SCI FI CASINO - Outta this World?

spearmaster

RIP Ted
Joined
Jan 12, 2001
Location
Heaven
SHILL! :xxx

Just teasing, Dave - not very often I get to turn the tables on you :)

But seriously, what is your opinion on letting Golden Palace back onto the good side? After all, they have not had any problems in a long time, and they have been paying on time, so far as I know.
 

amandajm

Experienced Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2001
Location
London
Sci Fi still have'nt squared the craps crap from a while back so all this talk of the non rogueing of this firm are nonsense.

Golden Palace? Forgiven?

I recall Mary's analogy of the diamond dealer who has been previously found guilty of stealing diamonds.

Anyone who lets a convicted diamond thief carry thier diamonds across the world because the thief has been behaving for a while is mad.

Gamble at Golden Palace?

If you like that kind of thing. Russian roulette has it's downside tho.
 

jpm

Dormant account
Joined
Mar 29, 2002
love2vegas wrote: I don't want the point missed: the casino could easily clarify so there was NO QUESTION.

You're 100% right there, they could and SHOULD clarify these things so there is no question. It should be right there in the email offering the bonus. There is absolutely no good reason for a casino not to do so, only bad reasons. I'm happy to see that more and more casinos these days are including this info in their email offers (miami paradise, casino king, casino las vegas are a few that come to mind right away).
 

jrouse

Dormant account
Joined
Aug 20, 2003
I was wondering if someone could tell me if the Online Casino Gaming Council has A new email address I can't seem to get through to the old one?
 

spearmaster

RIP Ted
Joined
Jan 12, 2001
Location
Heaven
I knew I had never heard of it before - but just some of the text makes me want to laugh.

First, here is part of the WHOIS:

Domain name: onlinecouncil.com

DNS servers:
NS.FASTWEBSITES.COM
NS2.FASTWEBSITES.COM

Created: 06/30/2003 11:20:10
Expires: 06/30/2004 11:20:10


As you can see, registered June 30, 2003.

Next, some text from the site:

Established in 1998, the Online Casino Gaming Council, OCGC has been actively tackling the ever growing problem of corrupt and unfair online casinos. We have established a clear set of guidelines for all of our members to adhere by. These guidelines were designed to ensure all their clients are guaranteed to receive fair and secure gaming at our members sites.

Bullshit.

Lastly, it has a list of 6 casinos. With affiliate tags. OLD affiliate tags. SO old that it still lists English Harbour, Silver Dollar and Caribbean Gold as Microgaming casinos!

Give it a wide berth.
 

paul02085

Dormant account
Joined
Jan 29, 2002
Location
USA
Whether Sci-Fi is on Meister's Rogue list or not, they are solid and most experienced players know it.
 

dave_r

Dormant account
Joined
Oct 6, 1999
In response to Spearmaster's excellent question:

Golden Palace has turned itself into a very good orginization lately, but thier checkered past cannot be forgotten. They were outright thieves, in May 2000, and this cannot be forgiven or forgotten, since they still refuse to pay thier debts to players from 3 years ago.

In addition to thier theft of an enormous amount of money, which some believe is well above the 100K mark, they lied about the amount confiscated, stating it was less than 15K, than they went onto forums like Casinomeister pretending to be happy players. In fact, the name of the player that posted on Casinomeister was "Jersey Girl" which is now the name of a slot machine there. (Aqua version) They lied and STILL LIE about thier top 10 winners listing. The amounts won are PHONY!!

I believe it was Golden Palace that originally got the feds involved in an attempt to bust Sam A. Ashley (Steve Adkins) on racketeering charges.

Rumor has it that the GP folks hired a private investigator to do some major research on Steve, and it was this detective agency that somehow was able to find out about Steve's food center scam.
This agency got in touch with authorities. If not for GP, Steve's scam may never have come to light. Anyway, I have veered too much off topic...

Should GP be redeemed from the rogue list? I now believe the answer is YES. Should they be redeemed from the warning list? Possibly.

