Providers moving the goal posts

[Guntis]

Hey mate, Here I can speak only for myself. looking back at my game history, this year I have lost roughly more than I lose in 2 years, playing the exact same games at exactly the same bets.

My most favourite games are (used to be):

300 Shields
On this game, I have got nearly 50 at least 1000x wins received between 2017-18 by playing 700 spins at most per a session. The biggest win was 3900x and the rest of them between 1000x - 2000x.

This year I was playing it in my usual manner and got only 3 or 4 wins. Sometimes even seems like there is no 3 scatters at all in this game and to get a retrigger in the bonus game is impossible.

And if, IF I get to the top stage - it pays a 100x-300x bet, which is very unusual at this game from my personal experience.
I think that big wins and their frequency are clearly reduced.

Montezuma
Again, between 2017-2018 used to be an amazing game to play and leave a casino with a profit in the pocket. Nowadays, it has become complete trash where you can almost instantly determine - play it or leave it.

The frequency of 100x wins on this game is pretty much comparable to 500x in the earlier days.

I also think that there were changes made since the moment these game providers started to work under the SG (Scientific Gaming) brand.

Girls Wih Guns, The Finer Reels of Life, Playboy

I not gonna comment much - here anyone must be a blind horse to not notice a difference at these games behaviour comparing 2017,18 and 2019.

 

[Bloatgoat]

I said it before, and i will repeat myself here again and no matter what trancemonkey or another finds about it, there's a good chance that casino's are changing their revenue model, basicly your deposits with other players are randomly distributed with a 95 ~ 97% RTP.

So if you have 10 players on montly basis depositting 1000 all together, 95 to 97% is being re-distributed. Simple as that. Less liability, more profit.

You know i find it funny, when i deposit something like 100 euro. And i hit 100 spins x 1 euro autoplay on one game, at around 80 euro i play another game while the same one is still running, when i start losing on chilli the other game just simply compensates with big hits out of nowhere.

It's like my deposit is automaticly wagering x amount to the point that i lose. This behaviour is random in a complete different way. You dont tell me games are genuine random, if no matter what my bet or strategy is, all slots just lose on default. You'd say that out of 3 slots one has to hit, well they dont.

And it's obviously random ofcourse that at slow times of the day where no dog is playing except for me, nothing works, but when the casino is busy (i.e 19:00 until 01:00) hits flying all over the place. Big random my white naked ass

 

[Matti]

I hope there is enough aliminium in the world for all the hats needed.

 

[Bloatgoat]

Aluminium will be the new kobalt in 2020.

 

[dionysus]

havent you quit, like, every other week, and each time it's your last time?
convinced it's rigged, yet still playing

 

[Bloatgoat]

I never said it was rigged, gambling is'nt what it claimed to be anymore, that slots are genuine random, or slots could hit any time etc.

That control is more shoved to the casino's now it seems, all well calculated with lesser liability.

 

[snorky510238]

I hope there is enough aliminium in the world for all the hats needed.

Fortunately it’s the most abundant metal in earth’s crust so no problems there.

 

[snorky510238]

Hey mate, Here I can speak only for myself. looking back at my game history, this year I have lost roughly more than I lose in 2 years, playing the exact same games at exactly the same bets.

My most favourite games are (used to be):

300 Shields
On this game, I have got nearly 50 at least 1000x wins received between 2017-18 by playing 700 spins at most per a session. The biggest win was 3900x and the rest of them between 1000x - 2000x.

This year I was playing it in my usual manner and got only 3 or 4 wins. Sometimes even seems like there is no 3 scatters at all in this game and to get a retrigger in the bonus game is impossible.

And if, IF I get to the top stage - it pays a 100x-300x bet, which is very unusual at this game from my personal experience.
I think that big wins and their frequency are clearly reduced.

Montezuma
Again, between 2017-2018 used to be an amazing game to play and leave a casino with a profit in the pocket. Nowadays, it has become complete trash where you can almost instantly determine - play it or leave it.

The frequency of 100x wins on this game is pretty much comparable to 500x in the earlier days.

I also think that there were changes made since the moment these game providers started to work under the SG (Scientific Gaming) brand.

Girls Wih Guns, The Finer Reels of Life, Playboy

I not gonna comment much - here anyone must be a blind horse to not notice a difference at these games behaviour comparing 2017,18 and 2019.

