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Casino Complaint Royal Panda keeps fraudulently received money

Discussion in 'Casino Complaints - Non-Bonus Issues' started by NewHere, Jan 25, 2016.

Thread Status:
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    Jan 25, 2016
  1. NewHere

    NewHere Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Hi there,

    Found this forum after looking for help regarding a dispute with Royal Panda. For your information: I am not into the gambling world so forgive me if I forget important information. I have read the FAQ and will inform the Royal Panda representative about this thread.

    My girlfriend and I have been victims of a complex form of identity theft. The incident has caused us a lot of problems. One of the problems is a form of phishing/theft using our bank account. Someone has been playind at Royal Panda on my behalf. As soon as we figured out there were things going on that we did not initiate, we contacted our bank and the police. The police have done extensive digital and financial research and as time went by, more and more fraud came to pass. Not only was a lot of money gone, but someone also opened bank accounts on our behalf, opened a credit card on our behalf, put my girlfriend on datingssites, intercepted our mail and so on. As you can probably imagine, we went through hell. After a few months, the police concluded their research. Unfortunately, they did not find a suspect due to the complex nature of the fraud. As of today, new incidents still pop up and we are always one step behind, it’s terrible.

    From the beginning, I had good contacts with an employee from Royal Panda (a guy from Special Care named Roy, I will keep his surname secret on this public forum). He helped me trying to solve the problems regarding Royal Panda. At some point, he got stuck: Royal Panda needed a police report in order to initiate a refund. We contacted the police and asked them if they could provide us such a report. We were told they could not do an official request, because only a prosecuter can file those reports based on Dutch law and they would have needed a suspect for that. The police promised us to send Royal Panda a police-request instead. Royal Panda informed me on Friday 22nd january that they have received this document and would look into it. Their response is very unsatisfying and short, nor did we receive any sympathy at all:

    'We would like to confirm that we have received a letter from the police regarding your case. Unfortunately this is just a statement, not a valid proof in your favor nor a valid request, therefore we cannot issue any refund.
    • Ticket: TVG-835-62596
    • Status: Closed'

    It looks like Royal Panda wants an official report, which cannot be given as stated before. We and the police have done everything in order to settle all the problems, but as you can imagine we would also like to have our money back. We cannot accept and simply don’t understand the fact that Royal Panda keeps money which has fraudulently came tot their posession for themselves. Regular rules and guidelines do no suffice for complex cases like this one.

    We sincerely hope we can get some help on here.
     
  2. Jan 25, 2016
  3. Melvin - Panda

    Melvin - Panda Accredited Casino Representative

    Occupation:
    Casino Manager
    Location:
    Malta
    Hello AMNewHere,

    First of all, sorry to hear that you have been the victim of fraud.

    I confirm that you have informed me via PM. I will investigate and discuss your issue with the responsible departments and let you know as soon as I have an update for you.

    Regards,
    Melvin
     
  4. Jan 25, 2016
  5. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    And you are posting this on a public message board because??

    If I were the victim of identity theft, a public forum is the last place I would take my claim. This should be dealt with by the police either at home or in Malta.
     
  6. Jan 25, 2016
  7. NewHere

    NewHere Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Now that is one swift response, thank you Melvin.

    Casinomeister: as stated above, we did contact police immediately. The police have done extensive research regarding the identity theft issue as soon as we contacted them in october 2015. They even contacted Royal Panda about it as I said. I posted it here now that the police investigation has been finalized and Royal Panda rejected refunding, even when it's a proven fraud.
     
  8. Jan 25, 2016
  9. spoton

    spoton Senior Member webmeister

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Right behind you
    I was victim to identity theft once. The person didn't play online, but rather used my details to buy phones and stuff on credit, and he also empetied my bank accounts a few times. Here the banks and other credit providers didn't need more than the reference number of the report I filed at the police station, so that they could verify I had actually done it. I thought that was the standard almost all places.

