Roxy Palace not paying me

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Jaime

Dormant account
Joined
Apr 20, 2013
Location
gambletown
I want to file a complaint against Roxy Palace and Casino Splendido. I have been a regular player there since November 2012.

I never had any major problems with them before. Support seemed professional and my withdrawals where always paid on time with the exception of one time when there was a mix up whether I was verified or not.

Last week they send me pretty good bonuses offer; a 30% daily bonus for Silver Members of 150 euro . In the next days I deposited a total of 4000 euro and had one win of 2843 euro. A few days ago I saw that they had only paid me 500 euro and tried to login. I got the message: the casino has refused you to logon. Your account has been locked.

I went straight to live chat on the website and they told me I was banned based on bonus abuse quoting term 8.8 of their terms and conditions. I think this a total unreasonable term and that this also goes against the rules of accreditation at www.casinomeister.com. I told them about this but they told me they were not ruled by www.casinomeister.com but Ecogra.

The term basically gives them the right to not pay me if they feel like it. I think this is very unfair. I feel really frustrated and betrayed by these casinos who always been so good to me. I have tried to reason with them and they told me they would forward my concerns to management but I have not heard back from them.

I will do a Pitch a Bitch very soon, but I want to warn the whole gambling community here about the practices of these casinos. If you win too much and they see you as a bonus abuser they just not pay your profits.
 

dionysus

Contest Manager
Staff member
CAG
MM
Joined
Apr 27, 2009
Location
the land of snow and maple syrup
Roxy is accredited here. Your first step should be to pm the rep via http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/roxy.html

and, while it's fine to share, exhaust your primary resources first (ie pm the rep)
bonus denial is completely within their perview
not paying entitled winnings is not...did you breach any terms?

if you intend to file a PAB and feel you met all criteria as per Ts and Cs, send it on
be sure to read the FAQ and read it fully
once in, stop posting here
gl
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
I want to file a complaint against Roxy Palace and Casino Splendido. I have been a regular player there since November 2012.

I never had any major problems with them before. Support seemed professional and my withdrawals where always paid on time with the exception of one time when there was a mix up whether I was verified or not.

Last week they send me pretty good bonuses offer; a 30% daily bonus for Silver Members of 150 euro . In the next days I deposited a total of 4000 euro and had one win of 2843 euro. A few days ago I saw that they had only paid me 500 euro and tried to login. I got the message: the casino has refused you to logon. Your account has been locked.

I went straight to live chat on the website and they told me I was banned based on bonus abuse quoting term 8.8 of their terms and conditions. I think this a total unreasonable term and that this also goes against the rules of accreditation at www.casinomeister.com. I told them about this but they told me they were not ruled by www.casinomeister.com but Ecogra.

The term basically gives them the right to not pay me if they feel like it. I think this is very unfair. I feel really frustrated and betrayed by these casinos who always been so good to me. I have tried to reason with them and they told me they would forward my concerns to management but I have not heard back from them.

I will do a Pitch a Bitch very soon, but I want to warn the whole gambling community here about the practices of these casinos. If you win too much and they see you as a bonus abuser they just not pay your profits.
Don't warn us as we need to hear both sides of the story first. If you are gonna PAB so much the better as MaxD will get to the bottom of this.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Term 8.8 is:-

8.The Casino reserves the right to refuse to register you as a player or to de-register and cancel your account for any reason whatsoever at any time without notice to you. Any balance in your account at the time of such cancellation will be refunded to you using the method of payment as determined by the Casino. However, the Casino reserves the right, in its sole discretion, to void any winnings and appropriate any balance in your Casino account in any of the following circumstances: 1.if you are not of legal age;
2.if you reside in a jurisdiction where Play at the Casino is prohibited by law;
3.if you provide incorrect or misleading registration information;
4.if you have "charged back" any of the purchases made with your credit card or other applicable purchase method on your Casino account;
5.if you are found cheating or if it is determined by the Casino that you have employed or made use of a system (including machines, computers, software or other automated systems) designed specifically to defeat the Casino;
6.if you have more than one active account at the Casino;
7.if the name on your Casino account does not match the name associated with the payment method used to make purchases on your Casino account;
8.if you have not played at the Casino on an individual basis for personal entertainment only (that is, you have played in a professional sense or in concert with other player(s) as part of a club, group, etc.);
9.if you have allowed or permitted (intentionally or unintentionally) someone else to play on your Casino account;
10.if you participate in a Casino promotion and cash-in before fulfilling the requirements of that particular promotion; OR
11.if the Casino should become aware that you have played at any other online casino under any of the circumstances set out in 8.1 to 8.10 above.
It looks like a vague BS term unless they have definite proof. Unlike Poker, such proof does not really exist, only "grounds for suspicion".