Yes Montezuma used to be a “must play every session slot”. I won so often playing it. Even on a bad day you would still hit some bonuses and when it was hot it could bonus 5 or 6 times in 50 spins.

I regularly had wins up to x 600 but now I can go 100s of spins and never see 1 bonus and extremely rare to hit above x200. It also now has the immediate balance update so you know the outcome before the reels land. I never understand why providers do that.

 

[Guntis]

I hope there is enough aliminium in the world for all the hats needed.

I thought it's better to have a personal belief and opinion than belive anything that written on the wall...

 

[Guntis]

Yes Montezuma used to be a “must play every session slot”. I won so often playing it. Even on a bad day you would still hit some bonuses and when it was hot it could bonus 5 or 6 times in 50 spins.

I regularly had wins up to x 600 but now I can go 100s of spins and never see 1 bonus and extremely rare to hit above x200. It also now has the immediate balance update so you know the outcome before the reels land. I never understand why providers do that.

And did you notice that circle around the multipliers in the bonus game when 2 scatters land? Before it used to show up only after 2 scatters come in, but now that circle shows up first and then 2 scatters land after.

 

[Bloatgoat]

well, im not saying its necessarily easy, but it could be changed under the hood and not change rtp; you could change the volatitiliy and have the same rtp i suppose
@trancemonkey could speak toward how easily that would be to align

Dont think providers are the one to blame for any of this, remember casino's do have a choice wether to select high or lower volatility or even RTP. They can select certain features like a gamble thing or a max bet to be limited.

 

[snorky510238]

And did you notice that circle around the multipliers in the bonus game when 2 scatters land? Before it used to show up only after 2 scatters come in, but now that circle shows up first and then 2 scatters land after.

Yes I noticed that. Why do they change things?

 

[interlog]

Yes I noticed that. Why do they change things?

To make it more rigged.... simples

 

[goatwack]

What is Rigged?

Baby don't hurt me

Don't hurt me

No more

♫

 

[slot_zombie]

Yes I noticed that. Why do they change things?

I don't subscribe to the "casinos are controlling the RTP" stuff, but as posted above the formerly great WMS slots like Rhino/Kronos/Montezuma etc are like totally different games these days - pays have been radically changed, no shadow of a doubt.

Stated RTP hasn't changed, bonus frequency has gone down the toilet, bonuses are worse paying, and the base games are brutal. Quite a feat to do all that and not reduce RTP. I have no idea where it's gone.

 

[goatwack]

It's just clever, nay ingenious maths behind the changes. So if games used to bonus once every 200 spins or so, they've altered that to 1/ 10,000 whilst keeping the RTP the same!

Base game RTP is also slightly different. Sure, it may run at 22% in real-time play, but deep within that clever maths (and dodgy stealth updates) lies the 96% Montezuma, Rhino, or Kronos, just dying to get out!!

Only slight problem is the spins needed to hit the 96% projected figure. We're told it's billions of spins. So ermm, brace yourself for

"A long wait"

 

[Matti]

Fortunately it’s the most abundant metal in earth’s crust so no problems there.

Take a lot of energy to extract it though

 

[snorky510238]

Take a lot of energy to extract it though

Correct.

 

[cncas2123]

Has it ever occurred to the tin foil hatters that CM posters are a miniscule fraction of online players and maybe fall into the non winner categories on the slots? When Casumo post the monthly big wins I know that it is very rare for any of these wins to go into the screenshot threads here on CM.
If those big wins are from one casino each month, how many other casinos are lashing out big wins as well? As we know on any online slot there will be hundreds of losers for each winner, thats the nature of the game.

 

[snorky510238]

Has it ever occurred to the tin foil hatters that CM posters are a miniscule fraction of online players and maybe fall into the non winner categories on the slots? When Casumo post the monthly big wins I know that it is very rare for any of these wins to go into the screenshot threads here on CM.
If those big wins are from one casino each month, how many other casinos are lashing out big wins as well? As we know on any online slot there will be hundreds of losers for each winner, thats the nature of the game.

We are still supposed to be playing slots with a rough rtp of 95% though and they are not all HV. It certainly seems a million miles away from what is stated most of the time.