    Unless you have been very negligent in any way, I don't see there is anyone else than the credit institutions to blame here as these have issued credit and accepted cards without properly checking who the person that did it was.

    I don't see why you ask Royal Panda to refund though. You should report it to the security people at the banks.
     
  10. Jan 25, 2016
  11. NewHere

    NewHere Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Hi spoton. It is of course also investigated by the bank's security employees and they have contacted Royal Panda as well. But now that's clear where the money went, it is obvious it should come back from there.
     
  12. Jan 25, 2016
  13. onkel

    onkel Experienced Member PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    webmaster
    Location:
    Larnaca, Cyprus, Cyprus
    Quite surprising that the bank isn't giving you a refund and is making you chase the money. Normally it isn't difficult to get the money back from the bank if it's been proven that the card has been stolen.
     
  14. Jan 25, 2016
  15. Casino2014man

    Casino2014man Non-Gambler

    Occupation:
    Noneya
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I think it depends how the money was stolen.

    If it was bank transfer the bank won't usually help.

    If debit/credit card the bank should be giving the money back in full. Problem with this route is it will mean a chargeback and we know what impact that has on playing online!
     
  16. Jan 25, 2016
  17. NewHere

    NewHere Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Indeed surprising onkel. After all the problems and hassle we've had, we also have to fight to get our own money back. It is so very saddening and frustrating.

    The reason this thread is posted here, is because the police filed a request and RP still rejected it. While I do not know how things exactly work here and in Malta, I do find it very odd.
     
  18. Jan 25, 2016
  19. Tirilej

    Tirilej Still a Lady CAG

    Occupation:
    Breathing
    Location:
    Sweden
    Is this the only place where you have been able to find where you're money has gone? An online casino.

    Are you able to see every store and everywhere your money have been used? Are anyone giving it back in that case?
    I don't know the rules for this but it seems really odd that the bank aren't refunding your money if the case is clear as you say it is.

    Royal Panda should be able to get confirmation from the bank also. A paper from the police of something you just have reported can't be enough anyway so I understand why they haven't paid it.
     
  20. Jan 25, 2016
  21. Melvin - Panda

    Melvin - Panda Accredited Casino Representative

    Occupation:
    Casino Manager
    Location:
    Malta
    Hi NewHere,

    Hi, I've looked into it and I have to say it doesn't look good for your case at all. I don't think it'd be wise to get into detail about it on a public forum, for your own best interest, but our risk and fraud prevention is very convinced that this claim is false. I have received their reasoning and evidence and I do agree with them.

    We're happy to inform mister Casinomeister about your situation in more detail so that he can make his own judgement if you agree to that, but I'll leave that up to you.
     
    3 people like this.
  22. Jan 25, 2016
  23. jjezebel37

    jjezebel37 Meister Member mm1

    Occupation:
    sales/marketing
    Location:
    Belfast (Northern Ireland)
    My OH is a fraud officer for Lloyds and after reading this i asked him if it was the casinos onus to pay you back.

    The short answer is no, the bank does any refunds on monies spent.
     
  24. Jan 25, 2016
  25. lockinlove

    lockinlove Staring into the sun PABaccred

    Occupation:
    I work :D
    Location:
    Canada
    looks like you lost control of yourself and lost a bunch of money in the casino.

    I know it sucks but dont make false claims...cause they can find out and you can also be charged.

    Learn your lesson, work your ass off and pay off the debt you've accrued and never do it again.
     
    1 person likes this.
  26. Jan 25, 2016
  27. dunover

    dunover Unofficial T&C's Editor Staff Member CAG PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABinit mm3 webmeister

    Occupation:
    International Money Launderer
    Location:
    the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
    You guys beat me to it - fraudsters who do identity theft DO NOT spend the money in online casinos that pay 96% back! They buy easily convertible goods like foreign currency, phonecards, electrical goods etc.

    I think you've spunked a load of cash online, made a false report to the police knowing they haven't the time or resources to investigate it and prove otherwise, and knowing the police will simply call it a civil matter and tell you to get a bank refund.

