, so if they ask they can go and sing for it.
I deal with contracts a few times a month, and trust me it's a good way to get sued. Not that I have ever breached one.
 

Charlotte

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Joined
May 24, 2017
Location
Barcelona
Thank you for your patience and your cooperation in this. The process was clearly stressing and time consuming for you and once again I apologize. We already debriefed it with the agents of both Fraud and CS departments and we'll make the process a bit smoother from there - I already took note that the email communication is not the most appropriate so we'll adapt that.

Regarding all the posts of this thread, I'm sorry I won't be able to reply anytime soon, I will post an answer and some explanations and documentation next week to hopefully clarify a little bit the duty we have as a casino operator, our obligations and the policy we decided to apply to enforce the AML directive as well as why etc. Which might or might not lead to further discussion.

Regards
 
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