I think it’s great that @Casumo post the biggest monthly winners. It really looks impressive, sadly I am one of the people who would like to see the top 100 biggest losses per individual in one evening. I bet that would make a few jaws hit the floor.

 

[Luckyscouser45]

Hey mate, Here I can speak only for myself. looking back at my game history, this year I have lost roughly more than I lose in 2 years, playing the exact same games at exactly the same bets.

My most favourite games are (used to be):

300 Shields
On this game, I have got nearly 50 at least 1000x wins received between 2017-18 by playing 700 spins at most per a session. The biggest win was 3900x and the rest of them between 1000x - 2000x.

This year I was playing it in my usual manner and got only 3 or 4 wins. Sometimes even seems like there is no 3 scatters at all in this game and to get a retrigger in the bonus game is impossible.

And if, IF I get to the top stage - it pays a 100x-300x bet, which is very unusual at this game from my personal experience.
I think that big wins and their frequency are clearly reduced.

Montezuma
Again, between 2017-2018 used to be an amazing game to play and leave a casino with a profit in the pocket. Nowadays, it has become complete trash where you can almost instantly determine - play it or leave it.

The frequency of 100x wins on this game is pretty much comparable to 500x in the earlier days.

I also think that there were changes made since the moment these game providers started to work under the SG (Scientific Gaming) brand.

Girls Wih Guns, The Finer Reels of Life, Playboy

I not gonna comment much - here anyone must be a blind horse to not notice a difference at these games behaviour comparing 2017,18 and 2019.

don’t get me started on Montezuma it’s a completely different game shockingly bad these days my biggest win on this prior to extra chilli I don’t go near it any more never lands the scatters for the bonus

 

[Guntis]

It's just clever, nay ingenious maths behind the changes. So if games used to bonus once every 200 spins or so, they've altered that to 1/ 10,000 whilst keeping the RTP the same!

Base game RTP is also slightly different. Sure, it may run at 22% in real-time play, but deep within that clever maths (and dodgy stealth updates) lies the 96% Montezuma, Rhino, or Kronos, just dying to get out!!

Only slight problem is the spins needed to hit the 96% projected figure. We're told it's billions of spins. So ermm, brace yourself for

"A long wait"

These guys from a software development team are not stupid at all - they know exactly what they are doing!. Similar to any other business, their main goal is to make money as much as possible, but in their case by creating games. Regarding those game approval tests, I very doubt if anyone there much worries about it because they know very well - what will get tested and how. At the end of the day, software providers pay their own money to get their games tested and I don't think they would happily pay for a test knowing that it might or will fail.

I reckon this reduced volatility/big win frequency is a new trick that is going on now.

Huh...probably in the new year will have to look for some other (better) entertainment.

 

[Guntis]

We are still supposed to be playing slots with a rough rtp of 95% though and they are not all HV. It certainly seems a million miles away from what is stated most of the time.

I think it’s great that @Casumo post the biggest monthly winners. It really looks impressive, sadly I am one of the people who would like to see the top 100 biggest losses per individual in one evening. I bet that would make a few jaws hit the floor.

I very like Casumo and I like that they post their top monthly wins, but remember that Casumo on average has 1.2 million total and 600K unique visitors every month. These 10, 20 winners are like a drop in the ocean.

 

[Matti]

I thought it's better to have a personal belief and opinion than belive anything that written on the wall...

I have been involved in the industry for 12 years and these tinfoil threads never stop to pop up. No offense but some poster here HAVE A TINFOIL HAT...and nothing I or others will say will convince them otherwise.

Can also say, since I’m a little bit older than most, that all conspieracy theories has gone ballistic since the birth of internet. Now there are so many tinfoils you can meat online that keep the ideas alive. It is to some extent actially frightening...

When I grew up it was wostly about if Elvis was really dead or not

 

[goatwack]

I have been involved in the industry for 12 years and these tinfoil threads never stop to pop up. No offense but some poster here HAVE A TINFOIL HAT...and nothing I or others will say will convince them otherwise.

Can also say, since I’m a little bit older than most, that all conspieracy theories has gone ballistic since the birth of internet. Now there are so many tinfoils you can meat online that keep the ideas alive. It is to some extent actially frightening...

When I grew up it was wostly about if Elvis was really dead or not

So is he?