Should My Bank Have Done More?

[Educated_ant]

First time post. During Covid when stuck at home I became inflicted with a horrible gambling addiction for sports betting and particularly online casinos, regularly losing £10-20k in a month.

This went on for years but as 2024 started my wife helped me realise that this simply had to stop and I registered with gamstop. I told Barclays to block gambling on my account. Unfortunately, they still allowed me to continue betting. I complained and they refunded me my £10k losses that were accrued from the moment I asked them to stop me.

However, Barclays closed my account just days after this and told me to use a switch service to another bank as they no longer wanted me as a customer. I had been a customer of that bank since 1997 when my mum opened it for me aged 11... the only current account I had ever had and it caused me quite the upheaval.

I used the switch service to Lloyds bank. Before too long, this nasty addiction hit me again and I was soon gambling. In September I hit the lowest point of it. I lost my job of twenty years and panicked and made 27 deposits x £3k in 3 days... most of these in 5-6 chunks within minutes. I lost £80k+.

I then put a gambling block on my Lloyds account. I have since complained that these debit card payments should have been flagged earlier given the high volume and high amount of them and the fact they were to a dodgy looking overseas vendor. Indeed, on one day Lloyds actually stopped me from depositing any more as I hit a daily card limit, only for this to then reset the next day. Nothing to do with gambling just an auto block for the high volume of payments.

I never got a phone call from Lloyds or any "are you sure" messages on my app during or after. My wife helped me put a gambling block on my mobile app... but it sadly didn't stop me from doing bank transfers to gambling sites a few weeks later and I lost another £20k in October.

Considering Lloyds never flagged these high volume of debit card payments as a problem, despite hitting their daily limit and allowing me to continue when it reset the next day

Considering Lloyds never called or asked about my wellbeing after I put the stop on my app

Considering they then never flagged 4 dodgy £5k payments, done within minutes, to an overseas gambling merchant...

do I have any grounds to complain about how I have been let down as a customer?

Furthermore, do I have any kind of case to complain against Barclays for ditching me as a customer when I was clearly vulnerable with my addiction. Should Barclays have done more to tell Lloyds I was with gamstop / I had a gambling block on my account? Would Lloyds have been granted access to that information? Or is that onus completely on me.

I've been on and off reading this thread and I'm not being naive about my gambling problem. I am seeking therapy, my wife now has control of all my finances and I'm learning to cope with the new reality that I'm never getting any of my losses back.

However, it is still gnawing away at me that perhaps both Barclays and Lloyds have let me down here?

Any advice would be much welcome.

 

[conker]

I am sorry to hear that you developed an addiction to gambling @Educated_ant, there are probably a lot of members on this forum that can empathise with you here. I am also hoping you are managing to control your urges to gamble now. Gambstop is useful, but will not solve all the stuff going on in your head. Without proper help this could lead you to riskier places to gamble, as you can no longer get onto a regulated betting/casino sites ( a sad consequence of Gamstop)

From what you have told us I do genuinely think you have a case with both banks. As a duty of care, especially during the pandemic, it would be reasonable to expect a phone call at the very least to check in with you if you are making several large deposits in succession to gambling websites.

However, here is the kicker, don't expect to be compensated anywhere near what you are probably rightfully owed. You will not be surprised to learn you are not the first person this has happened to. In fact a quick Google has revealed a similar case on the

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. The claimant managed to get £750 compensation - possibly nowhere near what he lost.

One thing I will say is that these banks do not like the scrutiny or cost associated with being hauled in front of the ombudsman, so it is well worth a try. Do some Googling and see what information you can find. No doubt a few members here will give you some ideas of how to approach this situation. A few well-worded letters may at the very least get you an apology, and at best, some of your money back.

 

[L&L-Jan]

I dont see how a bank can be held responsible for transactions you authorise.

I do strongly recommend to download and install bet blocker (

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) on all your devices. This will prevent you from accessing nearly hundred thousand gambling sites.

 

[satchnz]

I dont see how a bank can be held responsible for transactions you authorise.

