Slots that cap winnings below their potential

VismundCygnus

Full Member
Joined
Feb 14, 2018
Location
London
This has been bubbling a lot lately and I think its a devious enough phenomenon to deserve it's own thread.
Basically a lot of slots recently are coming out with a caveat in the rules basically saying that even though you get a massive win in the game, it will only be partially paid out due to a win cap that is applied on top of any winnings.

As an example this post from @Harry_BKK (who was too busy to create this thread) highlights such a case from a Realistic slot called Super Graphics - Lucky Cats.

Didn't know where to stick this and was too lazy to start a new thread. Came across it today while going through the latest demo links.

The first time I saw such a low value. Max win in the base game or free spins is 500x bet, the rest gets cancelled. :what:

The top pay in the base game is also 500x bet for a 5OAK wilds. The free spins can have a multiplier x9 and higher, yet you would only get the 500x bet and the rest gets cancelled.

How does that affect the RTP is my question? Not to forget, that the limit is atrociously low.

The slot is from Realistic Gaming.

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I personally think this is pretty garbage, as there are always ways to design the game/allowed stakes to avoid having such an artificial cap.
 

snorky510238

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Jan 12, 2018
Location
Uk
Stop playing. Send out a clear message. That's how you hurt them.
The problem is I would imagine an extremely high number of players never read the game rules in full. They just see win 10,000x your stake and press spin (myself included sometimes).
 

4048

Experienced Member
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Jul 20, 2017
Location
Malta
The worst examples I've seen is the Norwegian slot monopoly, where the games have a 1000kr (roughly 100€) max win on any one spin.

If you're playing 10kr bets (1€) and trigger a bonus on a spin where you also win 980kr (98€) you can only win another 20kr in the freespin rounds.
 

Harry_BKK

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I don't think that limiting to something like 10,000x bet would be a problem as the win might happen once in 1:1 billion spins. The limit of 500x bet is just ridiculously low on Realistic Games. :(

However, what I find really infuriating are the likes of Blueprint who allow bets of $100 on a slot with a win potential of up to 10,000x bet, yet limit the max payout to $250,000, which in the case of a $100 bet is only 2,500x bet. :(

E.g. Blueprint's Wolf Legend Megaways - max win 50,000x bet, max bet $10, win limit $250,000 --> so in essence it is only max 25,000x bet

They happily take big bets (more money for them) but refuse to pay out in the case one is super lucky to win. Bet sizes should always be limited so the potential max payout in credits will never be exceeded.
 

CasinoNinja

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Apr 27, 2017
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Alot of the time it's the casino that has it in their terms you can only win £250.000 in one spin, so if you are a highroller I would avoid those sites.

But I fully agree, it sucks.

There is a clock one where the max win is 250x I believe too, to make it worse.

I always disliked that jolerpro for instance takes whatever you won over the 1000x, if you had a decent setup of jokers beforehand you got the wildline it could have been a few hundred
 

dunover

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This has been bubbling a lot lately and I think its a devious enough phenomenon to deserve it's own thread.
Basically a lot of slots recently are coming out with a caveat in the rules basically saying that even though you get a massive win in the game, it will only be partially paid out due to a win cap that is applied on top of any winnings.

As an example this post from @Harry_BKK (who was too busy to create this thread) highlights such a case from a Realistic slot called Super Graphics - Lucky Cats.


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I personally think this is pretty garbage, as there are always ways to design the game/allowed stakes to avoid having such an artificial cap.

All Realistics have this cap, every last one of them. Always have, they work like RTG's which do the same but a higher x stake threshold.
 

VismundCygnus

Full Member
Joined
Feb 14, 2018
Location
London
Alot of the time it's the casino that has it in their terms you can only win £250.000 in one spin, so if you are a highroller I would avoid those sites.

But I fully agree, it sucks.

There is a clock one where the max win is 250x I believe too, to make it worse.

I always disliked that jolerpro for instance takes whatever you won over the 1000x, if you had a decent setup of jokers beforehand you got the wildline it could have been a few hundred

Don't like that either, but the hypocrisy of "taking big spins but not paying out big wins" is a bit alleviated by the cap not being related to betsize at least. In this instance, if the game had said "FREESPINS; 1000x max" as you trigger it, or something to that effect, I would think it was fair enough.
 

