Regarding MG and return percentage.

Rusty

Banned User - repetitive flaming
Joined
Jul 23, 2006
Location
Manchester UK
I did say I would not post but I think if you are going to play online you should be armed with as much knowledge as possible as to how the software is likely to perform.

In my experience accross multiple MG casinos over the Years the returns are around 88-92% some a little higher and some lower, overall a little less than what would be expected.

Following any unlikely winning streak and cashout has followed an equally unlikely losing streak and this is without exception so obviously an unlikely coincidence there.

I have just closed my account with Ladbrokes after experiencing this again and here are my statistics as provided by Ladbrokes for Cashapillar for the last 10 Days though according to my calculations the figures are even worse.

(My overall payout at Ladbrokes is within the expected range, though largely because of one exceptional winning session, this is not the issue)

Total games played: 3806
Total staked: 1,001.06
Total returned: 669.00

I have made 370 in deposits lowrolling in this period and made no cashouts.
I played Cashapillar almost exclusively but other games have similar statistics so according to my calculations about 5000 games and 65% return.

Those figures on their own coming immediately off the back of a good cashout should set alarm bells ringing but when I match it to past experiences with other MG casinos then there is a clear pattern that suggests very strongly the slots are weighted and account history is factored in.

I have almost identical experiences with RTG, a big win followed by Thousands of spins and lots of dconsecutive deposits with below 70% return.

The statistics are there, fact, so I can either put it down to coincidence that my highest run of payouts are followed by lowest run of payouts or I can take a more considered scientific view.

Of course these are my online slot playing experiences and of course you should make any judgment from you own results.
I am just putting this into the collective online conscience so that you are aware of what to look for.

Of course if nobody else (real players please) has had these experiences then my statistics stand alone as a unique and extroadinary example of cultured variance. ;)

My advice is to play low stakes and enjoy it for the good entertainment it can be but be aware in my experience a time of unprecedented abundance will be followed by a time of unprecedented drought.
Takes the edge of it doesn't it?

Good luck all.:thumbsup:
 

Tengil

Senior Member
Joined
May 4, 2006
Location
Finland
Nothing extraordinary and a very small sample.
One thing I have noticed it doesnt seem to be about the number of bets, rather the wagered amount.
These stats (includes some VP but mostly slots) are from a MG casino and indicates that when the wagering was high the payout percentage was quite much higher. Altough thats logical, with higher payout the money lasts longer.

January
Wagered 12,154.07
Payouts 11,084.03
Bets 1070
Percentage 91%

February
Wagered 67.04
Payouts 37.04
Bets 135
Percentage 55%

March
Wagered 17,526.68
Payouts 15,848.43
Bets 17359
Percentage 90%

April
Wagered 4,435.35
Payouts 3,609.35
Bets 5810
Percentage 81%

May
Wagered 1,372.69
Payouts 962.70
Bets 1300
Percentage 70%

June
Wagered 5,971.03
Payouts 4,807.02
Bets 10080
Percentage 81%

July
Wagered 17,294.56
Payouts 16,187.64
Bets 5989
Percentage 94%

August
Wagered 4,251.76
Payouts 3,716.68
Bets 2054
Percentage 87%


At one RTG I had under 87% with about 60k wagering and about 80k bets.
 

AudiManinBoro

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 19, 2006
Location
UK
I know for a fact that in some certain ways ALL mg casinos are linked SOMEWHERE to a certain server or a central database of some fashion. In terms of having a lucky streak, your right at some point the lucky streak will cease and it wont matter Which mg casino you play at afterwards, your losing streak will continue. I KNOW all mg casinos are linked because i have seen on a few occasions now, that sometimes there is a problem logging on. Ok you think so this casino isnt working, lets try another mg, oh look this one doesnt log on either, how about a third? same thing?? surely they cant ALL be like this. Well sorry but they were and are and ive seen it a few times now, and if that doesnt tell you they are all linked in some fashion you need to really take your head out of the sand :rolleyes:
 

slotplayer

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
webmeister
Joined
Oct 11, 2006
Location
USA
I know for a fact that in some certain ways ALL mg casinos are linked SOMEWHERE to a certain server or a central database of some fashion. In terms of having a lucky streak, your right at some point the lucky streak will cease and it wont matter Which mg casino you play at afterwards, your losing streak will continue. I KNOW all mg casinos are linked because i have seen on a few occasions now, that sometimes there is a problem logging on. Ok you think so this casino isnt working, lets try another mg, oh look this one doesnt log on either, how about a third? same thing?? surely they cant ALL be like this. Well sorry but they were and are and ive seen it a few times now, and if that doesnt tell you they are all linked in some fashion you need to really take your head out of the sand :rolleyes:

Ever notice how all the MG games will be dead at the same time?