The term has nothing to do with "bonus abuse" itself as it applies irrespective of bonuses being claimed.

Confiscating winnings for vague "bonus abuse" claims is against the standards for accreditation.

Operational Standards
•Must pay winnings in a timely manner.*
Must not disqualify any player from a payout if terms & conditions are met, except for situations of fraud (multiple-accounts, bogus ID documents, chargebacks, etc.,).
Must not confiscate winnings for vague & unclear reasons, such as "irregular playing patterns" or "bonus abuse", without specific T&C violations.
•Must not implement terms that can be construed as "unfair" towards the player.
•No player shall be involuntarily placed into a situation which breaches the terms and conditions during the course of play.
•Must pay out progressive jackpot wins in full or in reasonable chunks, regardless of any terms and conditions limiting payouts.**
•Must remove any bonus and associated playthrough requirements at the request of the player if play has not commenced.
•Will not entice players to reverse cash withdrawals with bonuses or other incentives.
•Will not use outsourced support. Player support must be in-house.
The next step is to PAB. The casino will then have to back up it's claim that term 8.8 was "specifically violated" with evidence.

I am also concerned about the lack of information on their site about anything other than the welcome bonus, specifically the terms and conditions for promotions offered to regular players.

Since they quoted 8.8, I presume there is no actual violation of the bonus terms themselves, such as the 25% max bet rule or play on zero weighted games, both of which could result in an adjustment of winnings.

The "we are not governed by Casinomeister" remark is likely to have come from front line CS who have no real idea what CM is, let alone that the casino they work for has voluntarily agreed to be "governed by" the standards for accreditation. A careless and potentially damaging remark to fire at a player who KNOWS that they are accredited here, and what that status entails.

Complaining to the LGA would be a waste of time. Apart from PAB, the other viable option is eCogra.
 

Nifty29

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 20, 2001
Location
Turn right, then right. then right again
Term 8.8 is:-



It looks like a vague BS term unless they have definite proof. Unlike Poker, such proof does not really exist, only "grounds for suspicion".

The term has nothing to do with "bonus abuse" itself as it applies irrespective of bonuses being claimed.

Confiscating winnings for vague "bonus abuse" claims is against the standards for accreditation.



The next step is to PAB. The casino will then have to back up it's claim that term 8.8 was "specifically violated" with evidence.

I am also concerned about the lack of information on their site about anything other than the welcome bonus, specifically the terms and conditions for promotions offered to regular players.

Since they quoted 8.8, I presume there is no actual violation of the bonus terms themselves, such as the 25% max bet rule or play on zero weighted games, both of which could result in an adjustment of winnings.

The "we are not governed by Casinomeister" remark is likely to have come from front line CS who have no real idea what CM is, let alone that the casino they work for has voluntarily agreed to be "governed by" the standards for accreditation. A careless and potentially damaging remark to fire at a player who KNOWS that they are accredited here, and what that status entails.

Complaining to the LGA would be a waste of time. Apart from PAB, the other viable option is eCogra.
Like Chu said....lets see the FACTS before we start making huge assumptions and uneducated guesses.

Unless PAB forms are being cc'ed to you now, you have no more facts or information than what the OP provided, which is pretty much nothing.

You said the front line CS have "no idea" and really don't know what they're on about, but you're happy to accept as gospel their statement that the OP has been banned under term 8.8. It might not even BE that at all.

Your experience should tell you, as mine does, that complainants rarely include ALL the relevant facts, especially if it doesn't help their case. So, how about we see how the PAB goes?
 

akrus88

Registered
Joined
Aug 6, 2012
Location
Finland
IF the only reason they provided for not pay the player is that 8.8. term, then it is really vague and unreasonable.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Like Chu said....lets see the FACTS before we start making huge assumptions and uneducated guesses.

Unless PAB forms are being cc'ed to you now, you have no more facts or information than what the OP provided, which is pretty much nothing.

You said the front line CS have "no idea" and really don't know what they're on about, but you're happy to accept as gospel their statement that the OP has been banned under term 8.8. It might not even BE that at all.

Your experience should tell you, as mine does, that complainants rarely include ALL the relevant facts, especially if it doesn't help their case. So, how about we see how the PAB goes?
Another expectation players have of accredited casinos is competent "in house" CS. Whilst they may not know about CM, their JOB involves knowing how their own business works. Front line CS would not have determined the violation details themselves, but merely relayed what the security department had noted on the account. It is therefore "management", not front line CS, that have determined that term 8.8 had been violated.

