Casino Complaint Royal Vegas takes my deposits and winnings

filterss2

Banned User - bogus PAB
PABnoaccred
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Aug 19, 2013
Location
Portugal
I deposited and played at 3 casinos of this group- Royal Vegas, Vegas Palms and Europalace.

I won 734, 276 and 649 respectively. I sent everything they asked me for- all kind of documents.
And then they lock my account, no explanations, nothing. Later I contacted the casino representative at this website.
And he told me that I contravened their terms by betting 30% of the bonus I received.
I check my notes and I see my mistake- I thought one cannot bet more than 30% of the bonus received.
And it turned out that one cannot bet the sum EQUAL to 30% or more. At Vegas Palms and Europalace
casino my maximum bets were 30 and 45 respectively (e.g. exactly 30% of the bonus). But at Royal Vegas
my maximum bet was 40 (of 150 euro bonus) which is LESS than 30%. I acknowledged my mistake at Vegas Palms
and Europalace (although it is only 1 euro mistake- I accept this). And I was waiting for my deposits to
be refunded. And regarding Royal Vegas- I did not violate any TERMS so I should be paid in full.
But representative told me that "It is immaterial whether you tried to do the same at Royal Vegas" , that I abused their
bonus system and they confiscate ALL MY WINNINGS AND ALL MY DEPOSITS - including Royal Vegas!
Can you imagine this?
 

dunover

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I deposited and played at 3 casinos of this group- Royal Vegas, Vegas Palms and Europalace.

I won 734, 276 and 649 respectively. I sent everything they asked me for- all kind of documents.
And then they lock my account, no explanations, nothing. Later I contacted the casino representative at this website.
And he told me that I contravened their terms by betting 30% of the bonus I received.
I check my notes and I see my mistake- I thought one cannot bet more than 30% of the bonus received.
And it turned out that one cannot bet the sum EQUAL to 30% or more. At Vegas Palms and Europalace
casino my maximum bets were 30 and 45 respectively (e.g. exactly 30% of the bonus). But at Royal Vegas
my maximum bet was 40 (of 150 euro bonus) which is LESS than 30%. I acknowledged my mistake at Vegas Palms
and Europalace (although it is only 1 euro mistake- I accept this). And I was waiting for my deposits to
be refunded. And regarding Royal Vegas- I did not violate any TERMS so I should be paid in full.
But representative told me that "It is immaterial whether you tried to do the same at Royal Vegas" , that I abused their
bonus system and they confiscate ALL MY WINNINGS AND ALL MY DEPOSITS - including Royal Vegas!
Can you imagine this?

Well, you breached their terms whether involuntarily or not. You also signed up for multiple accounts at the group to get multiple bonuses, which may or may not be a breach in itself in the timeframe you did it. You then AP'd the 3 bonuses. So, as a group they've voided winnings which they can under their terms and refunded your deposits. You've lost nothing as such, but have learnt to read the terms carefully in future.
 

fortunelounge

Dormant account
Joined
Mar 7, 2003
Location
South Africa
filterss2

As discussed in my PM's to you:

You received a bonus of €100 and made 7 bets of €30 each on Roulette and after you won you made a huge number of small bets on slots in order to meet your playthrough requirements (For example: 1281 bets on slots at €0.80 Avalon, 305 bets on Loaded at €0.50, 3 409 bets on Liquid Gold at €0.60, etc, etc)

I have explained to you that this is in breach of our terms. It is also exactly (Exact roulette game ans subsequent slots wagers) how several other players attempted to breach our terms.

This was no "accident" or "mistake".

Regards

Wim
 

redsfan

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Location
bishop auckland
Well, you breached their terms whether involuntarily or not. You also signed up for multiple accounts at the group to get multiple bonuses, which may or may not be a breach in itself in the timeframe you did it. You then AP'd the 3 bonuses. So, as a group they've voided winnings which they can under their terms and refunded your deposits. You've lost nothing as such, but have learnt to read the terms carefully in future.

