RTP - Here's How It Affect Your Play.

KasinoKing

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There are clues in the software though and the easiest way to spot the RTP is the Keno pay table. As they come in 3 specific "packages" (92.5%, 95% and 97.5% IIRC), it would be really easy to determine which casino is running which model as soon as you can find 3 different Keno pay tables.

I don't play RTG anymore but if someone has a bunch of RTG's already installed on their computer, that would be awesome to check them and to share the findings.
That will only tell you which version of Keno they are running - it doesn't help with the other games.
It was established a long time ago that each RTG game can have it's TRTP adjusted individually for each casino.

KK
 

Jasminebed

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I don't always play the highest RTP game at a casino (some of those stats are available for some of the places I place), but I sure notice a HUGE difference when I go land based and the TRTP is so much lower.

It's a great chart, ty for your math work.

There's an interesting post from Enzo quite a ways back, where why it's best to go large or go home with a bonus, and part of the reason there are max bet amounts with bonuses at many casinos.

If you don't care about playtime (and I will admit I do), it's better to bust out early than break even on bonuses that are offered frequently? Assuming you play them more than once, and before you get bonus banned?

There's a gov't run casino just up the road from me, @83% on penny machines. I'd rather deposit online than visit. My fav casino is a few hours away, same slot percentages, but they offer generous comps,so I consider it "paying" for my room and food when I lose. The local one offers very little in that regard, and in Ontario no where can comp you alcohol.
 

dunover

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RTG random jackpots account for ~1.5% of TRTP.

The information was provided here by Dogboy a while back.

So Mousey.....the answer is that if you don't hit a RJ then your chances of reaching the TRTP are most certainly reduced.

In that case I'm probably correct that RTG exceed 92% base RTP - I think!
 

Balthazar

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That will only tell you which version of Keno they are running - it doesn't help with the other games.
It was established a long time ago that each RTG game can have it's TRTP adjusted individually for each casino.

Assuming that:

A- the software ships with a 95% RTP
B- only RTG can change it by operator's request
C- there are 3 math models (92, 95, 97)

Would it make sense to change the RTP of only certain games? I'm sure it's possible, but would they do it? Like changing Keno's RTP without touching the slots?
 

gloria460

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RTG random jackpots account for ~1.5% of TRTP.

The information was provided here by Dogboy a while back.

So Mousey.....the answer is that if you don't hit a RJ then your chances of reaching the TRTP are most certainly reduced.

Can you explain something to me bc I can't wrap my head around this. I went to live chat to ask what my rtp was for the 13th and 14th as I had horrid sessions.

Chat informed me that it was 153% and I had lost 400.00. She also stated that's the nature of slots and the more that I play the better my rtp would be. Hmmm, what do I need..a 300% rtp to cash out? I'm truly a little confused on this. Why would I show such a loss with that kinda rtp and they are accredited here...lol
 

dunover

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Can you explain something to me bc I can't wrap my head around this. I went to live chat to ask what my rtp was for the 13th and 14th as I had horrid sessions.

Chat informed me that it was 153% and I had lost 400.00. She also stated that's the nature of slots and the more that I play the better my rtp would be. Hmmm, what do I need..a 300% rtp to cash out? I'm truly a little confused on this. Why would I show such a loss with that kinda rtp and they are accredited here...lol

That's impossible - you can't have an RTP of 153% and lose on a session. it's basically saying you've had say 1000 spins at a dollar and received 1530 in return. You can have 100% RTP and break even. You can have 99.9% RTP and bust out, but it'd take you days unless you played large stakes. An RTP of 95% would mean on average you'd get a good long session but lose if you were playing say a dollar a spin on a 400 deposit.

As for the latter statement that is bunkum. It all depends on your long term RTP. IF you are 'up' (100%+ RTP) at a casino then the longer you play the nearer you will eventually get to the TRTP so on average you'd lose in the longer term. Vice-versa too. If you were around 90% RTP having played at a casino for a lengthy period, then you'd expect to get nearer the 95% TRTP eventually, so may have some gains back of your previous losses. Of course with randomness and variance this isn't guaranteed, but that's how things are overall. Of course big winners are massively over 100% usually, and this is paid for by long term losers. Some players are 'above the TRTP line' on the player variance undulations, some are below. For their CS to say the longer you play the BETTER your RTP will become is plain wrong. There is absolutely no guarantee of that.
 

KasinoKing

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Assuming that:

A- the software ships with a 95% RTP
B- only RTG can change it by operator's request
C- there are 3 math models (92, 95, 97)

Would it make sense to change the RTP of only certain games? I'm sure it's possible, but would they do it? Like changing Keno's RTP without touching the slots?
Ah, but not ALL their slots have 3 settings - so it would actually be impossible to set all of them to the High or to the Low RTP.
Also, some of the middle settings are not the same.
See: hxxp://www.slotbeaters.com/SD~RTG.htm

KK
 

gloria460

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That's impossible - you can't have an RTP of 153% and lose on a session. it's basically saying you've had say 1000 spins at a dollar and received 1530 in return. You can have 100% RTP and break even. You can have 99.9% RTP and bust out, but it'd take you days unless you played large stakes. An RTP of 95% would mean on average you'd get a good long session but lose if you were playing say a dollar a spin on a 400 deposit.

As for the latter statement that is bunkum. It all depends on your long term RTP. IF you are 'up' (100%+ RTP) at a casino then the longer you play the nearer you will eventually get to the TRTP so on average you'd lose in the longer term. Vice-versa too. If you were around 90% RTP having played at a casino for a lengthy period, then you'd expect to get nearer the 95% TRTP eventually, so may have some gains back of your previous losses. Of course with randomness and variance this isn't guaranteed, but that's how things are overall. Of course big winners are massively over 100% usually, and this is paid for by long term losers. Some players are 'above the TRTP line' on the player variance undulations, some are below. For their CS to say the longer you play the BETTER your RTP will become is plain wrong. There is absolutely no guarantee of that.