This differentiation between "personal" and "professional" gambler is BS, the casino does not have the facts about what the player does for a living, and so called "professional gamblers" are a rare breed, often seen at the races rather than in a casino playing games of chance.

We have already seen some pretty wild interpretations of this type of term from other casinos, and in one case players were deemed to have violated such a term simply because they followed a popular radio tipster when placing their bets.

Many of us technically violate the second clause in this term as we are part of the "group" that is Casinomeister, and we discuss gambling strategies, promotions, etc, and sometimes act on the recommendations of others. At what point does this become a "material" violation that causes the casino to cry "foul".

The real issue here is that the expected behaviour is to pay the player and THEN ban them from further promotions if they feel the bonuses are not being used in the correct spirit, rather than actual terms having been violated.

Unlike poker, there is no real benefit in colluding as a group as the games are all player vs house, and are random. I also can't see how a 30% bonus can be "abused" without falling foul of the specific max bet and game exclusion terms.
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
I have my suspicions especially after noticing the title of the thread. It seems that its more a case of bonus banning and then locking the account than non-payment. Should this be the case, can a mod kindly change the title of the thread first before waiting for the PAB. There does seem to be a piece missing from this jigsaw as it does seem unlikely that Roxy would simply lock an account due to bonus usage. I claim bonuses at Roxy Palace all the time and was always paid when I won. They would have simply curtailed the bonuses so there should be something we don't know yet and that could be from either party.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
I have my suspicions especially after noticing the title of the thread. It seems that its more a case of bonus banning and then locking the account than non-payment. Should this be the case, can a mod kindly change the title of the thread first before waiting for the PAB. There does seem to be a piece missing from this jigsaw as it does seem unlikely that Roxy would simply lock an account due to bonus usage. I claim bonuses at Roxy Palace all the time and was always paid when I won. They would have simply curtailed the bonuses so there should be something we don't know yet and that could be from either party.
I have personal experience of being bonus banned there. Rather than be honest and TELL me, they gave me some BS about my spam filter having suddenly decided to block all their newsletters, then they discovered a problem their end and they returned for a while, and it was only when I called them out in public that they admitted I had been bonus banned as I was ahead over the lifetime of my account.

The problem is not really the bonus ban itself, but all the BS and dishonesty surrounding it.

I read the complaint as not just a bonus ban, but a confiscation of the winnings and return of only 500, accompanied by locking the account.

My Roxy Palace account was never locked, it is merely bonus banned. Should I lose around 5K and go back into negative territory, I am sure the newsletters will suddenly reappear. Even odder, I was made a Roxy Palace VIP in my prolonged absence, and even given a free entry into the first Grand Slam tournament, the one with the million dollar first prize.
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
I have personal experience of being bonus banned there. Rather than be honest and TELL me, they gave me some BS about my spam filter having suddenly decided to block all their newsletters, then they discovered a problem their end and they returned for a while, and it was only when I called them out in public that they admitted I had been bonus banned as I was ahead over the lifetime of my account.

The problem is not really the bonus ban itself, but all the BS and dishonesty surrounding it.

I read the complaint as not just a bonus ban, but a confiscation of the winnings and return of only 500, accompanied by locking the account.

My Roxy Palace account was never locked, it is merely bonus banned. Should I lose around 5K and go back into negative territory, I am sure the newsletters will suddenly reappear. Even odder, I was made a Roxy Palace VIP in my prolonged absence, and even given a free entry into the first Grand Slam tournament, the one with the million dollar first prize.
I am not sure the OP was denied the rest of his winnings from the tone of his post. If the casino had locked the account and refused to pay the rest of his winnings its against the philosophy of this site ie ban after paying winnings. I do think we should let Max have the opportunity to hanle the PAB which the OP promised to do. Should it be a case of lock and confiscation of winnings due to a unilateral interpretation of bonus abuse I am sure Bryan will think about pulling the accreditation from them.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
I am not sure the OP was denied the rest of his winnings from the tone of his post. If the casino had locked the account and refused to pay the rest of his winnings its against the philosophy of this site ie ban after paying winnings. I do think we should let Max have the opportunity to hanle the PAB which the OP promised to do. Should it be a case of lock and confiscation of winnings due to a unilateral interpretation of bonus abuse I am sure Bryan will think about pulling the accreditation from them.
The title is "Roxy Palace not paying me", a good starting point from which to develop the idea that this is a confiscation of winnings issue, not merely a bonus ban.
 

chayton

aka LooHoo
webmeister
PABnonaccred
CAG
Joined
Jun 5, 2006
Location
Edmonton Canada
Well the OP shouldn't post anymore if they're planning on doing a PAB, but I'm curious to know what game(s) they played. The term seems to hint at collusion - playing with groups or clubs etc. Which really only works if you're playing table games, right?
 

micro

Dormant account
PABaccred
Joined
Apr 27, 2013
Location
Germany
I have got a similar problem with Roypalace and I have tried to send a PM to their rep but it didnt work. A message said:

Roxy has exceeded their stored private messages quota and cannot accept further messages until they clear some space.