The OP claims they have kept his deposits which the rep hasnt disputed so I presume he is down his deposits.
 

redsfan

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filterss2

As discussed in my PM's to you:

You received a bonus of €100 and made 7 bets of €30 each on Roulette and after you won you made a huge number of small bets on slots in order to meet your playthrough requirements (For example: 1281 bets on slots at €0.80 Avalon, 305 bets on Loaded at €0.50, 3 409 bets on Liquid Gold at €0.60, etc, etc)

I have explained to you that this is in breach of our terms. It is also exactly (Exact roulette game ans subsequent slots wagers) how several other players attempted to breach our terms.

This was no "accident" or "mistake".

Regards

Wim

May I ask, are you saying that the fact that the OP changed from roullete to slots is against your rules. For example, if he had bet £29 a spin, the fact he then played these slots, would have still voided his return?

Thanks
 

fortunelounge

Dormant account
Joined
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Location
South Africa
May I ask, are you saying that the fact that the OP changed from roullete to slots is against your rules. For example, if he had bet £29 a spin, the fact he then played these slots, would have still voided his return?

Thanks

Hi redsfan

Changing from roulette to slots is not against our rules but making bets of 30% and higher on your bonus is against our terms. If she made bets of €29 once or twice we would probably have overlooked it but these were 30% bets made consistently until a win ocurred and then thousands of very small bets in order to meet the wagering requirements. This is rather irregular and if there are several players doing exactly the same - same games and same strategy - something looks very suspect.

Regards

Wim
 

redsfan

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webby
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Location
bishop auckland
Wim

Thanks for taking the reply to post. I do concede it does look suspect but in its singularity, it isnt against the terms and conditions to bet €29 (had to find the euro sign :) ) as your terms say 30%. It is an advantageous way to play the bonus though, hitting a target and then dropping down to a high ratio game to complete wagering.

May I ask, did the casino keep the deposits or were these in fact returned?

Without prejudice to the above, the OP was in breach of the rules by opening more than two accounts in a seven day period so falls at the first hurdle.
 

dunover

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It's usual practise for a casino to return deposits if they arbitrarily decide to close or lock a players account if the player has a balance of his deposit or greater left. Some will even return the deposits when closing if the player has lost the deposit. FL are accredited and I would fully expect them to do so.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Hi redsfan

Changing from roulette to slots is not against our rules but making bets of 30% and higher on your bonus is against our terms. If she made bets of €29 once or twice we would probably have overlooked it but these were 30% bets made consistently until a win ocurred and then thousands of very small bets in order to meet the wagering requirements. This is rather irregular and if there are several players doing exactly the same - same games and same strategy - something looks very suspect.

Regards

Wim

beatingbonuses (dot) com or similar.


However, the allegation is that DEPOSITS were also confiscated, yet this is not fraud, merely AP. Arguing the equal or less than is splitting hairs too, making FL no better than the APs. What "other players" are doing is immaterial to how you treat any one player, unless you have evidence that they are operating together as a "ring".

Maybe 30% is too high a figure, as simply by betting €29 instead of €30 until hitting a big win, the AP would get pretty much the same outcome, yet not breach this term at all.

If players are signing up with their own genuine details, it should be easy for the system to track them making accounts through the group till they hit a win, and maybe block registration (or at least the crediting of the bonus) if more than 2 are opened within 7 days. Playtech have systems that can block an account within seconds of registration if it is deemed that a player has created accounts at different casinos too quickly for the operator's liking.
 

Mouche12

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Well, yes, the OP should have placed bets lower than 30%, the "equal to" part takes care of that. But it's also at the casino's discretion to confiscate winnings on bets of $30 instead of the allowed $29. The rep's assurance that the OP's bets were consistently $30 is of course due to the fact that the OP believed he was following the rules by betting not higher than 30%, he forgot to read the "equal to" part. Hairsplitting? Yes, perhaps but the casino is in it's right. They only have to return the deposits, which according to the OP, they did not.
 

dunover

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Perhaps the rep should come back to this thread and confirm as to whether the OP has had deposits refunded, as there is seldom any excuse to keep them when barring a player. The OP needs to elaborate on this too.
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
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SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
I have no problems with FL not paying the winnings but confiscation of deposits is an absolute no-no. This is bonus abuse and Wim seems to be saying that there may be other players doing something similar but even if that is correct they are only a bunch of advantage players and while they can be kicked out the deposits need to be returned. Otherwise, it would send a message to players that FL is using an excuse to confiscate legitimate deposits. Over to you Wim.
 

akrus88

Dormant account
Joined
Aug 6, 2012
Location
Finland
I can not understand why the royal vegas winnings are confisticated o.O??
I really hate bonus abusers, that is the reason bonuses are so shitty nowadays. But if just thinking the T&C, royal vegas winnings should have been paid.
 