I've only played a couple of MG's and no other brands but I don't need to keep any data to know the payback % is quite low. It seems to me that ever since that guy won the 5 mil (around April 2008) something changed, before that they seemed to give decent bang for your buck. Now it takes hundreds of spins to get a bonus round and it's usually at the penny wagers.
 

AussieDave

Banned User
Joined
Dec 24, 2005
Location
Australia
I know for a fact that in some certain ways ALL mg casinos are linked SOMEWHERE to a certain server or a central database of some fashion.

Paycheck and CashCheck link directly back to MG servers. This also took place in the pre Viper years.

I do have a sneaky suspicion that some MG casino's post Viper use additional systems to track play. Of course my hunch centre's around winning and losing, but I don't want to start any conspiracy agenda's just yet :D

When I was really going hard (I only play slots) doing around 3million play thru a year, there were times when all of a sudden it's like someone (or something) flicked the win switch. I couldn't lose. This would general last for 20 - 30 min then go totally cold again.

<derail>
There was talk 4 maybe 5 years ago that Playtech casinos actively monitored playing styles with Video Poker and used this data, to influence card draws, based on what the player usually held. Didn't play Playtech so it didn't concern me.
</derail>


Times when I'm getting fully bleed dry, I've tried up to 7 casinos in one night, but all produced the same results.

Granted sometime it all comes down the Lady Luck. But sometimes you just have to wonder.

The longest losing streak was 4 months and in that time I dropped around $30K. By the end of it I was about ready to call it quits, for good. I contacted my VIP manager, had a bitch and the next month the slots hit no matter what I did, or no matter what I played. That continued for a few days but then everything went back to usual again.

I generally consider myself to be rather fortunate when playing, so although I don't expect to win all the time, I do from many years of playing know that my losing streaks don't last that long.

Of course I could always get my pay-logs and suss out the pay-back percentage. But Doing this manually is going to take me 10 years.

Although I think some casinos are hooked into MG in other ways over and above Playcheck & Cashcheck, I don't see how you'd ever prove this beyond doubt.

If I had a dollar for every time the question is asked...Are online casino games really random? I'd be a millionaire. Still it's a damn good question :thumbsup:

Being blown off with the usual answer of our games use a RNG (random number generator) doesn't really say much. Because there is more than just one type of RNG.

Playing the devil's advocated & taking this a step further, unlike a land based casino where all games are monitored by a government gaming authority, online casinos are not. Before you say oh eCogra monitors this, think again...

Old / Expired Link
eCogra states "While eCOGRA does its utmost to ensure compliance with its principles, it cannot offer 100% assurance that the operation of any games at any given site is at all times in accordance with the eCOGRA requirements."

Although I have no guarantees of what really takes places 100% of the time with RNG's gaming servers. I only play at 32Red (and yes they are MG) least I feel I'm getting a fair deal.

Cheers
T
 

Jane_E

Dormant account
PABnononaccred
Joined
Dec 21, 2007
Location
Sweden / Orebro
MG sucks they have changed somthing, impossibal to get some winnings this days , take a look at winner screenshot this days you almost NEVER SEE some big MG winnings take a look a year ago almost every day tons of big MG winnings so somthing have happend since mars april this year !!!!!


Stop playing at MG so maybe they one day understund they will lose al players if things countinue like MG works today !
 

XOXOXOXOXOX

Let em spin...
PABaccred
Joined
Dec 2, 2008
Location
O Canada!
I know for a fact that in some certain ways ALL mg casinos are linked SOMEWHERE to a certain server or a central database of some fashion. In terms of having a lucky streak, your right at some point the lucky streak will cease and it wont matter Which mg casino you play at afterwards, your losing streak will continue. I KNOW all mg casinos are linked because i have seen on a few occasions now, that sometimes there is a problem logging on. Ok you think so this casino isnt working, lets try another mg, oh look this one doesnt log on either, how about a third? same thing?? surely they cant ALL be like this. Well sorry but they were and are and ive seen it a few times now, and if that doesnt tell you they are all linked in some fashion you need to really take your head out of the sand :rolleyes:

I actually was suspecting the same about RTG because I was having horrible dry spells everywhere else after i won 2K on one.