    The bank or card company is responsible for refunding you under EU rules, not the retailer! You've got your police incident number now, ahemmm, so go to the bank with it and get your money back that way and be ****ing grateful you haven't been rumbled....:(
     
  28. Jan 25, 2016
  29. petro

    petro Dormant account, per user request PABnoaccred2 PABaccred

    Occupation:
    N/A
    Location:
    Narnia
    I'm not taking sides here but I have some input on banks.

    Some years ago on eBay, I unintentionally bought a stolen laptop.
    I paid about $1500 for it and there was little/no indication that it was stolen.
    I got a phone call sometime after I bought it from the real owner informing me that he was robbed and asking me for the laptop back.

    I was advised by eBay members to contact my bank ASAP and ask if they can help. My bank was the same bank as the seller's and I paid with bank transfer.
    My bank refused to refund me the money. They just said if I want protection from fraud I should purchase insurance from them.
    I had to wait about 9 months to get a refund from eBay. To this day I still think my bank was in the wrong.

    My point is; banks refusing to refund stolen money is nothing unusual. Not in my experience at least.
     
    GC_Konstantin likes this.
  30. Jan 25, 2016
  31. dunover

    dunover Unofficial T&C's Editor Staff Member CAG PABnononaccred PABnonaccred PABinit mm3 webmeister

    Occupation:
    International Money Launderer
    Location:
    the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
    Ah, but you did the deadly!! NEVER pay by bank transfer as there is NO protection and it's irreversible. That's why dodgy sellers use it. ALWAYS use a credit card, if not debit card. Cards have legal protection, in the UK it's 'Section 75'.
     
    GC_Konstantin likes this.
  32. Jan 25, 2016
  33. NewHere

    NewHere Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Netherlands
    While I am obviously very disappointed with the decision, I do understand that things might look odd. People saying 'false caim' and stuff like that, make me very mad and it honestly hurts. I just want you guys to know that it is very hard to proof things you have not done, especially when someone uses your name and stuff like copies of passports and whatnot. As said, apart from this there was/is alot of things going on at once, this is just one of them and we have to deal with it somehow, and that's not easy. Of course there were some things we should have taken care of better, but this way to learn from your mistakes is way too hard, but it'ss starting to look like we have to deal with that as well.

    Melvin, you can close the case. This site was probably not the right place for my case. Thanks anyway.
     
  34. Mar 6, 2016
  35. nutnut

    nutnut 30 day suspension - trollish behavior

    Occupation:
    IP consultant
    Location:
    england
    Lol this thread makes me realise the crap casinos have to deal with, this dude expects us to believe someone takes out ID fraud to GAMBLE on a casino under their name :lolup::lolup::lolup:

    I would love the casino rep to post the truth and proof they have, this person doesn't deserve any sort of privacy after the false claim.
     
    1 person likes this.
  36. Mar 7, 2016
  37. Melvin - Panda

    Melvin - Panda Accredited Casino Representative

    Occupation:
    Casino Manager
    Location:
    Malta
    Hi nutnut,

    I understand the curiosity and it can be very interesting, but unfortunately that's something I can't share with you :p. Not only because of the player privacy, but also to not give away anything about our fraud prevention methods and reasoning.
     
    1 person likes this.
  38. Mar 8, 2016
  39. BMWSTACK

    BMWSTACK Ueber Meister

    Occupation:
    Work
    Location:
    US

    Lol, looks like your running away with your tail between your legs. This statement is not one made by someone who swears they have been scammed.

    Here's my guess, the casino does know it was op depositing and maybe there was a police report, so now the casino can provide info to show it was a false report? Just a theory.

    I didn't believe the story from the beginning because as other had said, thieves don't go deposit money at a casino. Wouldn't make sense to be so slick in ripping people off and then depositing it somewhere where the money will never be able to be paid back (to the thief).
     
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