MisterBJ

Account suspended until further notice - please co
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Location
Atlanta
Im sorry guys. I don't like the way Royal Vegas has handled this. Its seems like casinos are finding the pettiest reason to void winnings. What next deny winnings or deposit back. Because someone name Matthew spelled it Mathew by mistake?
 

mattsgame

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Im sorry guys. I don't like the way Royal Vegas has handled this. Its seems like casinos are finding the pettiest reason to void winnings. What next deny winnings or deposit back. Because someone name Matthew spelled it Mathew by mistake?

You leave us out of this thanks :)

I do not like casinos keeping deposits at all as I do not think there is any reason that they should be allowed to and FL have shown many times that they will keep them.
 

pianoman

Dormant account
Joined
Dec 11, 2008
Location
Sittin Here in Front of the Screen like
Fortune Lounge T & C

I get the impression that not only is this a "newbie" CM member (first post) learning a decent lesson, but might also be a new punter trying some halfbaked system recommended at some site (affiliate or otherwise) and shooting 'emself in the foot.
Like most of us did to some extent early on, until we realised there's a respectable aspect to playing that allows decent access to bonuses at preferred sites YEAR after YEAR - no wukkin furries mate!

It was only a few months ago I queried individually in Online Chat at each Fortune Lounge site (other than Euro Palace - already a player there...) their willingness to provide the welcome bonus despite registering at each and every one?
Sometimes I got the same customer service rep too :)
Anyway the surprising thing for me was that none of them denied my claim for any as promoted Welcome bonus in full.
And later for any withdrawals, I needed only to advise them that Royal Vegas already had my docs on file.
I had my share of wins and losses - but am a little ahead overall
After a decade of playing slots online I was sufficiently impressed however that I'd almost play there exclusively, if I didn't already have 32RED club Rouge membership.
Did our poor lil OP play fair :what:

Pretty blatant attempt here to take advantage, thus abusing the bonus provisions I reckon ...

I'm on Fortune L's side -
whether they keep his deposits or not !
 

mrmark21

Dormant Account
Joined
Nov 13, 2012
Location
australia
Im sorry guys. I don't like the way Royal Vegas has handled this. Its seems like casinos are finding the pettiest reason to void winnings. What next deny winnings or deposit back. Because someone name Matthew spelled it Mathew by mistake?

... Or someone missed a digit of their phone number :rolleyes:

I know that some members here think it's okay for casinos to keep deposits when a player makes a mistake but I think it's very very wrong. They aren't going to pay the winnings (they are well within their rights not to given their T&Cs) but they still want to keep the deposits? That's outright theft IMPO.

P.s. I don't think he was taking a dig at you BTW Matt :)
 

filterss2

Banned User - bogus PAB
PABnoaccred
Joined
Aug 19, 2013
Location
Portugal
Yes , all three my deposits (350 euro) were confiscated. And I have not opened all three accounts at the same time. There was a one month period between I opened one account
at Vegas palms and 2 others at RoyalVegas and Europalace.


I have 2 questions to Fortune Lounge representative:


1. I agreed that I made a mistake and wagered slightly above the allowed max bet limit at Vegas Palms
and Euro Palace (actually it was 1 euro cent bigger than allowed). However, at Royal Vegas I DID NOT violate that rule - my maximum bet there was
40 for bonus 150 which makes less than 27% . And you acknowledged this fact in your PM to me several days ago.
How fair is it to make me pay for my mistake at one casino by confiscating my winnings at the
other casino, at which I did not violate ANY RULES?

