Slots are changing...

deadoralive23

Registered
Joined
Nov 21, 2014
Location
uk
Here's my issue.
Been playing slots for years but it's just starting to get ridiculous now.

Its disgusting how they can totally change the way it plays(and pays) from Release Date to 1 month (sometimes 1 week) later.

They now seem to have some sort of monthly adjustments where more players will win during a certain period (usually around Christmas times).

Obviously you will always have winners everyday but the ratio is widening, if 10 players make a £25 deposit I would be surprised if more than 1 managed to cash out whereas it should be 1 in 4.2 or something like that, bit like a scratchcard.

I know a lot of experienced players are starting to quit / making a stand, but when 1 regular quits 100 new players start. These slots are just robbing people left right and centre, I for one will be quitting online slots.
Its all rigged, last spin wins, 2 scatters, that symbol that needed to drop down 1 space to make a big win, the glitchy spin that gives you a feature but pays shit money, I wont miss it, I will miss the big wins and exciting features but they are too far and few, once I've made a deposit I can actually count how many bonuses I received once my money has gone.

Also what have they done to Dead or Alive and Gonzo's quest, no longer old school now that they have been coated with a shiny/shifty new look.

I feel sorry for the new players who win on their first attempt thinking they are lucky lol, you've been sucked in buddy.
 

goatwack

Get dunked, big buns!
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
Yup, like you said, it doesn't really matter what we think. Seasoned players are being told it's all in their heads, slots play the same as always etc, but at what point do you say 'enough is enough'?

I don't need scripted, copy & paste industry answers to see how the games behave. My balance will be the judge of that, thanks! :cool:

The fact is we're told the same shit over and over so that we keep pumping money into the games. Those that wise up/ see it for what it is, don't matter....

Gamblers are disposable. For every one that quits or cuts back, there's another 50 to take their place. Companies have realized this and decided that this is the way to go unfortunately.....it's no more about providing a pleasing or fair product, but rather, maximizing profits above everything else.

Their greed recently is breathtaking :mad::cool:
 

trancemonkey

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Mar 29, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
I'm not getting involved again... Your minds are not for changing so I'll leave this thread well alone :)

If you honestly think it though... Please do yourself a favour and stop playing...
 

deadoralive23

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Nov 21, 2014
Location
uk
The fact is we're told the same shit over and over so that we keep pumping money into the games. Those that wise up/ see it for what it is, don't matter....

Gamblers are disposable. For every one that quits or cuts back, there's another 50 to take their place. Companies have realized this and decided that this is the way to go unfortunately.....it's no more about providing a pleasing or fair product, but rather, maximizing profits above everything else

That right there is the reason they will never change, we are disposable, we are like lighters without a refill cap, the younger/newer player will win more often, it is the most obvious and profitable way.
They say slots can't be fixed, haha, they can put a man on the moon I'm pretty sure they can fix a computer generated game.

I just want to know what they are spending all our money on!
 

TheAddict

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Joined
Jan 9, 2013
Location
Kent
Doa plays like turd. I had 3 lots of 5 extra spins last night, 2 paying 90x ish. The other a little over 3000x.
Ud be suprised how long a lighter can be stretched out when u combine it with an equally depleated lighter.
Im off down the corner shop when that 300 withdrawal hits, 1 in 4.2 you say? 71 lots of Winnings! Thank ya later!
 

goatwack

Get dunked, big buns!
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
I'm not getting involved again... Your minds are not for changing so I'll leave this thread well alone :)

If you honestly think it though... Please do yourself a favour and stop playing...

Well it seems it has to be your opinion and everyone else's isn't worth a dime. How about differing opinions on the same subject matter based on years of play? Or are you the Slot Oracle?

I don't need to hear your sermonizing about what I can or can't do either, thankyou. I've already abstained from slotting for the best part of a month (not that it's any of your concern) and am entitled to offer my outlook on how games have noticeably changed.

Thanks again :cool:
 

Jono777

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CAG
mm1
mm4
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May 13, 2014
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Wolverhampton
Swell head time :oops: :oops:

I predicted about 18 months ago that more and more players would notice and more and more threads like these would start to crop up. Reason being slots have changed - fact!