So hopefully the rep will do something about it soon :)
 

hadeel

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 1, 2011
Location
netherlands
The same problem

Hello,

I have exactly the same problem been a player for almost 3 years lost allot within the times they send me a special promo that I could get a daily bonus and after I won a very big amount. I cashed out, they locked my account and returned my deposit. Tried to PM the roxy rep and got the same quote like micro.
Maybe the rep can clear his mailbox.
 

Webzcas

Winter is Coming!
Joined
Mar 31, 2005
Location
Block S25, South Stand, Ashton Gate, BS3

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Hello,

I have exactly the same problem been a player for almost 3 years lost allot within the times they send me a special promo that I could get a daily bonus and after I won a very big amount. I cashed out, they locked my account and returned my deposit. Tried to PM the roxy rep and got the same quote like micro.
Maybe the rep can clear his mailbox.
This is even MORE worrying. A loyal player for 3 years who suddenly gets accused of a serious "crime" that warrants the confiscation of a big win. If there was an issue this serious, they had 3 years to spot it. Many casinos bonus ban players who win big and get ahead over the lifetime of their account, but when that one big win is confiscated as well, we are into rogue territory.

I got ahead at Roxy Palace, and later on got ahead at Splendido. This got me bonus banned at each, but I was paid the wins that took me ahead, and my account was not locked. It seems that bonus banning big winners is no longer good enough, they are starting to confiscate the big wins themselves from some players.

This case started with a confiscation under this "professional player" BS rather than a specific violation of the terms governing playing style with a bonus, so I would presume such direct violation did not take place.

How the hell does one actually define a "professional player" in any case? I play a fair bit, does that mean I have crossed the line and become a "professional"? Bryan runs a website and is certainly working within the industry, this is certainly his "profession", yet he also plays the casinos. Would this make him a "professional" in their eyes, as he certainly has much more insight into how things work on the operator side than most players ever could.

In another thread, the affiliate program behind Roxy Palace has confiscated already earned revenue from a bunch of affiliates through a retrospective application of draconian changes to the program terms. It is often said that a casino that screws it's players is likely to screw it's affiliates, or vice versa.

First, we have a fuss in the affiliate world about Roxy Affiliates screwing over some long term loyal affiliates, and later we get this thread that shows they are using an ill defined "professional player" term among others to confiscate a final big win from players prior to bonus banning them for getting ahead over the lifetime of their account.

As a player, it says to me that their definition of "professional player" is simply a player that ends up ahead over the lifetime of their account, even though no terms of play are broken. What they mean by "professional" in this case is better described as "lucky". There are occasions where I have had an unbelievable run of luck on a casino I have played and lost overall at for years, and this has pushed me way ahead, covering years of steady losses and more on top. If this is likely to be met with a confiscation on the grounds that in order to get such a run I must be a "professional", then it is a place I don't want to play at as I can only ever be allowed to lose.
 

micro

Dormant account
PABaccred
Joined
Apr 27, 2013
Location
Germany
The account of the Roxy rep is not dormant anymore and I have sent a PM to him asking him to help me. My winnings were confiscated quoting that strange rule number 8.8 but I did not breach any rule.

Who knows to how many players they have done something like that. Only a few players know the the casinomeister site I guess and therefore they may have done that to very many players thinking they would get away with it. Hopefully things will change now that some players have posted about it here.

I will keep you updated.
 

Sovietsky

Experienced Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2012
Location
Swe
Oh wow!

I remember a few months ago I got some free spins from them on immortal romance and it was in swedish currency so instead of giving me 3kr (0.30€) they gave me 0.3kr (0.03€) worth a spin of total of 30 spins i think it was.

Im not a customer there anymore and reading this I don't regret it a bit.
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
I kind of find this worrying. Solid MG groups/casinos like Roxy/Splendido and Lucky Nugget are misbehaving. In the past MG casinos bar those like CR or GP can be relied on to do the right thing. I notice they have been slowly delaying payments as well. I have very smallish cashouts from LN and Splendido that haven't reached me yet though they were initiated in late-April and my payment method is an e-wallet. Hopefully, they have not fallen on such hard times and start using such devious practices. This is contagious and possibly other MGs will start following suit.
 

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