Perhaps Bryan would like to consider adding them to his new cautionary listing. (Borderline Not Recommended)

After all, the event took place THREE years ago.
CPA's recent comment resonates in my mind. CPA states that after that May 2000 fiasco ended, Golden Palace made some critical internal policy changes to assure nothing like that would happen again. And in these THREE years, they have kept to thier word and honored thier rules.

Many satisfied players have come and gone.
Myself included.

Can a leopard change it's spots? Usually NO. Unless ofcourse its extremely beneficial to the leopard. In this situation, GP realized that it was *MORE PROFITABLE* to carefully evaluate the promos it offered, and to make absolutely sure to honor its rules for every player. They realized it was more profitable NOT TO STEAL ANY MORE MONEY. Wow, what a concept!

Will they steal again? Its unlikely, but there's simply no way to know.
 

cipher

Banned member - being a jerk
Joined
May 15, 2002
Location
Visalia, California
Very thorough post Dave-r, but I cannot imagine why anyone would even contemplate a grant of clemency to GP. To my knowledge GP has made absolutely no attempt to make those people that they screwed, whole.

Not to mention the fact that there are many casinos out there that have not screwed over players and then walked away. I think I would feel much more comfortable in giving a casino that hasn't gone the way of GP my business before I'd give GP a second shot at doing it again. Have a good one.

Cipher
 

jetset

RIP Brian
CAG
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
Two good posts from Dave R and Cypher, imo.

In principle I am one of those who does not find the possibility of redemption unacceptable - but I think that it should be contingent on the casino concerned redressing the wrongs it did to the many players that were so disgustingly ripped off by Mark Francis, Jack Strulovich and the rest of the GP crew back then. Those that can still be found, that is. There are still many with bitter memories and a lot of money was involved.

It is true that GP rarely makes the bad news pages these days, and they may have made a conscious business effort to reform, but I also find it difficult to forget that some of those involved were convicted of one the biggest telemarketing frauds ever perpetrated on Canadians - many of them old folks - prior to their move into online gambling.

If Dave R's information above regarding the investigation and informing on Steve Adkins is true (I had not heard that story before but based on some of the other things GP did at the time it would not surprise me) then I would say GP did the industry a favour in exposing Adkins in their efforts to take him out. His work on behalf of players was largely wiped out by his conviction for fraud and the disgraceful way in which he took advantage of the hungry.
 

deeg

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 4, 2003
"In principle I am one of those who does not find the possibility of redemption unacceptable - but I think that it should be contingent on the casino concerned redressing the wrongs it did to the many players that were so disgustingly ripped off by Mark Francis, Jack Strulovich and the rest of the GP crew back then. Those that can still be found, that is. There are still many with bitter memories and a lot of money was involved."/b

I agree with that, regarding that casinos should be accountable for their actions, or non-actions.

Now I know I'll probably be called a shit stirrer, but I have to ask.

Jetset, when you were part of casinojetset.com,
did you end up paying out all the members that were owed money after it went blacklisted, then belly-up?

I'm not trying to de-rail this thread, but after seeing some former rogue casino owners around trying to redeem themselves, it makes you wonder how honest they are, or if they will back up what they say.
 

jetset

RIP Brian
CAG
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
Interesting that you feel it necessary to bring up this historical event, Deeq. The short answer is that no players from the Canadian-owned Tropika group were shorted when it went to the wall because Microgaming did a deal with the Canadian owners that ensured that everyone was paid - I believe the first instance of a turnkey provider taking this course of action.

However, if your real purpose in bringing this up is to have a go at myself, you should understand that I was part of a team contracted by the Canadians to build, set-up and initially run 12 online casinos in 1996.

This was done successfully, and most online gamblers from around that time will vouch for the efficiency of Support and fast payouts during this period.

Some time before the decline of this group commenced due to ill-advised management promo decisions and a lack of investment focus on the part of the owners I had completed my contract and returned to my own interests, although I retained a very small minority shareholding in one of the twelve casinos as part of my remuneration (as it turned out this was valueless) This minority shareholding gave me no say in the continued management of the group after I left, although I was both publicly and privately critical of the way in which things were being done.
 

deeg

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 4, 2003
First off, my apologies to love2vegas for interrupting the thread.