Taking nothing away from those who say nothing has changed but have to ask, why are players saying this then (the more experienced among us)

There is no point posting for the sake of posting none factual events.

Fact is that if we see these changes with our own eyes and then industry experts say nothing has changed then there is no (and never will be ;) ) proof either way, we will simply continue round in circles.

Best advice has already been given that if the strength of these feelings gets too high, together with sessions which are no longer enjoyable time after time then its time to call it a day - something I will do with ease if ever that time comes.

For now, I'll stick to "They've changed but are still fair(ish)"
 

lockinlove

Staring into the sun
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Joined
Jan 17, 2014
Location
Canada
I will say it again, Microgaming is the biggest offender out of all them without question. Those new slots, all of them.. there is no way they are 96% rtp. Absolutely zero chance and no one on this earth will convince me otherwise. And yes since I think that I shouldnt play them right. Well I dont and wont.

I can play agent jane blonde, bdba and hitman just fine. I can win or lose and im fine with it because they play normal. The other pieces of crap are just ridiculous and it seems to be their new theme to trigger a bonus is minimum 300 spins but usually 400-500 and then pay 20x.

I can play playngo new slots and get some good hits on their new games but MG. Nope.

That company has taken quite a nose dive but Jurassic World will lift them back up for awhile.
 

trancemonkey

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Joined
Mar 29, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
Well it seems it has to be your opinion and everyone else's isn't worth a dime. How about differing opinions on the same subject matter based on years of play? Or are you the Slot Oracle?

I don't need to hear your sermonizing about what I can or can't do either, thankyou. I've already abstained from slotting for the best part of a month (not that it's any of your concern) and am entitled to offer my outlook on how games have noticeably changed.

Thanks again :cool:

Making a suggestion to stop playing is hardly sermonizing... Why would you play a game you think is rigged against you?

And no, everyone is entitled to their opinion... But you have to understand that my view isn't an opinion, it's fact. A fact you can of course ignore if you want to... And I'm sorry if that sounds big headed as it really isn't meant to be.

I don't know what you do but imagine you were a pilot working for the RAF and people kept telling you that Chemtrails were real and the RAF were doing them... Yet you knew for a fact they weren't. How would you respond on a forum that was adamant they were real? That's kind of the position I'm in... In fact I'm pretty close to giving up defending them as it's pointless really...
 

trancemonkey

Ueber Meister
Joined
Mar 29, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
I will say it again, Microgaming is the biggest offender out of all them without question. Those new slots, all of them.. there is no way they are 96% rtp. Absolutely zero chance and no one on this earth will convince me otherwise. And yes since I think that I shouldnt play them right. Well I dont and wont.

I can play agent jane blonde, bdba and hitman just fine. I can win or lose and im fine with it because they play normal. The other pieces of crap are just ridiculous and it seems to be their new theme to trigger a bonus is minimum 300 spins but usually 400-500 and then pay 20x.

I can play playngo new slots and get some good hits on their new games but MG. Nope.

That company has taken quite a nose dive but Jurassic World will lift them back up for awhile.

They probably are 96% but just really really bad games.... Use slot tracker and you'll soon find out :)
 

nojoke

Experienced Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Location
uk
I think what is happening is that the games are now designed by much younger people. The math is done by much younger people.

What i know of the younger generations these days is that they are taught to be utterly ruthless.
They are pushed to succeed however they can.

With modern tech the youngsters have become ever more devious and nasty and not just to each other.

Now the industry is filled with youngsters striving to get ahead of the pack. They are ruthless and so this comes out in game design. It shows in how the games play.
The targeting of youngsters with kiddy graphics is not the design of older people, It is the younger designers creating these innocent looking but highly dangerous games. (Dangerous because of whom they target and how they destroy a bank roll with little chance of a decent hit whilst making the player ever more addicted)

Things have changed. Its "Cut Throat" these days. Its the modern way.
 

goatwack

Get dunked, big buns!
Joined
Aug 29, 2012
Location
Londonia
Making a suggestion to stop playing is hardly sermonizing... Why would you play a game you think is rigged against you?