VismundCygnus

Full Member
Joined
Feb 14, 2018
Location
London
All Realistics have this cap, every last one of them. Always have, they work like RTG's which do the same but a higher x stake threshold.
Thanks, didn't know that. Are there other providers that do this frequently? I know Bet365 "inhouse" games have a lot of it.
 

nikantw

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Jan 28, 2011
Location
EU
I don't think that limiting to something like 10,000x bet would be a problem as the win might happen once in 1:1 billion spins. The limit of 500x bet is just ridiculously low on Realistic Games. :(

However, what I find really infuriating are the likes of Blueprint who allow bets of $100 on a slot with a win potential of up to 10,000x bet, yet limit the max payout to $250,000, which in the case of a $100 bet is only 2,500x bet. :(

E.g. Blueprint's Wolf Legend Megaways - max win 50,000x bet, max bet $10, win limit $250,000 --> so in essence it is only max 25,000x bet

They happily take big bets (more money for them) but refuse to pay out in the case one is super lucky to win. Bet sizes should always be limited so the potential max payout in credits will never be exceeded.

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
 

trancemonkey

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Joined
Mar 29, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
It's a really shit, really bad way of limiting max liability of payout and smacks of very lazy maths design. Why even design a game with a range of pays if all the good stuff is capped....ridiculous.

Not illegal, as they've told you and the RTP will have to take this in to account. But mindbogglingly stupid.
 

Bloatgoat

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limiting max liability

You know starting casino's need this, as they would be put out of business when one particular player would be betting 50 a spin and get a 1500x win.

There where a few other players here on this forum, betting 20 on book of dead, getting a full screen over 100k of wins, boom, account closed. Same liability you talk about.

I hate online casino's, with their well crafted TOS, the hidden shit and tricks they pull on players. It's like hotel california, you can check out any time you like, but you can never leave.
 

zreb

Experienced Member
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Sep 21, 2013
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currently in US
All Realistics have this cap, every last one of them. Always have, they work like RTG's which do the same but a higher x stake threshold.

Well, with most RTG slots I think you just lose that RTP, there was some guy from real series slots on the forum years ago that said the only slot they boosted to account for that was triple twister. It's possible things have changed since then but I wouldn't be sure. That's why a few RTG slots I would avoid playing on max lines, just in case that big win showed up (as if...)

With a cap as low as 500x, you'd really hope they factor that into the RTP calculations or the player is getting screwed.

It's a really shit, really bad way of limiting max liability of payout and smacks of very lazy maths design. Why even design a game with a range of pays if all the good stuff is capped....ridiculous.

Not illegal, as they've told you and the RTP will have to take this in to account. But mindbogglingly stupid.

Are they hands on in the UK or other regulated markets in that the regulator themselves ensures that the games meet RTP standards or is it left up to the developers? This seems like the sort of thing that could slip through by mistake (or by "mistake") - that the slot provider fails to account for big wins getting cut short in the game's RTP - but I'm happy to hear if they're competent enough over there to ensure it doesn't.
 

VismundCygnus

Full Member
Joined
Feb 14, 2018
Location
London
It's also a bit unfair to developers that don't use this, as a x100 multiplier can easily be put in here and there if it wont cost more than 500x and never the 10000x (let's say) implied.
 

trancemonkey

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Joined
Mar 29, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
Well, with most RTG slots I think you just lose that RTP, there was some guy from real series slots on the forum years ago that said the only slot they boosted to account for that was triple twister. It's possible things have changed since then but I wouldn't be sure. That's why a few RTG slots I would avoid playing on max lines, just in case that big win showed up (as if...)

With a cap as low as 500x, you'd really hope they factor that into the RTP calculations or the player is getting screwed.



Are they hands on in the UK or other regulated markets in that the regulator themselves ensures that the games meet RTP standards or is it left up to the developers? This seems like the sort of thing that could slip through by mistake (or by "mistake") - that the slot provider fails to account for big wins getting cut short in the game's RTP - but I'm happy to hear if they're competent enough over there to ensure it doesn't.

Games are tested by companies such as GLI, BMM, Ecogra, etc
 

goatwack

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Aug 29, 2012
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It's a little-known fact that if you get GLI, BMM & Ecogra it actually makes

'Gamble Cog Rim'

Make of that what you will :eek2:
 
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