To be honest, this is my view too (although neither do I have a gambling problem nor any experience in this area). No wonder bank fees are so high if they have to cover for the poor financial decisions some people make.

In saying the above, I hope the OP gets the help they need. It’s distressing to hear stories like this.

 

[conker]

No wonder bank fees are so high if they have to cover for the poor financial decisions some people make.

Actually bank fees are likely so high for many reasons, such as the amount of fraud that occurs every day, the fact that they have to keep shareholders constantly happy, and that people rarely change bank, regardless of how badly the bank performs.

Very unlikely high fees are because banks are remunerating gamblers who have lost lots of money gambling - as there is very little evidence that this is happening.

Poor financial decisions, that made me laugh. I think all of us here are making poor financial decisions, everytime we deposit and play at a casino.

 

[conker]

I do strongly recommend to download and install bet blocker (

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) on all your devices. This will prevent you from accessing nearly hundred thousand gambling sites.

This is good advice!

 

[satchnz]

Poor financial decisions, that made me laugh. I think all of us here are making poor financial decisions, everytime we deposit and play at a casino.

Certainly not if you are playing for entertainment. If you are playing to only win money or to recover previous losses then that’s a poor financial decision.

 

[dunover]

Were any of those 'foreign' processor transactions made to any unlicensed casinos/betting sites?

 

[Educated_ant]

Yes they were. Playhub Casino was one, (who don't seem to hide that they are a gambling merchant strangely as their code is MCC 7995). I've spoke to the Gambling Commission who confirmed these payments were illegal and should never have been accepted by them. I don't know if that helps me with my bank. The other is Don Bet who I haven't spoke to the Gambling Commission about but is likely a similar situation.

 

[dunover]

Yes they were. Playhub Casino was one, (who don't seem to hide that they are a gambling merchant strangely as their code is MCC 7995). I've spoke to the Gambling Commission who confirmed these payments were illegal and should never have been accepted by them. I don't know if that helps me with my bank. The other is Don Bet who I haven't spoke to the Gambling Commission about but is likely a similar situation.

Yes, basically under UK regs those transactions were invalid as made to an unlicensed operation. That is your only real source of optimism, but ultimately you actioned them so the banks will likely say the responsibity doesn't lie with themselves.

 

[conker]

Yes, basically under UK regs those transactions were invalid as made to an unlicensed operation. That is your only real source of optimism, but ultimately you actioned them so the banks will likely say the responsibity doesn't lie with themselves.

So who would the OP need to take this information to @dunover ? If it's regs does that mean the Gambling Commission?

 

[conker]

@Educated_ant you could probably start doing yourself a favour by gathering as much evidence as you can from both Barclays and Lloyds. If you are able to download statements going back to when all this activity occurred I would do that as soon as you can. If not downloadable then call your bank and say you would like paper copies sent over to you covering the dates. It is my understanding that banks are legally obliged to do this, regardless of whether you are still a customer or not.

 

[dunover]

So who would the OP need to take this information to @dunover ? If it's regs does that mean the Gambling Commission?

No, I would suggest a communication from the UKGC endorsing the fact this was paid to unlicensed and therefore rip-off merchants would help, but they won't get involved in any individual case.

 

[Educated_ant]

Yeah they have agreed to write an email to me with essentially what you have wrote there @dunover

 

[conker]

Yes they were. Playhub Casino was one, (who don't seem to hide that they are a gambling merchant strangely as their code is MCC 7995). I've spoke to the Gambling Commission who confirmed these payments were illegal and should never have been accepted by them. I don't know if that helps me with my bank. The other is Don Bet who I haven't spoke to the Gambling Commission about but is likely a similar situation.

I see the OP has already reached out to the UKGC.

Did they actually offer any advice?

 

[conker]

This Donbet? donbet.io is operated by TG-One Limited a company registered under the laws of Belize

There is another brand called Donbest, so just making sure we are talking about the right company here.