Interesting how they(MG) determine that you already won and "ban" you from winning again if you have a separate account for each casino?? :what: I tried playing on my laptop instead, not sure if it help though.... :oops:
 

XOXOXOXOXOX

Let em spin...
PABaccred
Joined
Dec 2, 2008
Location
O Canada!
No, of course i don't have a proof, sorry may be i did not phase it properly ( multitasking at work lol)

i was thinking how it could be done because i was rather annoyed with RTG as i could not win again and then read this post about MG.

Do you have solid proof (as in facts) of this?

Otherwise like my post it is just speculations.

Cheers
T
 

AussieDave

Banned User
Joined
Dec 24, 2005
Location
Australia
i was rather annoyed with RTG as i could not win again and then read this post about MG.

[derail]
You won 2K and then experienced dry spells on other RTG's. I'm intrigued to ask a couple of questions if you don't mind :)
What length of dry spells? And where they combined or did you have reasonable wins inbetween?
Where the other RTG's you played at from 1 group or mixed?
Do you normally play only a few favourite slots or do you try many in one session?
Have you won since?
How much do you play per spin?
[/derail]


Cheers
T
 

slotplayer

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
webmeister
Joined
Oct 11, 2006
Location
USA
MG sucks they have changed somthing, impossibal to get some winnings this days , take a look at winner screenshot this days you almost NEVER SEE some big MG winnings take a look a year ago almost every day tons of big MG winnings so somthing have happend since mars april this year !!!!!


Stop playing at MG so maybe they one day understund they will lose al players if things countinue like MG works today !

I posted the exact same thing in an earlier. Did you too notice a change last April?

I did get a $30 bonus last night and it took about 210 spins at 20 cents wager to finally get a bonus round. I was tempted to deposit after that went but refrained.
 

AussieDave

Banned User
Joined
Dec 24, 2005
Location
Australia
I did get a $30 bonus last night and it took about 210 spins at 20 cents wager to finally get a bonus round.

Considering that 210 spins is well within average expectancy of getting a bonus round at an MG slot, I don't know if your using this as a bad example or a good one:what:

Of course it would help if you post the slot name :thumbsup:

Cheers
T
 

slotplayer

Paleo Meister (means really, really old)
webmeister
Joined
Oct 11, 2006
Location
USA
Considering that 210 spins is well within average expectancy of getting a bonus round at an MG slot, I don't know if your using this as a bad example or a good one:what:

Of course it would help if you post the slot name :thumbsup:

Cheers
T

I was playing NetWork News when I happened to check the stats. Personally, I think 210 spins is really bad, but maybe not for that game or an MG. Also I've never played any other brands and tend to compare online casino slots to the neighboring state land casino slots, perhaps unfair.

Normally I don't check the stats. I usually go by my internal clock, ie.. when I start to get impatient because I haven't hit a bonus round.

I remember in March of 2008 and prior when I used to play Mermaids Millions, Reel Strike and What on Earth I don't ever recall getting impatient that I didn't hit a bonus round like I do now when playing these particular games. On the contrary, the bonus rounds would be much closer together and the first one would occur in much fewer spins.

I had to stop playing them because they're brutal now. I remember winning enough on Mermaids Millions at nickels and/or dimes to eventually increase my wager to $1 per payline and it would still hit. As a matter of fact, I hit $4k a few times and $7k once. Seems hard to win $100 now and if it does it dies after that, especially if I increase the wager.

I'm gun shy at this point.
 