And no, everyone is entitled to their opinion... But you have to understand that my view isn't an opinion, it's fact. A fact you can of course ignore if you want to... And I'm sorry if that sounds big headed as it really isn't meant to be.

I don't know what you do but imagine you were a pilot working for the RAF and people kept telling you that Chemtrails were real and the RAF were doing them... Yet you knew for a fact they weren't. How would you respond on a forum that was adamant they were real? That's kind of the position I'm in... In fact I'm pretty close to giving up defending them as it's pointless really...

You say fact, I don't know that.

Your parables are becoming ever more colourful. RAF now?

I can both gamble for the enjoyment and thrill of winning AND simultaneously notice a downward trend in gameplay, can I not? We all know gambling is about winning and losing, yet if brought up that the games are behaving strangely, I'm told it's just continuous bad luck?

Do you object to players posing questions about slots ? It's hardly a new topic around here.

You seem intent on dismissing any other view that isn't your own, which doesn't really mix well with being a public debate :cool:
 

deadoralive23

Registered
Joined
Nov 21, 2014
Location
uk
Trance you seem to know more about slots than anyone on this forum, however when more and more people are witnessing changes in payouts how can you deny the fact that someone is tampering with the percentages!
I can accept losing but when you spin £2500 on Cleopatra II and the biggest win is x18 and the feature only drops once how can the RTP be really what is on offer.
Anyone that has played immortal romance will notice the feature takes longer to trigger when you need that last one to unlock the last chick.
 

cncas2123

Meister Member
Joined
May 23, 2015
Location
Belfast
I personally think that the slots have gone downhill a bit over the last few years, but I think for the point of randomness and RTP what all CM contributors need to understand is that we are only a small fraction of the online playing community, and we also see on winner videos, screenshots etc that we do indeed have the odd winning session in our midst.
Maybe we are all looking to the "old days" with rose tinted glasses, maybe they arent as good as they were, but we do get the odd good run.....
 

trancemonkey

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Joined
Mar 29, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
You say fact, I don't know that.

Your parables are becoming ever more colourful. RAF now?

I can both gamble for the enjoyment and thrill of winning AND simultaneously notice a downward trend in gameplay, can I not? We all know gambling is about winning and losing, yet if brought up that the games are behaving strangely, I'm told it's just continuous bad luck?

Do you object to players posing questions about slots ? It's hardly a new topic around here.

You seem intent on dismissing any other view that isn't your own, which doesn't really mix well with being a public debate :cool:

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm trying to say...

Of course debate is good... But equally there is little point in debate if all the evidence is ignored. I agree that you have no idea if I know what I'm talking about or not, but to come on to a forum and offer knowledge if I'm lying would be monumentally stupid wouldn't it?

I can't dismiss your opinion that games have changed because you are entitled to feel they have. The chances are it's perception but I don't know every game and every provider but I DO know the industry and how much it costs and how difficult it can be to get new maths certified...

Of course if you're on the outside playing it's very easy to just assume we are all crooks and out to make even more money off you than we say we will and when people are losing money they hate to think it's their fault and always always blame us or the games or whatever.

And yes there are dodgy casinos and games providers... I don't know any personally but it's a huge industry so there are bound to be... Just look in the rogue casino section.

So Goatwack I'm not trying to be an arse or say my view is the only view all of you should listen to... But imagine the shoe was on the other foot... I bet you would be a little frustrated... Maybe I'm handling it badly and for that I apologise.

Oh and to your point about games behaving strangely... The game I'm working on for IGT... I was playing it for four hours the other day... It was terrible. I was convinced that something was amiss with the maths... No features no bonus no big wins... Nothing.

I had the maths department and devs looking for two hours to find a fault. But you know what... There wasn't one. In all the times I've played it since I've never had it play that bad.
 

brianmon

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May 22, 2013
Location
Cumbria
And no, everyone is entitled to their opinion... But you have to understand that my view isn't an opinion, it's fact. A fact you can of course ignore if you want to... And I'm sorry if that sounds big headed as it really isn't meant to be.