 

[Educated_ant]

Other than stop gambling (!), not really. They did say they were surprised Lloyds didn't do more to help me given the volume of payments in quick succession. They were horrified by that. They suggested going to the financial ombudsman as UKGC believed that they would be very intrigued by Lloyds' stance that they weren't somewhat culpable.

I am tempted to try a chargeback request with Lloyds over the payments as Playhub Casino made no mention in their T&C of their ridiculous withdrawal limits / their "swagger vip" level which basically means the more you gamble the bigger the level you can reach to withdraw. Which is where my problem came in... wanting to hit those levels to withdraw the stupid amount of money I had deposited in the first place only to then inevitably lose it.

Bit scared of the repercussions but if it's an illegal gambling merchant, I don't know if that plays in my favour in terms of VISA deciding what to do. And there's also the complication that VISA themselves should not be allowing those payments to have gone through right because they aren't supposed to authorise such payments?

 

[Educated_ant]

donbet.com/en was that one.

That one I did bank transfer via SEPA so I'm struggling with where to go for that. I was on gamstop and had told Lloyds to block me from gambling transactions but they are saying that just counts for debit cards and there's nothing they could do about bank transfers.

 

[conker]

Something very strange about all this.

Can someone please explain to me how debit card payments can be made to non UK licensed casinos operating out of Belize? I guess it's the whole buying rugs online trick, but it's actually payments for gambling.

In which case, this possibly turns into a case of fraud.

 

[conker]

That one I did bank transfer via SEPA so I'm struggling with where to go for that. I was on gamstop and had told Lloyds to block me from gambling transactions but they are saying that just counts for debit cards and there's nothing they could do about bank transfers.

Ah ok.

Still, where was the duty of care here?

 

[Webzcas]

Firstly, genuinely sorry to read about your predicament but I am in agreement with both Jan and Satchnz. I don't believe the onus is on the bank to control what you spend your money on.

Please though download and install betblocker.org on all your devices ASAP

Something very strange about all this.

Can someone please explain to me how debit card payments can be made to non UK licensed casinos operating out of Belize? I guess it's the whole buying rugs online trick, but it's actually payments for gambling.

In which case, this possibly turns into a case of fraud.

Yes, they use third party merchant shops, like out of Kenya or the such like and it is not classed as a gambling transaction. Therefore even if you have blocked gambling transactions on your bank app for your cards, they will still go through.

 

[conker]

There is another angle for you to consider - you could look into taking this to The Mirror or The Guardian. If the sums of money you are talking about are correct then they would likely be interested in this. Barclays and Lloyds would very unlikely be interested in the attention this would bring and would potentially be interested in some sort of compromise. Just a thought.

 

[Educated_ant]

I did think that but wasn't sure I fancied my name in the papers. I did vaguely suggest that to Lloyds over the phone but it's definitely something I'd need to give more thought to!

 

[conker]

I did think that but wasn't sure I fancied my name in the papers. I did vaguely suggest that to Lloyds over the phone but it's definitely something I'd need to give more thought to!

Ask to remain anonymous then, or a player going by the name of Ant (as an example).

In my experience, vaguely suggesting it over the phone to a cs agent will do nothing. You actually have to go through with these things to stand any chance of something happening.

It sounds to me like you aren't really getting anywhere with the UKGC etc etc. So, excuse the gambling pun here, but this could be your last roll of the dice if you hope to claw back any money from these two banks.

 

[Jono777]

May seem heartless but when are adults going to take some responsibility in this day and age?

I do understand the pain and lack of control with addiction, been there, done that back in the old fruit machine days.

However what I did do was seek help, learn my lesson and not point the finger of blame towards anyone but myself.

I still play online but with a small and very controlled budget which I've stuck to for years now but should that day ever come (hopefully never) that I lost control, I would not be expecting anything other than a guilty conscience.

As I say harsh post and I do wish you well in beating your addiction but I read way too many similar stories these days of people who've tried to dig themselves out of the shit by blaming anyone bar themselves. I do also feel to a point (possibly not in this case, who knows?) that when disgruntled players who've lost too much post these scenarios, should they be successfully in getting some form of refunds etc, they would just simply use it to fuel more gambling!