2. How fair is that you decide CONFISCATE all three deposits (total 350 euro) just because I made a
bet which was by 1 (ONE) EURO CENT bigger than allowed by your rules? And you also confiscated the deposit at
the casino where I did NOT violate ANY TERMS AT ALL (Royal Vegas).
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
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Sep 26, 2004
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If the confiscation is true and there are no valid reasons for it then the FL group is really carving a bad reputation for itself. Wim had posted in this thread but there was no mention that the deposits would be confiscated so unless a valid reason is given this group deserves a kick in the butt.
 

Borgie

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
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Jul 19, 2011
Location
United Kingdom
It would be really good if the REP could confirm one way or the other whether the deposits have been confiscated and if so why. Its so frustrating when its left in limbo as it is at the moment.
 

MisterBJ

Account suspended until further notice - please co
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Location
Atlanta
Yes , all three my deposits (350 euro) were confiscated. And I have not opened all three accounts at the same time. There was a one month period between I opened one account
at Vegas palms and 2 others at RoyalVegas and Europalace.


I have 2 questions to Fortune Lounge representative:


1. I agreed that I made a mistake and wagered slightly above the allowed max bet limit at Vegas Palms
and Euro Palace (actually it was 1 euro cent bigger than allowed). However, at Royal Vegas I DID NOT violate that rule - my maximum bet there was
40 for bonus 150 which makes less than 27% . And you acknowledged this fact in your PM to me several days ago.
How fair is it to make me pay for my mistake at one casino by confiscating my winnings at the
other casino, at which I did not violate ANY RULES?

2. How fair is that you decide CONFISCATE all three deposits (total 350 euro) just because I made a
bet which was by 1 (ONE) EURO CENT bigger than allowed by your rules?
And you also confiscated the deposit at
the casino where I did NOT violate ANY TERMS AT ALL (Royal Vegas).

If what you are saying is true. If this would have happened at 32red. I can almost promise they would have paid you. I feel some once decent casinos are struggling, do to the turn down in the world's economy. Some has went from flushing to now 48 hrs pending. And even 5+ days before processing withdrawals. So even the smallest violation of terms maybe used to deny winnings. Its like living in a decent small town where a few yrs ago. Polices wouldn't bother you for small infractions. Now they will pull you over because you didnt put on your turn signal. We all have own on betting system. Whether we play 25 spins on a slot and then move on. Or play in between slots and table games. I'm sure 100s if not 1000s of people have came to FL this year alone. Placed a large bet and lost. The casino didnt say a word. MG has the ability to limit bets to a certain percentage. Why this wasn't used in your case? I don't understand.

FL you owe this player his deposits back. Keeping any deposits for whatever reason (Unless stolen funds) is roguish and makes you no better than the depositer. To be honest when i read about things like this. It disgust me, to see how online gambling have turned.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Yes , all three my deposits (350 euro) were confiscated. And I have not opened all three accounts at the same time. There was a one month period between I opened one account
at Vegas palms and 2 others at RoyalVegas and Europalace.



I have 2 questions to Fortune Lounge representative:


1. I agreed that I made a mistake and wagered slightly above the allowed max bet limit at Vegas Palms
and Euro Palace (actually it was 1 euro cent bigger than allowed). However, at Royal Vegas I DID NOT violate that rule - my maximum bet there was
40 for bonus 150 which makes less than 27% . And you acknowledged this fact in your PM to me several days ago.
How fair is it to make me pay for my mistake at one casino by confiscating my winnings at the
other casino, at which I did not violate ANY RULES?

2. How fair is that you decide CONFISCATE all three deposits (total 350 euro) just because I made a
bet which was by 1 (ONE) EURO CENT bigger than allowed by your rules? And you also confiscated the deposit at
the casino where I did NOT violate ANY TERMS AT ALL (Royal Vegas).


So, did they pay your withdrawal from Vegas Palms a month prior, or did you play the other two a month later whilst still not having had anything from Vegas Palms?
 

filterss2

Banned User - bogus PAB
PABnoaccred
Joined
Aug 19, 2013
Location
Portugal
So, did they pay your withdrawal from Vegas Palms a month prior, or did you play the other two a month later whilst still not having had anything from Vegas Palms?

I won 278 euro at Vegas Palms. Then they started asking for all kind of documents. So I started to play Europalace and Royal vegas before they paid me Vegas palms. Yes.
 
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