I don't know what you do but imagine you were a pilot working for the RAF and people kept telling you that Chemtrails were real and the RAF were doing them... Yet you knew for a fact they weren't. How would you respond on a forum that was adamant they were real? That's kind of the position I'm in... In fact I'm pretty close to giving up defending them as it's pointless really...

No offence mate. But although you maybe able to speak from a factual point of view regarding the games you've designed and maybe the company you work for.

If you don't currently work for MGS or NetEnt, which is where the majority of these complaints are directed. Then it's really just your opinion too (however 'educated' that opinion may be), rather than fact.

You often mention intellectual properties and how you can't give too much away. So why would any other designers share company 'secrets' with you or anyone else?

If there have been any changes made to existing games, which you knew about. Would you be able to admit to those changes in a pubic internet forum anyway?

just say, for arguments sake, that changes to some older games had been made at MGS.
Would every one in the industry get to know about it?
Would everyone who works for MGS get to know about it?
Or would it be a closely guard secret, known only by those who need to know?


Player perception is one thing when it comes to casual players. But some of the serious players in this forum, will carefully monitor and even document situations, once the become aware of them.
They don't forget or mis-remember things.
 

trancemonkey

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Mar 29, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
No offence mate. But although you maybe able to speak from a factual point of view regarding the games you've designed and maybe the company you work for.

If you don't currently work for MGS or NetEnt, which is where the majority of these complaints are directed. Then it's really just your opinion too (however 'educated' that opinion may be), rather than fact.

You often mention intellectual properties and how you can't give too much away. So why would any other designers share company 'secrets' with you or anyone else?

If there have been any changes made to existing games, which you knew about. Would you be able to admit to those changes in a pubic internet forum anyway?

just say, for arguments sake, that changes to some older games had been made at MGS.
Would every one in the industry get to know about it?
Would everyone who works for MGS get to know about it?
Or would it be a closely guard secret, known only by those who need to know?


Player perception is one thing when it comes to casual players. But some of the serious players in this forum, will carefully monitor and even document situations, once the become aware of them.
They don't forget or mis-remember things.

I agree... And I've said that before.... I can't speak 100% for other manufacturers but I've worked at enough and they all work the same way in terms of fairness and certainly no collusion with casinos or other providers...
 

me_and_ed

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
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Jun 2, 2006
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I personally think its how the RTP is dispersed, most of these new games drip feed you but have no real or a very minute chance of hitting anything substantial, they just slowly bleed you dry, I think the games have changed too.
 

syrus2

Banned User - repetitive trollish behavior
Joined
Jun 29, 2016
Location
Netherlands
I personally think its how the RTP is dispersed, most of these new games drip feed you but have no real or a very minute chance of hitting anything substantial, they just slowly bleed you dry, I think the games have changed too.

Interesting way you put it in ,mate !!

It's possible

The machine will “pay back” over an infinite number of spins .

This means, the more players, the more spins, the higher will be your chance to hit sumthing nice and win.

for example: you get more chance to win during weekends or Christmas (theoretical ).

Because during this period more people have few days off and spend their time to gambe.

So, once you start playing and the slot is cold, is simply because less players have played on that slot.
RTP, does'nt change.

You gonna have to see it this way: the amount of money you win today is the money which I lost yesterday.

That money does'nt come from casinos pockets.
These Slots are immensely profitable for the casinos.
We are not dealing with greenpeace here.

Hence, the Term: Responsible gambling.
 

slot_zombie

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2014
Location
UK
I personally think its how the RTP is dispersed, most of these new games drip feed you but have no real or a very minute chance of hitting anything substantial, they just slowly bleed you dry, I think the games have changed too.

This. The games aren't paying less than the stated RTP. They're not "cheating". However, as we can see with recent NetEnt output, it's all down to intentionally awful maths that can drag the player down very quickly, and rarely gives a chance to come out ahead.
 

trancemonkey

Ueber Meister
Joined
Mar 29, 2013
Location
United Kingdom
This. The games aren't paying less than the stated RTP. They're not "cheating". However, as we can see with recent NetEnt output, it's all down to intentionally awful maths that can drag the player down very quickly, and rarely gives a chance to come out ahead.

Exactly
 
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