I just downloaded the casino on Saturday and started playing. I have not played there in about two years before then. I knew that statement wasn't correct. I'll request my play logs from chat and figure out my own rtp.
 

Nifty29

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Can you explain something to me bc I can't wrap my head around this. I went to live chat to ask what my rtp was for the 13th and 14th as I had horrid sessions.

Chat informed me that it was 153% and I had lost 400.00. She also stated that's the nature of slots and the more that I play the better my rtp would be. Hmmm, what do I need..a 300% rtp to cash out? I'm truly a little confused on this. Why would I show such a loss with that kinda rtp and they are accredited here...lol

Dunover explained it very well.

The CS agent was having a lend of you. It's nonsense.

It's true that the more you play, the more your RTP gravitates toward the TRTP of the game/s, but we are talking millions of spins i.e. that observation is based on the Law of Large Numbers. It is also true that the more spins you have the less your overall RTP will fluctuate, as big wins and big losses have less direct affect on your overall figure.
 

SlotsLover

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max cashout

Now I'd like to see just how (and I know it's an amazing amount) a maximum withdrawal (of say 10x) effects RTP. Most of the time with slots, one loses except when one hits big, which would now be truncated depending upon the deposit amount.
 

Nifty29

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Now I'd like to see just how (and I know it's an amazing amount) a maximum withdrawal (of say 10x) effects RTP. Most ypthe time with slots, one loses except when one hits big, which would now be truncated depending upon the deposit amount.

I think it was discussed here a few years ago, and it's not the huge difference people think IIRC.

Its also important to note that it does not affect the TRTP of a game. It just decreases the risk exposure for the casino. The game itself pays no different, and if one never plays a freebie and has winnings removed due to max cashout, their personal RTP is unaffected.

Max cashouts need to be considered in different terms to TRTP or payout percentages, as both figures do not take them into account.

It affects the financial position of both parties, but not what the game actually pays out....only what the casino pays out, which is a figure that's hard if not impossible to obtain, as it would be commercially sensitive.
 

KasinoKing

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Now I'd like to see just how (and I know it's an amazing amount) a maximum withdrawal (of say 10x) effects RTP. Most of the time with slots, one loses except when one hits big, which would now be truncated depending upon the deposit amount.
Looking from the other side...
What most players seem to forget, is that these maximum cash-outs only apply when you are using a bonus, usually anything from 100% up to 400% of your deposit. So when you play, at least half the money you wager is actually the casino's money. But the casino can not make a profit from their own money, so the House Edge of those wagers is lost as far as the casino is concerned. That's why many casinos have either very high WR and/or max cash-out limits on bonuses.

With RTG casinos in particular, don't forget 1.5% of the RTP goes toward the Random Jackpots. So if players always took a 400% bonus with every deposit, then those jackpots would be 4/5 funded with the casino's own money and not deposited funds.

KK
 

aceking123

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not sure wether this shines any light this mainly goes for RTG play yes maybe you lose 1.5% on random my problem is there machines are capped to 50,000 line bet . so in fact this would change your rtp% as the machines may be capped , theres no body saying saying any different to wether that cap is used agaisnt rtp% i would of thought if it has a % this machine would record the maxium which can be way more than 50,000 per line bet so where do those remaing funds go as far as the machine is concerned thats a hell of alot wasted not being payed out ??? this could have a huge impact on the slot in regards to the way its set up for rtp% ?
 
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maphesto

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Looking from the other side...
What most players seem to forget, is that these maximum cash-outs only apply when you are using a bonus, usually anything from 100% up to 400% of your deposit.

You are experienced enough to not make statements like this KK! From Rome:

35.All Deposits of 249 USD/EURO/AUS or less have a max withdrawal of 10X the deposit for that specific play session (all other currencies pegged to USD). Once a withdrawal is requested, the casino applies the 10X rule and corrects the withdrawal to accurately reflect the 10X rule. The remaining funds are deemed "Non-Withdrawable" and are cleared from the player's balance. Deposit bonuses used during a play session that results in a pending withdrawal request, are also "Non-Withdrawable" and can be deducted from that particular pending withdrawal.

Please, stay away from casinos who have max cashouts on deposit bonuses. There are probably some good deals out there without max cashouts.
 

ChopleyIOM

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not sure wether this shines any light this mainly goes for RTG play yes maybe you lose 1.5% on random my problem is there machines are capped to 50,000 line bet . so in fact this would change your rtp% as the machines may be capped , theres no body saying saying any different to wether that cap is used agaisnt rtp% i would of thought if it has a % this machine would record the maxium which can be way more than 50,000 per line bet so where do those remaing funds go as far as the machine is concerned thats a hell of alot wasted not being payed out ??? this could have a huge impact on the slot in regards to the way its set up for rtp% ?

IIRC it was reckoned that the 50,000 line bet cap 'costs' about 1% of RTP as far as the player is concerned.

I quite like some of RTG's slots, but there are three factors that mean I basically refuse to play the software even at accredited casinos:

1) Unknown RTP that we know the casino can change at will - and the lower RTP maths model is a very mean 92% or thereabouts.

2) Forced progressive jackpot contributions.

3) 50,000 line bet win cap.

If you're playing an RTG slot on the lowest paying maths model, by the time (2) and (3) have taken effect, your RTP on the base game is in the region of 89%!
 
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