Jetset, why would I want to have a go at you? This is not personal, merely curiousity. The only reason I brought this up is because I like most of the people here are tired of seeing people getting screwed by casinos, your name sounded familiar, and that when I saw an old interview from Winner Online about you and your part with Casino Jetset, it made me question not just your background, but the fact that how well do any of us know the background of some of these guys that run casinos.

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I went back and read it again, and these
statements stuck out to me:

" Then I am a part-owner and marketing director of an online casino called Casino Jetset."

"I have been involved with this casino from its earliest days."

"I was a founder member of the team which planned, built and launched Jetset almost two and a half years ago "

"Right from the start we decided that fast and reliable payouts had to be a prime business objective - our player surveys told us that. We've always held this as a top priority - even when we were hit hard with several $10 000 plus winners in our first month or so!"

Reading this, the use of the term "we" implies that you did have a say in what went on.

Like I said, this isn't personal at all; but put yourself in my position. If you saw this same information about someone else, wouldn't you have questions yourself?

I'm not trying to turn this into a bash, for anyone who plans on chiming in. As a gambler I think we all should do as much research on casinos and their owners, it might save alot of grief.
 

jetset

RIP Brian
CAG
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
I don't buy your "I just happened to come across" line, Deeq. I've seen too many attempted hatchet jobs in this business to be that naive.

In fact I think you may be using similar tactics to those that the notorious Warren Cloud employs from time to time when he tries to discredit me at WOL in his postings as "your_nightmare" in attempts to discourage me from recording his activities. One or two others have tried it, too when they had an axe to grind and no material to work with.

I have given you the facts. Make of them what you will - I have nothing to hide or be ashamed of.

And you apparently did not read this part of my answering post:

"The short answer is that no players from the Canadian-owned Tropika group were shorted when it went to the wall because Microgaming did a deal with the Canadian owners that ensured that everyone was paid - I believe the first instance of a turnkey provider taking this course of action."

(Message edited by jetset on November 07, 2003)
 

deeg

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 4, 2003
Me? Warren Cloud? LOL! Not likely! You can check my IP, profile, etc. Honestly, I am not him, and as for "your nightmare," I have no clue who that is. I really did just happen to read that interview, along with other older interviews on different sites, despite what you believe.

I can understand being defensive after having people trying to discredit you, but I think you're being a bit paranoid here. I am not trying to do anything, but ask a few questions.

As I stated, if you were me, just someone who gambles online, and reads articles about gambling, not just here at Bryans, (Sorry Bryan, lol!) and you can across that article, you wouldn't be curious and ask questions?

I did indeed read your whole post, and I am glad that everyone got paid. I still have questions, but I won't ask you anything more, because you seem to be hostile to any questions about this.

The fact that it's past history doesn't matter, my point is that everyone should question what's behind casinos, and their owners. Isn't this why we come to forums like this?

Lastly, you can get pissy and defensive about me asking questions, but when I see that trait in someone who's supposed to be honest, it makes me a little doubtful of their sincerity. Wouldn't you feel the same, Jetset?
 

jetset

RIP Brian
CAG
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
No one accused you of being Warren Cloud - your tactics are similar, so perhaps you are the paranoid one. If you have read this history as assiduously as you claim to have done, you would have seen the true facts in the old threads too, but you still felt you had to bring these old false allegations up again? It is not "pissy" so much as tiresome to have to protect my reputation by putting the real truth in for the record every time someone like you posts in this irrelevant and intentionally damaging manner.

Coincidentally over at the other site I note that Warren has been busy again trying his clumsy ancient hatchet stunt. It is ironic that a real casino owner with arguably the most questionable ongoing rep in the business should be throwing false historical accusations around again, but that's Cloud for you.

The other thought that occurs to me is that GP being the real focus of this thread may be having a little *fun* too. But then maybe I am being paranoid after all.

I am content for the moment. You have shown your colours and I have recorded the real facts surrounding the events some years back - particularly the player payouts - in this thread for the record.
 

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