XOXOXOXOXOX

Let em spin...
PABaccred
Joined
Dec 2, 2008
Location
O Canada!
Hi Trezz... see in purple

[derail]
You won 2K and then experienced dry spells on other RTG's. I'm intrigued to ask a couple of questions if you don't mind :)
What length of dry spells? And where they combined or did you have reasonable wins in between? I only playing on RTG since November 08 so i don't have much experience. The RTG casino where i won was my first one. It seemed so easy compare to MG so I started signing up on other RTGs (9 of them) but no much luck...
Where the other RTG's you played at from 1 group or mixed? Mixed
Do you normally play only a few favourite slots or do you try many in one session? many games if funds allow but not all
Have you won since? Yes, after a while I won a couple of hundreds on Inet but only could cashout 100 because it was ND bonus. Also, won on Clubwords but they cut out half of my winnings and i still did not take any money but its a different story...
How much do you play per spin? usually $1, max $5.
[/derail]


Cheers
T

may be I am just paranoid but don't we all :rolleyes:
 

footdr

Banned User: PITA violations of the Forum Rules
Joined
Jan 13, 2006
Location
cyberspace
RTG BEST PAYOUT FOR ME

My Microgaming experience in last several months has been very poor.
I have begun withdrawing after doubling my money and that seems to work versus going for larger cashins.

RTG has been very rewarding. Cashin at an RTG virtually daily for 500.00-1000.00plus.
 

chuchu59

gambling addict
PABnonaccred
CAG
PABinit
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
I was playing NetWork News when I happened to check the stats. Personally, I think 210 spins is really bad, but maybe not for that game or an MG. Also I've never played any other brands and tend to compare online casino slots to the neighboring state land casino slots, perhaps unfair.

Normally I don't check the stats. I usually go by my internal clock, ie.. when I start to get impatient because I haven't hit a bonus round.

I remember in March of 2008 and prior when I used to play Mermaids Millions, Reel Strike and What on Earth I don't ever recall getting impatient that I didn't hit a bonus round like I do now when playing these particular games. On the contrary, the bonus rounds would be much closer together and the first one would occur in much fewer spins.

I had to stop playing them because they're brutal now. I remember winning enough on Mermaids Millions at nickels and/or dimes to eventually increase my wager to $1 per payline and it would still hit. As a matter of fact, I hit $4k a few times and $7k once. Seems hard to win $100 now and if it does it dies after that, especially if I increase the wager.

I'm gun shy at this point.

I must say I kinda hate Network News as bonus rounds have always been few and far between. Even if you do it, the payout sucks and it will seem whatever you hit, even in the bonus rounds, the payouts will not be astronomical. Mermaids Millions is somewhat better and it will normally give you something back even during or after a rather poor session so you get more playtime. Reel Strike is similar.
 

Rusty

Banned User - repetitive flaming
Joined
Jul 23, 2006
Location
Manchester UK
My Microgaming experience in last several months has been very poor.
I have begun withdrawing after doubling my money and that seems to work versus going for larger cashins.

RTG has been very rewarding. Cashin at an RTG virtually daily for 500.00-1000.00plus.

I am fascinated, may I ask;

Playing what games?
How long have you been winning "virtually daily for 500.00-1000.00plus"
Do you have proof of this?

(and pm me on how you cracked the servers ;))
 

hobobiker

Dormant account
Joined
May 4, 2007
Location
Manchester UK

RTG has been very rewarding. Cashin at an RTG virtually daily for 500.00-1000.00plus.

ah ha but ...here i am sitting in my tin can ...far above the clouds ....planet earth is blue ....and there's nothing i can do.....
can you hear me major t........o........m......................
 

silverfox38

Dormant account
Joined
Aug 30, 2008
Location
Dorset
Nirvana to the disgruntled gamblers on here re online casinos claiming random
deal as in a land based casino
The short answer to this is: computers can not create random numbers.

and remember you have this--
obtained from howtocomplain.com

Here's a few tips:
1) Make contact about your complaint and be reasonable in allowing them to fix the problem
2) If that fails, send a letter registered post and keep a copy saying you will in 7 days of receipt of this letter invoke legal action.
3) Get your litigator to send a legal letter of intent.
4) Then sue them.
5) In most cases they will settle.
6) Even if you have issued a county court summons, they will settle.
7) If they don't settle, you will have saved yourself weeks, even months of phone calls, emails and letters, not to mention the strain and stress.
By using this method, you transfer the strain and stress to them. Let them employ a solicitor at their expense. Remember, with any claim under 5000.00, you do not get costs. Hit them where it hurts ...in their pockets.
9) Now stop messing around and get your justice !!!
 
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